I have about 1500 into my set up. Is it ideal? No. But its 3 years old, and I get free wood, so its really worth it to burn wood. I use oil at night, I dont do over night burns. Thats just me. Ive been told my setup is a POS, but it does me just fine.
Financially does burning wood even make sense now or future?
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Not on the epa list. VC may be misleading you by using some sort of fake efficiency figure. I can tell you the true epa certified efficiency, just have to look it up in the chart.
It was -30C a few nights ago. It's much colder now.
Anyway, the power went down in the middle of the night. We didn't even notice until we got up about 4 hours later.
That's worth a lot.
Our gas bills would be HUGE without burning wood. Since the wood is 99% sweat with very little cost, it makes no sense to not.
Last month's NG bill was about $4.50. Plus 30.00 administration and 5.75 federal fuel surcharge (that's the tax on the air we breathe).
Our stove and chimney paid for itself the first year. Easily.
This coming bill will be bigger, as the furnace is running some in the basement. Plumbing, you know. Damn. I hate when it turns on. It's on for about 5 minutes every hour or two now. At -30 something. Going to -40 something tonite. Unfortunately we have a couple of key space heaters going to definitely eliminate any chance of a plumbing problem. Electricity is nightmarishly expensive now.
One down. One to go...
Anyway, the power went down in the middle of the night. We didn't even notice until we got up about 4 hours later.
That's worth a lot.
Our gas bills would be HUGE without burning wood. Since the wood is 99% sweat with very little cost, it makes no sense to not.
Last month's NG bill was about $4.50. Plus 30.00 administration and 5.75 federal fuel surcharge (that's the tax on the air we breathe).
Our stove and chimney paid for itself the first year. Easily.
This coming bill will be bigger, as the furnace is running some in the basement. Plumbing, you know. Damn. I hate when it turns on. It's on for about 5 minutes every hour or two now. At -30 something. Going to -40 something tonite. Unfortunately we have a couple of key space heaters going to definitely eliminate any chance of a plumbing problem. Electricity is nightmarishly expensive now.
One down. One to go...
Okay, just checked, the VC encore made by hearth and home technologies, and is only certified as a 77% efficient appliance. Catalytic, and tested using crib wood.
So, yeah, pretty good but no 83%. Nobody gets 83%. It's like when somebody comes to this forum and claims 4% moisture content wood.
The way I see my setup is it was going to be a fireplace. For all the reasons we all had fireplaces. The stove was just a fireplace homerun replacement. Now years of free heat. And the wood is the same. So I'm way ahead.
That seems reasonable, so what is your thought on why we get 5700 btu's per lb of wood (dry 12-15%) but pellets claim 8,600 per lb?
Caw
Minister of Fire
I think it's pretty simple. Pellets are compressed wood with perfect moisture content being burned under constantly monitored ideal conditions. Cordwood is the total opposite. Its irregularly shaped, not consistently dried, different densities, and involves a human user which brings in more variables.
But cordwood has advantages. It works during power outages (without a generator), it's cheaper, it requires much more simple machines that require less maintenance, and I think it's more romantic/fun.
But cordwood has advantages. It works during power outages (without a generator), it's cheaper, it requires much more simple machines that require less maintenance, and I think it's more romantic/fun.
That’s quite a difference and I would refer to your source for those numbers to see if they are somehow accounting for moisture content. I’ve never heard the low 5700 number for firewood, always up over 8000. The first google search results gave me 8600 btu per lb.
brenndatomu
Minister of Fire
flamontagne
New Member
Whhhat? This is insane. I buy my firewood 120$/cord delivered at my house.
Then do the same math with pellets. I think the issue was not comparing apples to apples.
For me it makes clear financial sense and I am primarily buying my wood cut/split/delivered these days. I spend about $900 on wood per season. I have a very modern gas heating system with panel style radiators, but with LPG at $3.50+ a gallon, it would cost me nearly $3000 heating season to keep my house 10-15 degrees colder if I used only gas. Granted I have to stack and move wood, and I have the space to have my wood stored 2-3 years in advance, but numbers wise there is nothing that would heat my house as well for so little. I only use my heating system when I am away or occasionally in the shoulder season when having a fire is too much.
ctreitzell
Feeling the Heat
For us too, electricity and gas are very expensive which started in 2022...my location is France
Wood burning has cut our electric heating bill down to less than half of what it was before the 2022 price hike. We were spending around €7000 for elec heat for the year; wood supplement has cut it down to around 3K.
During 2021 "cold" season, my wife and I did a lot of research and had decided to go gas in freestanding stove shaped heaters. We bought one and tested it and was "ok" at 3Kw...we were considering getting ne or two for every room.
Because of the war in 2022, gas and electricity skyrocketed in price. My missus told me we have to go wood or pellet, all of France is going that way.
We decided on wood, I had been burning from 2013 thru 2019 to supplement the electric heaters and had about 4 cords stockpiled...but that old Esse stove blasted thru wood with our 35 foot tall chimney flue. (not to mention the dangerous install!)...so we knew we needed a more efficient unit.
We then went to a local "big box" store (like Home Depot) in October and talked with a rather knowledgable rep at the store who suggested a particular Invicta wood burner for our needs. We went home to sleep on it. Next day, went back to that same store and every single woodburner had sold in the morning...there was literally nothing left in that entire town or nearby towns...NOTHING
We panicked because it was well known that no new stock was expected until feb. My missus drove to the nearest big city (1hr drive) and found 3 stoves in total at Castorama, Le Mans. One of those stoves had a form factor very similar to our old Esse. I had stayed home to verify measurements over the phone.
So we were able to install the modern EcoDesign 2022 stove ourselves. I wasn't easy, but we got it installed just in time.
Learning how to use it has been a challenge. I over-fired the whole year last year. Baffle and firebox took a beating. This year I struggled to arrive at a functional method to use it. I've now figured it out pretty well.
So, buying fuel...I have a good amount of wood hitting the ground here annually and some mature trees that are either going to fall or require maintenance. We also have developed a beetle kill problem in this area since recent drought years. I fear some of the majestic big white oaks will start hitting the ground. It isn't enough to feed our wood burner in perpetuity, tho. So we purchase from a local vendor.
In France, wood volume is measured in stairs. My current vendor has a minimum order of 6 stair; currently just over €60 per stair. This vendor only sells oak, beech and ash. So, right around 200 currency units per cord including tax.
He always delivers a lot of beech. I'd say only 60% of each entire delivery has a MC ready for the fireplace; the other 40% needs more curing...old school mix of wet and dry to prolong burn times...which doesn't function well with a modern appliance.
Wood burning has cut our electric heating bill down to less than half of what it was before the 2022 price hike. We were spending around €7000 for elec heat for the year; wood supplement has cut it down to around 3K.
During 2021 "cold" season, my wife and I did a lot of research and had decided to go gas in freestanding stove shaped heaters. We bought one and tested it and was "ok" at 3Kw...we were considering getting ne or two for every room.
Because of the war in 2022, gas and electricity skyrocketed in price. My missus told me we have to go wood or pellet, all of France is going that way.
We decided on wood, I had been burning from 2013 thru 2019 to supplement the electric heaters and had about 4 cords stockpiled...but that old Esse stove blasted thru wood with our 35 foot tall chimney flue. (not to mention the dangerous install!)...so we knew we needed a more efficient unit.
We then went to a local "big box" store (like Home Depot) in October and talked with a rather knowledgable rep at the store who suggested a particular Invicta wood burner for our needs. We went home to sleep on it. Next day, went back to that same store and every single woodburner had sold in the morning...there was literally nothing left in that entire town or nearby towns...NOTHING
We panicked because it was well known that no new stock was expected until feb. My missus drove to the nearest big city (1hr drive) and found 3 stoves in total at Castorama, Le Mans. One of those stoves had a form factor very similar to our old Esse. I had stayed home to verify measurements over the phone.
So we were able to install the modern EcoDesign 2022 stove ourselves. I wasn't easy, but we got it installed just in time.
Learning how to use it has been a challenge. I over-fired the whole year last year. Baffle and firebox took a beating. This year I struggled to arrive at a functional method to use it. I've now figured it out pretty well.
So, buying fuel...I have a good amount of wood hitting the ground here annually and some mature trees that are either going to fall or require maintenance. We also have developed a beetle kill problem in this area since recent drought years. I fear some of the majestic big white oaks will start hitting the ground. It isn't enough to feed our wood burner in perpetuity, tho. So we purchase from a local vendor.
In France, wood volume is measured in stairs. My current vendor has a minimum order of 6 stair; currently just over €60 per stair. This vendor only sells oak, beech and ash. So, right around 200 currency units per cord including tax.
He always delivers a lot of beech. I'd say only 60% of each entire delivery has a MC ready for the fireplace; the other 40% needs more curing...old school mix of wet and dry to prolong burn times...which doesn't function well with a modern appliance.
I'm in a drafty 53 year old cottage here in manitoba on lake winnipeg.my cost for truck ins wood cutting permit and gas works out to 400 for 5 cords of wood.my labor is fine with me as im 69 and the work keeps me from seizing up lol.if I had to heat with electricity it would be 500 a month so the savings are awesome.
Caw
Minister of Fire
$300-400 is very common in the USA. Especially higher population areas. Out in the sticks it's cheaper but in the suburbs and city you'll be paying a premium. That's why I get log length.
Caw
Minister of Fire
No,at,bought that baby new in 07.4×4 has saved my butt endless times.people constantly asking to buy it.120000 miles for 17 years of use,priceless.
Caw
Minister of Fire
Aww I had hoped. Nice truck tho. My father in law has a 2013 with 40,000 miles on it I'm eyeballing if he ever decides to replace it.
I'm one of the last manual lovers left who actually has one for their day to day car. I have a long commute 100 miles a day though and I need to replace it soon. Hoping to find another lightly used manual. Gonna be tough.
My mother has a saying, “can’t never did try and if it did then it didn’t try hard enough”.
All wood can be split with an axe. Some might be harder than others, so that calls for cutting it shorter so it can be split.
Oak, hedge, black locust are all hardwoods. Seems to me that 40-45 years ago a single wedge had no issue splitting wood as big as could be lifted by two guys up onto the splitter. I’ve seen 4 ft oak slid up on, rolled up on, and hoisted by machine up onto out old splitter. Never had a problem. My dad was a great mechanic and my uncle a great welder. Yeah…we tore a few wedges off. Got smarter and better on the welding and smarter with the wood.
Try cutting and splitting standing dead elm and watch the sparks fly off your saw chain. It can still be cut, the fun part is the splitting. NOT! That crap shreds rather than splits, but we still got it done. If at first you don’t succeed, try, try again. Bigger more powerful saws and splitters, sharper axes and shorter wood make for better axe splitting. If you have to split by axe, maybe let rounds sit a couple years, then split them (after they’ve dried a year or two) after they’ve frozen solid…they’ll bust right apart…same for the splitter….better welds on the wedge, more power, shorter pieces…even frozen will bust clean if they’re dry enough and short enough.
Myself, my dad, and my grandpa did this for a living 40-50 years ago. We’re weren’t the first to do it, we wasn’t the last. These days, better saws, better splitters, etc. No excuses! We didn’t have 6 way wedged then although some may have. They’re common today. Use a single wedge in wood that calls for it.
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My situation- Oil furnace, no heat pump. I save about 500 gallons oil by burning wood for the average winter. This fall I purchased 200 gallons of oil at $4.90 per gallon. 500 gallons X $4.90 = $2,450.00! This is the 4th year with my stove, which is already paid for in cost savings alone. My wood costs are minimal except my time, as i scrounge from various sources. Burning wood is definitely saving me coin.
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