brenndatomu
Minister of Fire
I have experimented with room air for the BD, vs air from direct connect OAK...the damper opens less, to do the same job, when using the OAK.
Yes, your stove is over drafting... Blame the ...
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Yes I am sure cooler air does reduce draft a bit more than heated air. But using cool air presents more serious problems in most cases.
Judging by that chart I posted 5-10%. But it wouldn't have to be electronic, a manual flue damper could do the same thing, no?
I do like the idea of electronic control. But fundamentally I'm opposed to barometric dampers, to me almost any other solution is better than that.
brenndatomu
Minister of Fire
I'm sure it does...my comment was directed toward your earlier statement that "it would be just as effective with hot air"
Ok so my statement there wasn't accurate. But heated air will still be very effective and won't cool the fluegases
Can you show us where you got that chart? I really don't think it is referring to what you think it is referring to
It's a chart for natural gas appliances, I can't find one for wood. But gives an approximate idea of heat loss in regards to stack temperature and excess combustion air.
This is very similar to the stack-loss method used to calculate wood stove efficiency.
Combustion Efficiency and Excess Air
Optimizing boilers efficiency is important to minimize fuel consumption and unwanted excess to the environment.
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Yeah that chart is talking about extra air in the combustion chamber for natural gas. Not at all referring to air introduced into the smoke streamIt's a chart for natural gas appliances, I can't find one for wood. But gives an approximate idea of heat loss in regards to stack temperature and excess combustion air.
This is very similar to the stack-loss method used to calculate wood stove efficiency.
Combustion Efficiency and Excess Air
Optimizing boilers efficiency is important to minimize fuel consumption and unwanted excess to the environment.
Yeah I was talking about extra air in the firebox from overdraft, in particular the secondary tubes. Not extra air added to the flue.
But I see where I went wrong, I got mixed up in the mess of posts.
SpaceBus
Minister of Fire
Maybe the better thing to do would be to approach the legislature to try and legalize key dampers for installs that require it. Perhaps make the wording of the law require a certified sweep to come out and do measurements? We are already talking about a niche of a niche, so maybe it doesn't even matter.
would this work if you had an oak kit to install it on?
(broken link removed)
never mind draw through stove would be the same
(broken link removed)
never mind draw through stove would be the same
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FWIW, I notice that the Jotul F500v3 manual specifically recommends adding a butterfly damper to the stovepipe if the draft is strong.
orlkc
Member
I looked at the hearthstone manuals -- same. The older 8022 version talks about installing a damper if the draft measures more than 0.1" wc. I also looked at the newer EPA 2020 version (8024) and I see the same recommendation. The wording changed slightly, but not the overall message.
All stove manuals should include information like this considering how many houses have over 25' chimneys.
BKVP
Minister of Fire
SpaceBus
Minister of Fire
I'm also curious. 20'+ is pretty easy on a two story house. Our cheap little saltbox has a 24' flue so to my perspective they seem common. Most houses I've lived in have been of modest price and also two story. I know objectively that ranch style homes are common and popular, but I have no first hand experience.
It would depend on the region, maybe 50% or more in regions that wood heat? Ranch style houses seem to be a bit more common out west. FWIW, I have never lived in a one-story home except for one cold winter in a shack in New England.
In 1973, one-story homes made up 67% of new-home construction. That declined to 43% in 2006, before reversing course and rising to 46% in 2011, said Stephen Melman, director of economic services for the National Association of Home Builders, citing U.S. Census information.
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I have a two story with two chimneys one is 29'3" the other is 19'3" 29'3" has some over drafting 19'3" is hard to establish a draft with a new fire but that may be the insert.
brenndatomu
Minister of Fire
We have one that is ~27' and one that is ~18'.
Might be interesting to do a poll thread of heights...
<15'
15-20'
20'-25'
25'-30'
30-35'
35'+
Might be interesting to do a poll thread of heights...
<15'
15-20'
20'-25'
25'-30'
30-35'
35'+
So I experimented with my Lope freedom that runs on the 29' chimney last night. We had a few warm days here so I checked door gaskets with a dollar all was good. I then added a second fire brick above the baffles centered in the stove in line with the flu outlet blocking 9" of the smoke path. This stove has a bypass so start up was unchanged after I established a good fire (bypass closed) I started cutting back the air. I noticed the controls are touchier but the fire seemed slow down more at low burn very lazy flame down low but still good secondary's. The secondary flames seemed to linger and swirl more in the fire box more glowing on the secondary tubes. I did notice a little more soot on the window in an odd 3 circular pattern. I reloaded round 9.m. and cut the air back all the way. I reloaded at 4:30 a.m. this morning more coals than normal. a few logs intact just as coals usually they are broke down a lot more. The window seemed vary typical of over night burn some had burnt off from last night but was spread more evenly across the window.
I know this will probably void the UL listing and maybe an EPA violation punishable by death but I do think my burns did extend some maybe 1 hr? The wife says she will let the fire go until I get home "its hot in here" her I deal temp is 80F. The air was fully cut back at 5a.m. I did use a light weight pumice brick I may replace the rest of them in the baffle with pumice type.
I know this will probably void the UL listing and maybe an EPA violation punishable by death but I do think my burns did extend some maybe 1 hr? The wife says she will let the fire go until I get home "its hot in here" her I deal temp is 80F. The air was fully cut back at 5a.m. I did use a light weight pumice brick I may replace the rest of them in the baffle with pumice type.
I agree, that might be interesting to know how it's distributed.
How does one measure that? is it from the floor level the stove is on, or the exit height of the stove? I mean, that's a ~ 2 foot difference, but when you start talking about minimum stack height, that can matter.
brenndatomu
Minister of Fire
How tall is your chimney? A poll...
This came up in another thread...curious how many people have short, normal, or extra tall chimneys... Vote for as many as you have (or use) up to 3.
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