2017-18 Blaze King Performance Thread PART 2 (Everything BK)

[lsucet]

It’s there on mine when a load has been in for less then a few hours and the stat is turned down enough for no flame, only smoke for the cat to eat. Does not stink up my house, but the stove is covering 3k sqft in an open floor plan. Chances are it gets diluted before being able to detect it walking through the door.

Is good to know. Till now, looks like everything is ok with mine and more important, no family complaint.lol. I just get the hot metal smell sometimes when i burn hot after reloads but i think is normal. Is just hot metal smell like i said, no creosote or smoke smell.

 

[Highbeam]

Is good to know. Till now, looks like everything is ok with mine and more important, no family complaint.lol. I just get the hot metal smell sometimes when i burn hot after reloads but i think is normal. Is just hot metal smell like i said, no creosote or smoke smell.

I wonder if some people can’t differentiate the two. My princess has a slight odor if I put my nose right up to the stovetop over the hinge of the door. I don’t believe it is leaking smoke.

 

[oldbluedeer]

This is one theory I have. Wicking or capillary action, same thing.

The other is the combustion air is blowing the smoke through the pores of the gasket. All that creo in the corners of the glass build up because they are blown there and condense out because of the relatively cool glass and cool combustion air.

The smoke smell might be a combination of the two above hypotheses.

For anybody interested, the fire box never goes into the positive. It never changes pressure substantially as the pressure drop across the cat is nil.
I just proved this by actual measurement. Of course, the cat must not be plugged for this to continue to be true.

Taking a pressure (vacuum) reading at the cat thermometer hole is essentially the same as the firebox.

Thanks for taking the pressure (vacuum) readings.

Do you know if the cat probe location is upstream or downstream from the cat? If it is on the chimney side of the cat, and the cat causes a restriction on the outward flow of smoke, then under certain operating conditions there could be a difference in pressure measured in the cat meter hole and a hole through the ash plug.

I did notice a slight smoke smell coming from the hinge side of my door as well (Sirocco 2.0), and a very slight brown discoloration of the door gasket in that area, but not much. However, I have been running half loads in order to avoid smoke smell in house. Stove's been running about six weeks now since installation.

My current hypothesis is that the iill fitting Duravent adapter, combined with the weld blob on the inner seam of the stove collar (which I saw when installing, should have cleaned up, but didn't) may be the culprit. When the draft becomes high enough, with sufficient smoke in the stove that encounters even a little resistance as it goes through the cat, the chimney may start pulling in room air through the crack/gap in at the stove collar/adapter (because it is the path of least resistance...), and this may have the effect of reducing the effective draft substantially, allowing conditions to be created in the stove that allow a small amount of smoke to exit under the leaky gasket at the hinge side of the door.

Will know for sure just as soon as the Amerivent adapter and extra length of chimney pipe arrive, supposedly by Friday, if the Christmas rush doesn't change that.

 

[estepracing]

I wonder if some people can’t differentiate the two. My princess has a slight odor if I put my nose right up to the stovetop over the hinge of the door. I don’t believe it is leaking smoke.

How often do you clean out your ash, and is it mostly hot coals when you do. I keep thinking I should clean out my ashes but most of it's just hot coals but we can't fit as much wood in there with all the hot coals at the bottom. I didn't know whether to just keep stacking wood in and let the hot coals go to Ash, just seems like shorter burn times but it has been colder...

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

 

[lsucet]

I wonder if some people can’t differentiate the two. My princess has a slight odor if I put my nose right up to the stovetop over the hinge of the door. I don’t believe it is leaking smoke.

Do you think all the BK somehow has the same issue/smell? I will look into it and see if i notice something.

 

[Ashful]

Here's a couple of pictures. First, the final installation. Turned out quite nice. The great thing with the Ashford is the close clearances - it tucks nicely into the corner...here it is with its first fire, warming up my beer after a hard day - that thing is damn heavy!

View attachment 217807

I believe you have an installation problem, here. You did not meet the required clearance to carbonatables (CTC's).

I.e. that beer is too close!

 

[kf6hap]

Do you know if the cat probe location is upstream or downstream from the cat? If it is on the chimney side of the cat, and the cat causes a restriction on the outward flow of smoke, then under certain operating conditions there could be a difference in pressure measured in the cat meter hole and a hole through the ash plug.

It is on the chimney side.

I also checked the pressure drop across the cat. It is nil, nada, near zero under all burning conditions. Taking a reading via the cat hole is the same as taking a reading via a hole in the ash plug. Use 3/16" copper tube.

 

[coutufr]

This is one theory I have. Wicking or capillary action, same thing.

The other is the combustion air is blowing the smoke through the pores of the gasket. All that creo in the corners of the glass build up because they are blown there and condense out because of the relatively cool glass and cool combustion air.

The smoke smell might be a combination of the two above hypotheses.

For anybody interested, the fire box never goes into the positive. It never changes pressure substantially as the pressure drop across the cat is nil.
I just proved this by actual measurement. Of course, the cat must not be plugged for this to continue to be true.

Taking a pressure (vacuum) reading at the cat thermometer hole is essentially the same as the firebox.

I am also pretty confident that this is what’s going on. It is a smell, not smoke. The lower door gasket gets saturated with creo. When you burn hotter, the smell diffuse more. Some people think that burning hotter reduces the smell. I think it doesn’t. It’s just that the convection current of cold room air from the floor rises faster up alongside the stove and this makes the odor less noticeable. Here it is 5 F outside right now, there is no smell at all. The draft is so strong because of the outside temperature that nothing diffuses out.

 

[Highbeam]

How often do you clean out your ash, and is it mostly hot coals when you do. I keep thinking I should clean out my ashes but most of it's just hot coals but we can't fit as much wood in there with all the hot coals at the bottom. I didn't know whether to just keep stacking wood in and let the hot coals go to Ash, just seems like shorter burn times but it has been colder...

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

Ash production is heavily dependent on wood species. I haven't emptied ash at all this year and have been through almost 2 cords of doug fir. There is only about an inch of ash in the stove. It's really quite amazing how douglas fir burns.

Probably more helpful to you would be that I empty ashes when there is just over two inches of ash in the bottom of the 6" deep ash belly of the princess. 2" is about the amount that the ash pan can hold in one load. I do not feel the need to maintain any ash bed in the bottom of the stove since there are two full layers of brick on the base. Every inch of ash you leave in the stove is an inch less wood you can fill it with which directly effects burn times so keep her empty.

No, I don't remove live coals. Just ash. Let the coals burn down between reloads. Turn up the thermostat if you must to quickly reduce the coals in order to fit more fresh fuel in.

 

[Highbeam]

I am also pretty confident that this is what’s going on. It is a smell, not smoke

Almost certainly. I feel the need to bust out the dog butt example again. The smoke smell is like a dogs butthole. It smells like butt if you bury your nose against it but unless he just farted, nothing is leaking! This is a woodstove people, it gets hot and smells hot. Burns dust and dander from your home that has a smell. That rope gasket is coated with stanky creosote on one side and when it gets hot you know you'll smell it on the other side if you try hard enough. Just like the dog's butt.

Now if you are truly leaking smoke then your room will be hazy, smoke alarms will go off, CO detectors might even go off.

I truly hope the above is the case. I can't imagine a stove design so defective that actual smoke leaks out of the firebox.

My pug is the black one!

 

[webby3650]

I wonder if some people can’t differentiate the two. My princess has a slight odor if I put my nose right up to the stovetop over the hinge of the door. I don’t believe it is leaking smoke.

We get calls all the time from people that think they have a gas leak on their Fireplace at the start of the season. It’s simply the dust from all summer burning off, folks can’t differentiate between the smells. Although, if they were familiar with gas they sure could!

 

[AlbergSteve]

I believe you have an installation problem, here. You did not meet the required clearance to carbonatables (CTC's).

I.e. that beer is too close!

I rectified THAT code violation pretty quickly! I'm like the Brits, like my beer a bit warmer...

 

[AlbergSteve]

Had a hot fire going all last night (-18C/0F here right now), the smell is slightly detectable, but I think it's subsiding. Fingers crossed the door alignment did the trick.

I've noticed the stove burns hotter for the same stat setting as it get colder. I guess the cold air really cranks up the draft.
I took some IR readings around the collar, I was up to around 550F at the collar/behind the collar. I can't recall exactly but I think I was cruising around 340F during warmer weather.

Thought I'd try the door alignment as well. Got about 1/16" shift to the left. Then I fluffed and rolled/pushed the thicker bit of inside gasket into the knife groove. The casting actually moves out a bit on the hinge side so it's got to be tight! Been going for an hour now and no smell! I'll report back when I get a few more loads fired.

 

[Dieselhead]

Anyone else have any crazy ideas of inserting a rope gasket inside a solid skin fire resistant tube so creo smell can’t get through? Maybe impregnate a factory gasket with a high temp fire resistant epoxy?

Might not be the product to use, but here’s what I was thinking:

https://www.delcity.net/store/ThermaShield-Tube/p_818139.h_807309

Maybe someone in the industry would be willing to bring something to market with the now widely used low burning EPA stoves and the new models coming out every year.

 

[kf6hap]

Might not be the product to use, but here’s what I was thinking:

https://www.delcity.net/store/ThermaShield-Tube/p_818139.h_807309

I believe you are on the right track but aluminum might corrode out very quickly.

 

[oldbluedeer]

Maybe impregnate a factory gasket with a high temp fire resistant epoxy?

That might do the trick. After the gasket is fully seated and has endured a few burns, take some RTV (assuming it is impervious to air) and paint or smear all exposed surfaces of the gasket, except the groove where the stove seats on the gasket (wouldn't want to glue the stove door shut...). Also put a bead in the groove between gasket and metal on the inside hinge end of the door (in case air had been going under the gasket as someone suggested). If smoke is infiltrating the porous gasket, this should greatly reduce if not eliminate that movement of smokey air.

 

[oldbluedeer]

I wonder if some people can’t differentiate the two. My princess has a slight odor if I put my nose right up to the stovetop over the hinge of the door. I don’t believe it is leaking smoke.

That's easy enough to say if you aren't being bothered by it. People doing the door sniff test are simply trying to discover where the smoke smell is coming from, after smoke smell pervades their house. And it is a fact is some folks on this forum were able to resolve the smoke smell issue by swapping out a bad fitting stovetop adapter, fixing a bad fitting door gasket, or adding a length of chimney pipe. So real it must be, at least for some.

I will resist the temptation to comment on your theory about dog buttholes and smelly stove doors, but that is one hypothesis that I can't imagine anyone personally testing...

 

[Woody Stover]

most of it's just hot coals but we can't fit as much wood in there with all the hot coals at the bottom.

That's where the grated ash system is nice..hot coals stay in the stove, ash goes through the grate for more room in the box. But yes, if your stove is half full of hot coals, you're gonna have to open up the air on 'em and burn 'em down to make room. That should also maintain the current stove top temp or even raise it a bit, which should get you to the next load without house temp dropping a lot.

Maybe impregnate a factory gasket with a high temp fire resistant epoxy?

This is what I did on the Buck 91 ash pan gasket with some black Permatex...before realizing that the air wasn't being pulled through the middle of the gasket, but was getting past the gasket because it wasn't hitting the top edge of the ash pan housing squarely. DOH!

I will resist the temptation to comment on your theory about dog buttholes and smelly stove doors, but that is one hypothesis that I can't imagine anyone personally testing...

You don't know Highbeam that well yet..the lengths to which he will go are nothing short of amazing.

 

[oldbluedeer]

...You don't know Highbeam that well yet..the lengths to which he will go are nothing short of amazing.

Maybe so, but I will resist the temptation to judge my fellow wood stover.

 

[Highbeam]

Maybe so, but I will resist the temptation to judge my fellow wood stover.

I assure you, no pugs were harassed in the writing of that post.

 

[Ashful]

You don't know Highbeam that well yet..the lengths to which he will go are nothing short of amazing.

He calls it like it is, if sometimes brutally and persistently so.

 

[gastone21]

I've got a question and it's a bit more general as opposed to BK specific. We just installed our Princess Insert on 11/10 and it's been running ever since. I've lucked out with getting 2 cords of well seasoned mixed wood (~15% or thereabouts), but I imagine I'll need more now and obviously moving forward. The gentleman I purchased from will sell me a cord of the mixed stuff for $150, and he doesn't have any problem with someone bringing over their moisture meter. There is also a local-ish manufacturer of compressed bricks that sell for $180 per ton. They'll deliver to me two tons for 180*2+50 for delivery, so $410 total. Any thoughts on which would be a better value for me? The wood I can store in my side yard (small city lot), and the bricks I imagine I would have to move into the basement, or store them on my screened in porch.

I've got a friend that will let me remove downed trees from her farm as I want, but I figure I'll still need to get through a few years by paying for cord wood or scrounging off of CL or the like.

Garrett.

 

[redktmrider]

Any thoughts on which would be a better value for me?

The cord wood is cheaper as a ton of good compressed bricks is about equal to a cord of wood, BUT if the cord wood is not <= 20% moisture, I would go with the compressed bricks if it is needed to burn this winter. Just keep in mind all compressed bricks are not of equal quality and make sure there are no glue or binders in them as this can damage the cat.

 

[DuaeGuttae]

I've got a question and it's a bit more general as opposed to BK specific. We just installed our Princess Insert on 11/10 and it's been running ever since. I've lucked out with getting 2 cords of well seasoned mixed wood (~15% or thereabouts), but I imagine I'll need more now and obviously moving forward. The gentleman I purchased from will sell me a cord of the mixed stuff for $150, and he doesn't have any problem with someone bringing over their moisture meter. There is also a local-ish manufacturer of compressed bricks that sell for $180 per ton. They'll deliver to me two tons for 180*2+50 for delivery, so $410 total. Any thoughts on which would be a better value for me? The wood I can store in my side yard (small city lot), and the bricks I imagine I would have to move into the basement, or store them on my screened in porch.

I've got a friend that will let me remove downed trees from her farm as I want, but I figure I'll still need to get through a few years by paying for cord wood or scrounging off of CL or the like.

Garrett.

The cord wood is cheaper as a ton of good compressed bricks is about equal to a cord of wood, BUT if the cord wood is not <= 20% moisture, I would go with the compressed bricks if it is needed to burn this winter. Just keep in mind all compressed bricks are not of equal quality and make sure there are no glue or binders in them as this can damage the cat.

Liberty Bricks are a quality, unadulterated product, so you’re safe there. They’re great if you need a source of dry wood to get you through the winter. We bought some when I tore my rotator cuff and needed not to haul loads of wood into the house. They worked well but didn’t have the high heat output of oak.

With what you quoted, buying cord wood would be cheaper for you. Buy it ahead and let it season. Get through this winter with what you’ve got, but if you need to extend it, and the additional cord wood isn’t dry, go for Liberty Bricks in a heartbeat. I would definitely choose to store them somewhere dry.

 

[Woody Stover]

I've got a friend that will let me remove downed trees from her farm as I want,

You can go out there and find a bunch 6-8" dead-standers with all the bark off...those will be fairly dry already if not ready to burn the day you cut 'em. To go after the bigger fallen ones you need to learn how to identify Oak so you can separate that stuff out from the quicker-drying species like Ash, which a dead one will be pretty dry by fall if you don't split it too big.