Woodstock Soapstone Progress Hybrid Stove

[HotCoals]

Us BK guys can watch a fire anytime we want.
That said the Progress Hybrid is one nice looking stove.

 

[rdust]

Us BK guys can watch a fire anytime we want.
That said the Progress Hybrid is one nice looking stove.

Leave it up to one of the BK guys to bring up a BK in a PH thread.(well I doubt you're the first even in this thread) Since it's been done already I'll add: flames equals wasted wood for me, the half hour flame show I see when warming up is enough for me.

 

[doug60]

Ive been burning the Progress for about 2 months now. Hasn't been all that cold though. So the jury is still out on its heating capability's
But it is a beautiful piece to look at. I think I have the latest changes that wood stock has made. 12 hour reloads have been the norm.
I had the cook top fail the dollar bill test so wood stock sent be a new one with a stainless heat shield under it. The shield keeps the center stone about 100 /125 degrees cooler than the cast iron next to the flue outlet. I will say it gives a complete burn , nothing but fine ash in the ash pan. Its also seems to be easy on wood consumption. I will update when the real cold weather sets in.

 

[rideau]

Cat flames are ethereal and dance all over the firebox. A lot of the time they are on and then off an instant at a time. They flare and die. They can be on continuously but are separate flames, if that makes snese, as opposed to the rather constant rolling secondaries that you can clearly see being ignited by the air holes in the plate. The Fireview is a cat stove, not hybrid, and one has hours of gorgeous cat flames in the firebox with that stove. When you see flames dancing, and no fire off the logs, and no obvious flames being fired by the secondary holes, you are most likely looking at cat flames. They start shortly after the cat is engaged and the startup fire has died down, normally. They'll be your sole flames until the stove gets hot enough for the secondaries to light. Cat flames at internal temp about 500, secondary flames when the stove is much hotter.

What is hot? Measure the wall temp. You don't likely have anything to worry about. The wall can be a lot hotter than our body temperature before it begins to be of any concern. I don't have a corner install, my stove is pretty darn close to the wall, and I'm amazed how cool the wall is. It's mild enough behind the stove that I put my Uggs there to dry without any concern for the leather...and they are about two inches max from the stove. They don't get hot. On a corner install. perhaps the shield doesn't protect the wall right at the corner, hence the 12 inch clearance requirement. But I doubt your wall is over, say, 150? Anyway, measure the temp, and then, after Christmas, check with Woodstock if they have any concern about whatever your heat level is.

Meanwhile, enjoy the stove over the holidays and don't worry about that tile...certainly isn't hot enough to do any damage in a few days.

 

[Waulie]

Leave it up to one of the BK guys to bring up a BK in a PH thread.(well I doubt you're the first even in this thread) Since it's been done already I'll add: flames equals wasted wood for me, the half hour flame show I see when warming up is enough for me.

I wouldn't want to go up against the PH in a fire show battle, that's for sure. If you don't need much heat, then no flames is fine, but efficiency does not go down in the PH with flames so you are most certainly not wasting wood unless you're getting too hot. Smoldering a load of wood for 24 hours when half as much wood in a night fire would have kept you plently warm for the same 24 hour period is also wasting wood.

 

[rdust]

I wouldn't want to go up against the PH in a fire show battle, that's for sure. If you don't need much heat, then no flames is fine, but efficiency does not go down in the PH with flames so you are most certainly not wasting wood unless you're getting too hot. Smoldering a load of wood for 24 hours when half as much wood in a night fire would have kept you plently warm for the same 24 hour period is also wasting wood.

It's almost January and still haven't burned a cord of wood so I don't think I'm wasting much. Almost have of that was almost pine and I know you don't burn pine. I just tapped into my oak and ash not long ago. It's all silly really it's worse than the chevy vs. ford arguments. Both stoves seem to do a fine job of heating for almost all their users.

 

[Waulie]

It's almost January and still haven't burned a cord of wood so I don't think I'm wasting much. Almost have of that was almost pine and I know you don't burn pine. I just tapped into my oak and ash not long ago. It's all silly really it's worse than the chevy vs. ford arguments. Both stoves seem to do a fine job of heating for almost all their users.

Oh yeah, I completely agree. I was just tallying today, and I still haven't burned a cord either. Getting close though. I'll be there this week. When things like flame = wasted wood get brought up then I have to comment. Just because you are burning with no flames doesn't mean you're not wasting wood and vice versa. If you have an efficient stove and are burning it efficiently, you are not wasting wood unless your house is getting too warm. If someone is not interested in super long smoldering burns and wants a great fireshow, then I think the PH is a great choice.

Burn pine? Gasp.

 

[Machria]

Leave it up to one of the BK guys to bring up a BK in a PH thread.(well I doubt you're the first even in this thread) Since it's been done already I'll add: flames equals wasted wood for me, the half hour flame show I see when warming up is enough for me.

And leave it to ANOTHER BK guy, to comment on another BK guys post, about a BK in a PH thread!

 

[fire_man]

And leave it to ANOTHER BK guy, to comment on another BK guys post, about a BK in a PH thread!

Even Woodstock stopped comparing Blaze King to the Progress. This chart used to show it.

 

[Machria]

Cat flames are ethereal and dance all over the firebox. A lot of the time they are on and then off an instant at a time. They flare and die. They can be on continuously but are separate flames, if that makes snese, as opposed to the rather constant rolling secondaries that you can clearly see being ignited by the air holes in the plate. The Fireview is a cat stove, not hybrid, and one has hours of gorgeous cat flames in the firebox with that stove. When you see flames dancing, and no fire off the logs, and no obvious flames being fired by the secondary holes, you are most likely looking at cat flames. They start shortly after the cat is engaged and the startup fire has died down, normally. They'll be your sole flames until the stove gets hot enough for the secondaries to light. Cat flames at internal temp about 500, secondary flames when the stove is much hotter.

You sure those flames all over the box, mainly coming from the fresh oxygen introduced from the holes in the baffle (aka the secondary air) are not the Secondary flames? From what I know about a catalytic converters(in cars for example), there burn is normally contained within themselves. In fact, I don't think they actually even have real flames..... they just glow red/white hot essentially vaporizing anything and everything that passes thru them which in turn generates more heat and keeps them going. That's why they are self sufficient and do not require any external energy to run other than the energy required to start them since they do need to be real hot in the first place in order to start the process. Hence, the wait for the stove to be 500+ inside prior to closing the bypass on the PH per instructions for example.

What is hot? Measure the wall temp. You don't likely have anything to worry about. The wall can be a lot hotter than our body temperature before it begins to be of any concern. I don't have a corner install, my stove is pretty darn close to the wall, and I'm amazed how cool the wall is. It's mild enough behind the stove that I put my Uggs there to dry without any concern for the leather...and they are about two inches max from the stove. They don't get hot. On a corner install. perhaps the shield doesn't protect the wall right at the corner, hence the 12 inch clearance requirement. But I doubt your wall is over, say, 150? Anyway, measure the temp, and then, after Christmas, check with Woodstock if they have any concern about whatever your heat level is.

The one tile on the door side (right side in my case), just off the top corner of the stove (3rd 12" tile up from floor) is reaching 140 degrees. All tiles surrounding that one are 100 or 110 max, and the others behind above and below the stove are a cool 80. The same tile on the left side, off the left top corner (again 3rd tile up from floor) is reaching 130.

I've got 1/2" slate tiles, 1/4 to 1/2" thinset and 1/2" Durarock Next Gen before the insualation and studs so I'm guessing it's fine. But I will double check with Woodstock. One thing I'm thiking is, this polished slate tile does have metalic material in it as I noticed is very slightly (very so slightly!) magnetic if you put a strong magnet against it, you can feel a bit of magnetance (is that a word?). So I'm wondering of the "metal" in there is attracting a bit of radiant heat...?

Meanwhile, enjoy the stove over the holidays and don't worry about that tile...certainly isn't hot enough to do any damage in a few days.

Oh, I'm enjoying the hell out of it!! See the PH recipe thread in a minute, I'm about to post my Chile recipe with pics, that I made on the PH today while out cutting and stacking another cord of wood.

 

[rdust]

Oh yeah, I completely agree. I was just tallying today, and I still haven't burned a cord either. Getting close though. I'll be there this week.

I just did some figuring which I'm sure isn't 100% accurate but pretty close. 24 ft3 of elm, 22 ft3 of pine and 42 ft3 of oak/ash. I just loaded the garage with a 1/3 cord of oak, ash and a little cherry. Once that's gone I'll top the cord mark. Enough side tracking this thread I'm sure we'll have some "how much have you burned" threads coming up soon enough.

 

[rideau]

Machria, You definitely see cat flames in the firebox. Fireview, for instance, which is a pure cat stove, has lots of the ethereal dancing flames pretty much as soon as the cat in engaged.

 

[lumbering on]

I have a non-cat lopi Leyden and this is only my second month burning. At the end of a burn cycle, for several hours, the wood and Envi-blocks are glowing red hot and the wood appears to be vaporizing instead of burning and I can't see a flame.

This thread has shown me this is normal for a cat stove, but...

Is this normal for a non-cat stove? I'm just afraid of a smoldering fire dirtying up my chimney? Am I doing it right leaving this happen?

 

[rideau]

I have a non-cat lopi Leyden and this is only my second month burning. At the end of a burn cycle, for several hours, the wood and Envi-blocks are glowing red hot and the wood appears to be vaporizing instead of burning and I can't see a flame.

This thread has shown me this is normal for a cat stove, but...

Is this normal for a non-cat stove? I'm just afraid of a smoldering fire dirtying up my chimney? Am I doing it right leaving this happen?

I wouldn't worry. You're not getting smoke at that point, and your chimney won't be getting creosote deposits. You can always open the air a bit to get the coals to brun hotter and faster if you are worried...

 

[Machria]

Do any of you guys load the PH to the brim ever? I've been loading 3 or 4 small/medium splits(mostly small) in each time, and I can then control the burn from an evil devilish roar, down to a no flame smoldering with the air control. What I'm wondering is, what happends when you load it to the brim? Do you still have good control of it? And do you clsoe the door and leave the air open for 10 or 20 minutes to char all the wood....? All this assuming your doing this on a hot bed of coals.

With the amazing amount of heat this thing puts out with a small amount of wood, I must say I'm a bit nervous to load the thing up to the brim, filling all the cracks and letting it rip. I'm wondering if the fact it's so full, with little air space actually helps control the burn by itself....?

 

[fire_man]

Yup I load to the brim all the time - like tonight. I'll load 16" splits to the top then stuff the rest of the space with shorties. The fire behaves perfectly tame. I char the wood for about 5-10 minutes, depending on how hot the stove is before loading.

I have loaded this stove up with bone dry, thinly split Cottonwood, and it still behaves just fine.

I have noticed something Woodstock reported, that if you load TOO little wood, it can be harder to get the Cat to light off.

I still have not loaded it with 22" thickly split wood, It's just not been cold enough yet.

 

[Slow1]

My loads are getting larger each day/week it seems. I don't think I have really stuffed it to the max yet, but I do think I've done some pretty full loads a few times. I have no problems with control related to the size of the load. I do think it runs hotter with a full load, but that does generally make sense given the additional surfaces outgassing all at once. On a large bed of coals with a hot stove (300+ surface) if I do a good size load I shut it down very quickly... as in within a few minutes I have the cat engaged and am bringing the air down to full closed by the 10-15 minute mark in most cases. I wouldn't want to accidentally let a full stove run wide open!

 

[doug60]

I loaded 90 % this morning on 5 inches of coals from a 8 hour burn last night. Stove top 300 . Loaded & engaged cat & shut air down full closed. No flame, cat was doing its thing within minutes, 20 minutes latter stove top 350.

 

[greenbrierwv]

i load to the brim most every time. it is easy to control. like others said, let it char up nice for about 5 or 10 minutes. I keep my air control at about 1/2 so as to not let it get too out of hand. if you leave it wide open it will get crazy with the damper open. once you close it down it is easy to control. go for it.

 

[Ashful]

Even Woodstock stopped comparing Blaze King to the Progress. This chart used to show it.

View attachment 86210

Way off-topic... but I'm confused by that graph. How does a big cast iron stove like the Jotul Firelight 600 rate so incredibly low on max BTU/hr., while a soapstone stove marketed so strongly for its ability to moderate temperature swings, rates so high on max BTU/hr. for an EPA test load?

 

[rideau]

Way off-topic... but I'm confused by that graph. How does a big cast iron stove like the Jotul Firelight 600 rate so incredibly low on max BTU/hr., while a soapstone stove marketed so strongly for its ability to moderate temperature swings, rates so high on max BTU/hr. for an EPA test load?

Well, the PH is a big soapstone/steel/cast iron stove that weighs something like 700 pounds. It does burn at a very steady temperature for a long time, and does keep the home very comfortable. You can feel it start to cool down a few degrees in the last few hours of the burn. The design of the PH, the combined burn technologies, the air path, the large cat, and the angle of the secondary burn plate combined with the large glass all contribute to the outstanding BTUs produced AND THROWN THROUGH THE WINDOW INTO THE ROOM AS HEAT. This stove burns every load down to an almost white powder. Very efficient. Yes, the soapstone stores and radiates heat, but far more heat is radiated out the window that from the stove itself. So, alos, when the stove starts to cool down, you feel the difference in the output...still radiating heat through the soapstone, but less heat out the window.

The PH represents a new technology, and Woodstock worked really hard to produce a fairly small stove that would efficiently heat a large and/or challenging space. They worked hard to get those BTU's, and succeeded.

Did you see the graph for the BTUs throughout the burn on the test burn? Have not seen Jotul's, but I'm sure it is steady like Woodstock's are. Yours is a great stove, and has lots of mass.

 

[Machria]

This stove burns every load down to an almost white powder.

Ain't that the truth! The few times I let the stove burn completely out, mainly with my 1st few small seasoning fires, I thought somebody snuck into my house and cleaned out my stove! It left me scratching my head.... What the heck? Where did the ashes and coals go? I opened the ash pan and it had a dusting it in. The second time it occurred, no kidding I asked my wife if she cleaned out the stove or something which would be really odd since she won't touch it yet. It really does burn EVERYTHING.

 

[Machria]

Hey guys,
Other than shuting the air all the way down, what are some of the ways of keeping the heat output as low as possible, and the burn time long on the PH?

Large splits, pack them in with little air..., only load on small coal bed, don't burn/char them very long .... missing anything?

 

[Slow1]

Hey guys,
Other than shuting the air all the way down, what are some of the ways of keeping the heat output as low as possible, and the burn time long on the PH?

Large splits, pack them in with little air..., only load on small coal bed, don't burn/char them very long .... missing anything?

I'm thinking the larger splits may be one of the best things to try as my minimal experimentation seems to indicate this can make a large difference. Also as odd as it seems, I seem to get better (longer) burns with a larger base of coals at the start. I'm not sure I can explain why yet, but perhaps it allows for a more rapid cat engagement and shutdown.

 

[Machria]

Do you guys notice a great deal of heat, by far the peak of heat output is around the 3/4 to 7/8ths mark of the burn? In otherwords, I seem to get the most heat output, actually too much heat output, at toward the end of a burn when there is a large bed of red hot coals burning. 4 or 5 or so inches of red hot cols cover the entire bottom of the stove, all glowing red hot, that seems to be when I get a real blast of heat for an hour or two. I know since it's near the end of a long burn, the house and room is very wam, everything in the house is warmed up, the stove is warm, the heart stones are all warm, the walls are warm.... so maybe this all explains it? OR do you all see a rise in output at this stage?