Wood gun, vigas, econoburn recommendation

[Jbdpayne]

Hey everyone, so ive talked it over with the wife. Obviously with the current market we are definitely upgrading the boiler hopefully this summer. I priced heating oil yesterday at $4.15/gal outside the Pittsburgh area if buying 400+, and today they removed pricing completely. Fortunately i stocked up prior, and have about 1400 gallons for next year thats treated. With that said, i have a little time but want this in place by next fall. i am leaning toward the wood gun or econoburn (would prefer the WG but depends on finances). I like the setup, we plan on running thermal storage in the near future and the ease of getting parts. I talked to AHS today and they mentioned the e210 will hopefully be available in the next 2 months which should qualify for the tax credit though i still may stick to the old school e100 or e140. With that being said, i also found a 2008 model e180 stainless. For whatever reason its badge rated it at 150k btus vs the newer 180k btus. Its in immaculate shape, includes the smoke hood and piping/controls/expansion tanks/ extra motor and refractory, but the gentleman at AHS had zero knowledge of those older models making less btus. Anyone think itd be TOO big for our home based on the rating? Im at just shy of 3000 sq feet. I know its probably too big but 150k btu was the kax i was planning to go. The price was def there so i wanted a second opnion of course. I appreciate all of the input everyoje has given!

 

[airlina]

Like you ,what prompted my Econoburn purchase was the rise in oil prices in 2008 to near 5 bucks a gallon. Didn't ever want to be at the whim of the markets again and though the initial purchase price is a tough pill to swallow , since my install in 2009 , i can rest assured that I can heat my house with my own fuel supply. Self reliance equals peace of mind. With storage a boiler is never too big if you get it a a good price, because all you are doing is basically is heating your storage to be used when you want it.

 

[muncybob]

What Gas said....and, this year I've had next to no "huffing" w/o any additional equipment from AHS. Perhaps it's due to mainly dry oak being burned this year? By dry I mean it has been aged 3+ years, I haven't actually tested it.

 

[Jbdpayne]

Going to roll with the used e180. For financial reasons and it was confirmed stainless. Its plumbed in properly as well, so im confident we will get our money out of it. Looks like it has the spare refractory, motor, bearings, door seals, etc. Unit is imaculate as well, only thing being older is it does not have the air diverter so i will be buying that based on everyones review to help with the huffing and puffing

 

[muncybob]

Good luck with it.

 

[Wisconsin woodburner]

Hey everyone. I was looking into possibly fixing up my old 1984 burnham, but after consideration we want to look at a few other units. While we wont recieve the tax credit, i narrowed it down to wood gun, econoburn, and a vigas indoor boiler based on location and reviews poeple have had on here.
The vigas, i talked to mark at Ahona, super nice guy. He recomended the 40kw which is about $9500. I also found a gentleman selling that model that he bought but did not install due to back problems, along with a 300gal thermal storage for $6k. Thats a great price, but im concerned with Mark being the only dealer, ill be SOL long term if he retires and i need a part.

The econoburn, i talked to Greg and he recommended the 100kbtu to 150kbtu model. They are also pushing $9500-$10k. Being only a few hours away is nice, seems like peopke have never had big issues with them. Going to be a PITA getting it moved weight about 2000lbs but aside from that also a consideration.

Lastly is AHS's wood gun. Talked to Jeff and Nate there and both also good people. They are just shy of 3 hours from me. Seems like an overall good unit, but there are carbon and stainless models for these. Again, they recommend the e100 model pushing 100k btus, the carbon steel is $9500 and the stainless is $12500. My biggest question, is the SS model really worth the extra cost? I know you get what you pay for, but wondered if folks have really had issues over time with the carbon model. Would also be getting the smoke hood if i went that route. Also have a local with a 5 year old e140 carbon in great shape asking $6k.

Just curious what everyone thinks. I think the vigas is a fantastic deal, but the long term has me worried about parts like i mentioned. Aside from that id lean more towards the wood gun, just wasnt sure on that price. Any recomendations or info is greatly appreciated here!

We have an Econoburn 200 indoor unit. Bought it because of the efficiency rating and 25 year warranty on the pressure vessel. After burning 10 cords per winter for 12 years the pressure vessel is leaking water into the upper burn chamber. Called Econoburn and they will not honor their 25 year warranty. So much for peace of mind on the big stuff. Boiler was very efficient, although smoke indoors was a regular problem when loading wood.

 

[brenndatomu]

We have an Econoburn 200 indoor unit. Bought it because of the efficiency rating and 25 year warranty on the pressure vessel. After burning 10 cords per winter for 12 years the pressure vessel is leaking water into the upper burn chamber. Called Econoburn and they will not honor their 25 year warranty. So much for peace of mind on the big stuff. Boiler was very efficient, although smoke indoors was a regular problem when loading wood.

What was the excuse...they don't warrant the firebox for 25 years?

 

[Wisconsin woodburner]

What was the excuse...they don't warrant the firebox for 25 years?

They said the warranty covers defects in workmanship and materials and those problems only show up in the first 10 years. Since we used it for 12 years, they said the leaking is caused by normal wear and tear, not the things they cover. It was very clear during our conversation they had no intent on honoring the warranty. Asked if they would offer us a reduced price on a new one and were told NO.

 

[salecker]

Where is the leak?
There was a member that had his leak from steel erosion on the face below the door.
I am going into year 14 on my Econoburn 200, although mine sounds solid where that one was leaking.
It would be nice to know where to look for problem areas.

 

[Wisconsin woodburner]

The leak is on the right side as you look into the box, about 4" up from the bottom of the box. I was doing a final cleaning at the end of the season and noticed the ash in the upper chamber was wet.I left both doors open overnight. The next morning I had water on the floor.

 

[salecker]

Not the same place as the other leaker...
Yours sounds like a better place to try and fix.
Are you running storage with it?

 

[Wisconsin woodburner]

No storage.

 

[salecker]

Thanks
That could be a part of the issue, at least it gives me hope that mine is still OK because of storage.
I guess i will explore with a hammer and see if i can confirm that mine is still solid in the firebox
What are you plans? Going to try and find a welder that can fix it for you?

 

[Wisconsin woodburner]

At this point I think ours is going to be retired. The water has to be coming from the copper tubing that surrounds the firebox so repairing the steel wall will not stop the leak. When I shut off the water supply to the boiler, everything dried up in a couple days. We are not quite sure where to go from here. Definitely will not be looking at econoburn again.
The propane fueled boiler we use in spring and fall is about 40 years old, so we could gain some efficiency by replacing that unit, but I am hesitant to move away from wood. Open to suggestions or recommendations.

 

[maple1]

At this point I think ours is going to be retired. The water has to be coming from the copper tubing that surrounds the firebox so repairing the steel wall will not stop the leak. When I shut off the water supply to the boiler, everything dried up in a couple days. We are not quite sure where to go from here. Definitely will not be looking at econoburn again.
The propane fueled boiler we use in spring and fall is about 40 years old, so we could gain some efficiency by replacing that unit, but I am hesitant to move away from wood. Open to suggestions or recommendations.

Copper around the firebox?

 

[salecker]

Copper around the firebox?

You bet me to it...
I have no copper surrounding the firebox on my Econoburn 200 ,
Could you either explain that copper around firebox or take pictures.
The fire box contains water.If you have a leak in the firebox you can repair it, and yours sounds like a lot easyer place to repair than the other one that was posted this past heating season.

 

[Wisconsin woodburner]

Thanks for the help. I assumed there was copper tubing within the wall of the firebox. As long as it is steel, I will look into welding a plate over the compromised area.

 

[salecker]

Personally i would be doing a little exploring to see what caused the crack or leak.
The Econoburn repair that was shared last winter showed erosion on the inside of the steel in the water jacket side.
I would clean the burning chamber out and wire brush the steel then carefully sound it out around the leak with a hammer to see if it sounds feels weak around the leak.
Then depending on the location and the welder...
I would want to cut out a section if possible and replace it.
Welding a patch over the leak seems a little more of a band aid solution.
I would also be thinking of adding storage, as it cuts down the hot/cold cycles on the boiler.

 

[Wisconsin woodburner]

Thank you. Sure appreciate all the information being shared here!

 

[maple1]

Personally i would be doing a little exploring to see what caused the crack or leak.
The Econoburn repair that was shared last winter showed erosion on the inside of the steel in the water jacket side.
I would clean the burning chamber out and wire brush the steel then carefully sound it out around the leak with a hammer to see if it sounds feels weak around the leak.
Then depending on the location and the welder...
I would want to cut out a section if possible and replace it.
Welding a patch over the leak seems a little more of a band aid solution.
I would also be thinking of adding storage, as it cuts down the hot/cold cycles on the boiler.

Actually, wouldn't storage add to the hot cold cycles? Without it, you are keeping a fire going all the time. So it would stay hot all the time. Vs with storage, e.g. mine is only actually burning 6 hours a day.

Of course that comes with the smoldering penalty and increased corrosion from increased creosote.

 

[Highbeam]

They said the warranty covers defects in workmanship and materials and those problems only show up in the first 10 years. Since we used it for 12 years, they said the leaking is caused by normal wear and tear, not the things they cover. It was very clear during our conversation they had no intent on honoring the warranty. Asked if they would offer us a reduced price on a new one and were told NO.

That’s some lousy customer service. Why even offer a 25 year warranty if ever failure past 10 is normal?

 

[brenndatomu]

Why even offer a 25 year warranty if ever failure past 10 is normal?

Sounds good, and sells boilers!

 

[salecker]

The 25 year thingy gave me a warm fuzzy feeling when i bought my Econoburn
Then the truth started ozzing out in these forums
Great info on here, if you take the time to read

 

[brenndatomu]

The 25 year thingy gave me a warm fuzzy feeling when i bought my Econoburn

There is only a select few wood burner manufacturers (of any type) that actually stand behind their long term firebox warranty...most have "slick willy" fine print that they lean on heavily

 

[salecker]

Everything has the Slick Willy fine print these days...
That's one of the reasons i have a heating system 100 ft from my house
i don't have to worry about insurance fine print,or monthly payments for a warm fuzzy feeling