Wood gun Operation questions

[WoodGun-Mike]

Here ya go

http://greenftechn.com/downloads/WoodGunManual.pdf

That is an older version of the manual. Use this link instead:

(broken link removed to http://www.alternateheatingsystems.com/downloads/WoodGunManual.pdf)

 

[Buzz Saw]

On average what do you guys spend on yearly operating/maintenance costs?
Anything profoundly unexpected?

 

[muncybob]

Center brick need to be replaced every 15 to 20 cords, so not exactly a yearly cost but for me that's about every 3 years(I could stretch it to 4 but I prefer to be safe) so I guess it would equate to about $35/yr. Just replaced fan bearing after 6 years, if you do it yourself it's a minimal cost. I had my mechanic friend use his pullers and cost me about $30.....so that's $5/yr. I guess about $125/yr to clean the chimney or buy a SootEater and do it yourself(which is what I do). I can't think of any other recurring costs to run it.

 

[pblormis]

In six years i replaced the motor 3 times one was under warranty have one for backup running Marathon jet good motor replaced center brick 2 times need new ones now but to cheap so using fire brick. door gaskets two times I have a short flue used just black stove pipe had to replace this year.Had to buy insulation board for motor plate a few years back. And some boiler control for PH some maybe a total of $260.00. in six years that's not bad. not looking forward to replacing refractory as that cost will be some big $$ but still good for?? year's

 

[Buzz Saw]

In six years i replaced the motor 3 times one was under warranty have one for backup running Marathon jet good motor replaced center brick 2 times need new ones now but to cheap so using fire brick. door gaskets two times I have a short flue used just black stove pipe had to replace this year.Had to buy insulation board for motor plate a few years back. And some boiler control for PH some maybe a total of $260.00. in six years that's not bad. not looking forward to replacing refractory as that cost will be some big $$ but still good for?? year's

Changed the motor 3 times? That seems excessive. Are you running it really hard & really long?

Is the motor a standard off the shelf that can be bought at Grainger?

Anyone else replacing motors this much?

 

[pblormis]

The first motor just quit the winding went bad i was going to have it rebuilt but the place where i took it to said it would be cheaper to buy new one glad it was under warranty by motor company they replaced it. The second one the inside switch was bad.i could hear it going as the motor start up so knew i had to do something ask AHS if they used a diff motor told me about the Marathon jet. Kind of glad as i live in the town where they are made. As far running hard a few winter 6 to 7 cord. This winter not much at all. three cord so far with the temps every other week in the sixty and seventy no need to run. I almost feel guilty about that.

 

[muncybob]

Would be interested to know how you used fire brick for the nozzle? Did you replace the rope door gaskets or did you continue using the rubber type? AHS strongly recommends using nothing but SS for the piping.

 

[pblormis]

I used rope for all the door gaskets cheap and an easy to replace. My total pipe flue is 2 four foot black pipe 2 elbows rain cap sealed with high temp . it is a little over 7 foot on the inside of building that is insulated so flue temps good at 230 to 270. As for the fire brick cut to fit side brick ledges drill holes in center of brick to the size of the nozzle you buy from AHS used 2200 deg bricks takes three and a small piece for mine. I know they will not last forever but very inexpensive and easy to do, took less than an hour to make and install. i will be casting my own for next year

 

[krinkov]

i made fire bricks for the essex 1000 when i had it.the woodgun bricks will not be as hard to make.

 

[mark123]

I have a E180 and I find it a constant battle to keep everything sealed up in terms of smoke leaking out. I have the boiler in the basement in a very well sealed boiler room (exterior door with weather stripping between boiler room and living area, spray foam for all water and wire passages etc...) with walk out garage door. I recently discovered that by leaving my smoke exhaust hood on 24 hrs/day and keeping the boiler room at a very slight vacuum all hints of the smell are gone from the rest of the house. I have a fresh air intake so this does not affect the burning process. I find the high temp orange silicone has burnt off several times and in my opinion is an extreme fire hazard. My wife went into the boiler room to see big flames from the burning silicone. I made the entire smoke pipe from tig welded 16 gauge stainless but I have to come up with a better solution where it enters the brick. Also I need to come up with a better intake pipe system, I am currently using 6" metal ductwork and screwed and duct taped but several times this has blown apart due to the explosions upon hot gasses igniting at startup. I was thinking 5 or 6" PVC possibly with glued elbows. I have included a pic of the silicone after it has burnt, it turns white and flakes away like powder. I find this has happened after closing the the intake damper to stop the chugging, this leads to a rich burn that sends unburnt charcoal bits into the flue, this collects and burns in the smoke pipe reaching extreme temperatures. In the pic my 6" pipe is approx 6" inside the 7" and the space between is stuffed with rope gasket and high temp silicone but eventually the silicone burns or detaches and the smoke still leaks out when it starts chugging. As for the center fire bricks, I have been making them from 5/8" thick steel and they last about a year, I then fill in the eroded areas with my mig welder and they are good for another year.

 

[infinitymike]

I have replaced the silicone gasket for the front load door, after 4 winters of heat/dhw and 2 summers of dhw, it was very deteriorated.

I replace the center bricks with OEM bricks but want to try and cast my own, I like the idea of using firebricks and retro fitting them.

I just purchased 4 of the side refractories, 2 of the 8" pieces and 2 of the 4" pieces.
They are for the rear of the firebox, which have really deteriorated, in fact the 4" one blew a hole in the side of it, so now the gasification tube is open to the side tubes.
I did parge high temp cement around the deteriorated areas, but now that there is a complete hole from one side to the other, I think its time to replace them.
I also want to cast these for future replacements.

i made fire bricks for the essex 1000 when i had it.the woodgun bricks will not be as hard to make.

Did you cast them? What cement/concrete did you use? What did you use as a form?

I was thinking of make a 2 part steel form, that I can also apply pressure to squeeze the cement.

 

[Fred61]

Mark, Are you sure you didn't plagiarize some of my previous posts about my Wood Gun experiences? Looks like a smaller sample of what I had posted in the past. I had the same problems plus a few more.

Mike. You haven't put enough wood through your unit to cause that amount of wear. That's basically the whole guts of the unit. Have you pressed AHS to cover it under warranty? That short circuits the flame path and actually could be rendered unsafe. They should stand behind it. They're probably holding their breath right now, hoping you won't take them to task on it. I'm sure they know that either they used inadequate material or that there is a design flaw.
I was starting to worry about my refractory deteriorating and what to do about it but my unit died of another ailment first.

 

[muncybob]

Mark, the only time I ever had a fire in my pipe was trying to stretch another season out of the center brick. Since then I keep an eye on the brick and if it is even close to needing replacement in the upcoming season I just go ahead and replace in the autumn, seems to be about e/o year....no problem since. My pipe is also sealed with a combination of welds and high temp silicone and no leaks. I pop off the end cap of my pipes each month to clean out the ash accumulated in my 8' horizontal run to the chimney and have yet to see any evidence of coals. I also replaced all door seals with rope gasket covered in high temp silicone.

Short cycles will vary from one user to the next depending on the need. I've been fortunate I guess in that I rarely have a backfire and they are normally fairly mild...could not have said that in my 1st season, this was part of the learning curve for me.

 

[infinitymike]

Fred,

I've pushed close to 45 cord of cord wood through the unit for winter heat and 15 cord of pallet wood for DHW in the summer.
I've burned for 5 winters and 3 summers. My house sucks heat and the unit is running quite often. I go through 3 fireboxes in a 24 hour period on an average winter day. I'd hate to think how much I'd burn if I had this same house in a colder climate.

My feeling is that I burn about 85% red oak which is known to be very corrosive and who knows if the pallet wood is treated with anything and what corrosiveness that may have.
Also, for the first 3 winters, I burned extremely small splits, which caused a lot of off gassing and the inability for the unit to keep up with that gassing and therefor causing a very incomplete burn with lots of dark gray smoke. So, I'm sure the incomplete burn also sent lots of corrosive exhaust through the refractories.
Last winter the splits were a bit bigger but still not big enough, this winter...zero problems with the monsters I shoved in there.
I could barely fit 5 splits in the firebox, where as before I was packing in 15-18 splits. No huffing, no smoke, a very complete burn with high gasification temps and low stack temps.

I have a good relationship with AHS and they have stood by me through all of my "issues", with countless hours of conversations and even a few free parts. They did give me a nice discount on the refractories from their listed pricing, as well.
The refractories aren't under any real warranty since they are a normal wear item, kinda like tires on a car.
I have the EPA plug in that tube which won't allow any thing to be pulled down that tube, so I am not concerned with any short circuiting of the flame.

Bottom line, a lot of my "issues" were caused by me and my lack of understanding.

 

[krinkov]

hey mike.thanks for the you tube videos.kind of handy to watch since i bought a 140 a year ago.

 

[infinitymike]

Also here is a pic if of my splits. Based on my reading they are probably smaller than they should be.

View attachment 175139

WAY TO SMALL.

Heres what I used to burn compared to what I split last and I'm even splitting bigger this year.

 

[infinitymike]

hey mike.thanks for the you tube videos.kind of handy to watch since i bought a 140 a year ago.

Thank you, just trying to educate people so they can learn from my mistakes.

What products did you use when you made you refractory bricks. Will you use the same stuff if you make them for the WG?

 

[krinkov]

mike. i used hi cast 45. alsey.com.got the mix from the local block plant.55lbs was 45.00-50.00.i let them dry for a week then put the blocks in a old oven i had in the shop.

 

[infinitymike]

mike. i used hi cast 45. alsey.com.got the mix from the local block plant.55lbs was 45.00-50.00.i let them dry for a week then put the blocks in a old oven i had in the shop.

How long have they lasted?
What did you use for a mold? Plywood?
Did it release well?

 

[krinkov]

i used plywood. 1/4 for the round parts then 3/4 for the rest.then screwed the form together.pvc pipe for the center hole.coat the form with oil.you can take the pvc out or let them burn out.i would get a year with the center bricks.i think when ahs the bricks are baked at 1900 degrees.that makes them last longer.

 

[redryder2006]

Just an update: since last time I've set my low temp shut down to 160 and my high limit at 190. I also have been burning just one fire overnight to warm the house up. I have set the thermostat at its max so the fire burns until it runs out of fuel at which point the house is warm. I have not cleaned the flue pipe since last post but I have made a habit of cleaning the center tube and the firebox of any loose ash much more often. I also have my wood for next year in log length so I plan on cutting much bigger rounds/splits.

 

[Foreston WoodWorker]

I'm looking at the E180 or E250 any direction and info would be helpful. I did read several posts on it.

 

[WoodGun-Mike]

Just an update: since last time I've set my low temp shut down to 160 and my high limit at 190. I also have been burning just one fire overnight to warm the house up. I have set the thermostat at its max so the fire burns until it runs out of fuel at which point the house is warm. I have not cleaned the flue pipe since last post but I have made a habit of cleaning the center tube and the firebox of any loose ash much more often. I also have my wood for next year in log length so I plan on cutting much bigger rounds/splits.

This is fine, but should not be necessary to eliminate creosote. Some additional things to check: Make sure adequate makeup air is available. Some folks' boiler rooms are way too tight! Let the room leak or duct outside air in. Check return water temps. Well performing Wood Guns will be fine at 140, but I've seen folks running a lot lower with poor to very bad results. Monitor stack temps as another way to see what's going on. You should see 300 degrees. AHS makes a 2 slot Center Brick that allows for more air flow. Don't hesitate to reach out for support.

 

[WoodGun-Mike]

I'm looking at the E180 or E250 any direction and info would be helpful. I did read several posts on it.

I can put you in touch with users. Make sure you have the load to make them work. The E180 and E250 are commercial models, and must be purchased as such, unless you're looking for used. AHS will build an E200 for commercial use, if that is the best fit.

 

[Foreston WoodWorker]

I heat 3 different buildings. Shop, finish room, garage and home so have some pretty serious square ftage to deal with.
Would appreciate some user's to connect with. Mike from AHS gave me 3 connections here in MN. but more is better.
I'm concerned with the fire brick life?