why 2 year old/seasoned wood for BK?

[DUMF]

Finally, it's a hobby. Instead of processing fuel you could be out at a bar causing mischief and spending money.

Now one minute, maybe a "hobby" for you, but for many it's a lifestyle, a sustainable, renewable, and enjoyable way to manage heating your home,
managing a large woodlot, getting the satisfaction of a learned skill, and, and building a body "many ways". Yes, it is work; we sweat getting the butts out of the woods. It can be fun to bust your a$$, as we do in sports. It is hard skilled work dropping trees, then processing our fuel for the season. "Hobby", no.
Hey, for you perhaps secondary recreation, perhaps the show of using a 'green' resource, but a "hobby". Not. You projecting about these bars ?

Boy, this thread has gone viral: guns, "the wife", mischief. Give me a break.
Let's get back to seasoning.

 

[bholler]

For me it is not a hobby or a lifestyle it is just how I heat my house for the most part. Now the fact that I make a living working on chimneys makes that aspect of it kind of a lifestyle I guess.

 

[2fireplacesinSC]

It does seem to have left the tracks. Nonetheless it's still funny.

I didn't mean to create such a ruckus but it does make me realize I need to be careful kicking the BK hornet's nest.

Hey, I'm just happy to get more than one or two responses for a post.

 

[drz1050]

I also consider it a hobby... a hobby can be a very serious endeavor. To me, hobby just means I do it, but not for a living. If it was my profession, it would no longer be a hobby. A hobby and lifestyle can be one and the same. I'm big into motorcycles.. that's most definitely a lifestyle, but I still consider it a hobby.

 

[firefighterjake]

Choo-choo . . . this train is off the tracks.

 

[DUMF]

Choo-choo . . . this train is off the tracks.

It's a crash.................choo-choo doubles Jake !

 

[mwhitnee]

For the record, my previous point was that my BK stove worked perfectly well with wood that was not seasoned as BK suggests. I'm not knocking BK's recommendation because obviously their stoves will perform better with properly seasoned wood. Just as any other stove would.

I am very lucky I chose the stove I did and was not scared away about the whole MC thing. If I knew what I did now I wouldn't have spent so much time with the cat/non cat question.

 

[2fireplacesinSC]

thank you. that's very good to hear about the MC issue. Now I've just got to see if I can change my mantle/fireplace enough to get clearance.

 

[tarzan]

I am very lucky I chose the stove I did and was not scared away about the whole MC thing. If I knew what I did now I wouldn't have spent so much time with the cat/non cat question.

When I was stove shopping for my first epa approved wood stove in 2010 I went with a tube stove because of all the talk of how cat stoves were unforgiving when it came to dry wood. I had my wood ready but convinced myself that it may not be "cat stove" ready. Fast forward a few years and I get three years ahead on wood and my first cat stove. A BK Princess. Only to find out it was more tolorant than the tube stove I had.

I'm convinced that burning dryer wood should lead to longer cat life but as far as the stove burning moist wood within reason, it's not going to let you freeze.

 

[Highbeam]

When I was stove shopping for my first epa approved wood stove in 2010 I went with a tube stove because of all the talk of how cat stoves were unforgiving when it came to dry wood. I had my wood ready but convinced myself that it may not be "cat stove" ready. Fast forward a few years and I get three years ahead on wood and my first cat stove. A BK Princess. Only to find out it was more tolorant than the tube stove I had.

I'm convinced that burning dryer wood should lead to longer cat life but as far as the stove burning moist wood within reason, it's not going to let you freeze.

And really, a cat will need to be replaced because it gets worn out much sooner than it would by physical damage from burning slightly high mc wood. Fresh cats are awesome. They're not THAT expensive and when you're getting 80% efficiency vs. 60? From a noncat, your wood savings will pay for a new cat pretty fast.

 

[mwhitnee]

And really, a cat will need to be replaced because it gets worn out much sooner than it would by physical damage from burning slightly high mc wood. Fresh cats are awesome. They're not THAT expensive and when you're getting 80% efficiency vs. 60? From a noncat, your wood savings will pay for a new cat pretty fast.

Bingo. Lol

 

[bholler]

Ok highbeam what stoves are you talking about that are only 60%? Yes cats are more efficient than tube stoves but not that much more. And yes wet wood will lead to premature cat failure. Steel cats are better but it will still hurt them. Another thing to consider is that if you are using wet wood and need to leave the bypass open longer to get the cat active there goes your increase in efficiency.

 

[BKVP]

Ok highbeam what stoves are you talking about that are only 60%? Yes cats are more efficient than tube stoves but not that much more. And yes wet wood will lead to premature cat failure. Steel cats are better but it will still hurt them. Another thing to consider is that if you are using wet wood and need to leave the bypass open longer to get the cat active there goes your increase in efficiency.

These are not accurate statements, much has changed.

1). Google EPA approved stoves. The efficiency numbers that were bogus on the EPA web site are now, as of May 15th 2015, only HHV (higher heating value) efficiencies. The difference is average 9-11% between catalyst equipped and none catalyst equipped. If 9-12% isn't much, then you are correct.

2). DuraFoil cats failures have nothing to do with moisture content. The fact is the galva alumina wash coat will flatten out and the combustor will be less effective if the cat reaches 1600 degrees Fahrenheit. Ceramic substrates are in fact more likely to be damaged from thermal shock, which can result from excessively wet wood being dumped into a hot fire.

2). You should NOT leave the by pass open to deal with wet fuel. Studies done by the two leading cat stove companies show a greater tolerance in moisture content that perhaps you might realize. We recommend 18-22% because the result is less combustion moisture bonding with particulate to form creosote. We tell folks all the time that the moisture in the fuel load it greatly reduced in the first few hours of the combustion process, regardless of technology. By loading the stove and then operating the stove at higher temps for the first hour or so will help reduce problems associated with burning less than favorable fuel.

 

[Texas123]

For ten years from 1997 to 2007 the only source of heat for our home was an old fashioned Wonder Wood heater. Yes, this was a pre EPA smoke dragon but successfully kept us alive even down to nine degrees and the power was out for several hours. In doing so I learned three main things.

First - dry wood burns better then wet wood

Second - second year wood can pop and burn very well.

Third - not advisable but in a life or death situation, you can burn "20 percent moisture content" wood on top of the coals and still get livable heat from it.

 

[bholler]

The difference is average 9-11% between catalyst equipped and none catalyst equipped. If 9-12% isn't much, then you are correct.

He was claiming a 20% difference and I said it was not that much. So yes my statement was correct.

2). DuraFoil cats failures have nothing to do with moisture content. The fact is the galva alumina wash coat will flatten out and the combustor will be less effective if the cat reaches 1600 degrees Fahrenheit. Ceramic substrates are in fact more likely to be damaged from thermal shock, which can result from excessively wet wood being dumped into a hot fire.

Ok I thought the "steel cats" were still hurt by thermal shock just not as badly as ceramic ones. If they are not hurt by it at all then sorry I was wrong

2). You should NOT leave the by pass open to deal with wet fuel. Studies done by the two leading cat stove companies show a greater tolerance in moisture content that perhaps you might realize. We recommend 18-22% because the result is less combustion moisture bonding with particulate to form creosote. We tell folks all the time that the moisture in the fuel load it greatly reduced in the first few hours of the combustion process, regardless of technology. By loading the stove and then operating the stove at higher temps for the first hour or so will help reduce problems associated with burning less than favorable fuel.

But wont you need longer to get that cat up to temp with wet wood? And by burning at a higher temp for the first few hours reduce your efficiency? Like I said.

I am not bashing Blaze kings or cat stoves in general they are great stoves. I just get tired of the couple guys who constantly act like any stove other than a bk is junk and not worth using.

 

[BKVP]

He was claiming a 20% difference and I said it was not that much. So yes my statement was correct.


Ok I thought the "steel cats" were still hurt by thermal shock just not as badly as ceramic ones. If they are not hurt by it at all then sorry I was wrong


But wont you need longer to get that cat up to temp with wet wood? And by burning at a higher temp for the first few hours reduce your efficiency? Like I said.

I am not bashing Blaze kings or cat stoves in general they are great stoves. I just get tired of the couple guys who constantly act like any stove other than a bk is junk and not worth using.

It's a Chevy vs Ford thing. There are a lot of fine stoves on the market. What "they" have experienced is the unique performance attributes. In order to burn cleanly in a non catalyst equipped stove, you burn hot...even on low so as to do well in the low burn test. With a cat, like the one in your 3100, you can do so at 550. So by the very nature, the definition of low is different. On top of that, the thermostat acts as a shock absorber to uneven burning nature of cord wood. It essentially meters out the BTU input over a given (selected) period of time. These qualities can make some wood burners very passionate. Most importantly, the thermostat keeps the cat from seeing that deadly 1600 figure I mentioned earlier. A manual air control cannot do that, at least not in really sub zero environments.

I'm not going to defend anyone here, but keep in mind that manufacturers throw out all sorts of numbers, even on their own products, so if you compare numbers that are not comparable, you can get 30%!! Our King, on one calculation that was permitted for the tax credit in 2008 was 101% efficient. The boys at Woodstock had the same experience. It is all due to the LHV and HHV efficiency that there is so much confusion.

To address your question of keeping the by pass open, not once the cat is active. If the wood is so green as to suppress cat activity, then it will sit and smolder in any stove and pollute. However, it the cat is active, close the by pass. You're a sweep, you've seen it all, probably some you'd like to forget!

How are you liking your 3100 by the way? You can pm your experience or start a thread for it and send me a link.

Have a great Sunday! And if you attend the Guild meeting in 2017 in Louisville let me know, I plan on being there. I'll buy you a round.

Chris

 

[bholler]

With a cat, like the one in your 3100,

The 3100 is a tube stove not a cat stove. But I do like it regardless. I need to burn at a relatively high temp most of the time with a big old house that takes lots of btus so burning on low does not mean much to me.

You're a sweep, you've seen it all, probably some you'd like to forget!

Yes I have and no matter what stove it is if you burn wet wood or dont burn correctly you can make a real mess of things

 

[Highbeam]

Well, "we" are certified blaze king fanboys after all which happens once you realize the unique and superior performance capabilities of the design. Nobody ever said the rest are junk, I own another brand too. A noncat! There are places where other stoves shine.

 

[Highbeam]

It's a Chevy vs Ford thing. .

Chris

Give bk credit where it's due. The bk can do things that no other stove can. Maybe it's a toyota vs Ford thing, since both make trucks but only Ford makes a truck capable of hauling large cargo. This only matters to you if you want to haul large cargo. Both make great trucks.

 

[Highbeam]

I am not bashing Blaze kings or cat stoves in general they are great stoves. I just get tired of the couple guys who constantly act like any stove other than a bk is junk and not worth using.

I apologize for your misunderstanding. I only know of a couple of stoves that are unsafe junk and not worth using. The rest are all quality items made with thought to satisfy a market segment.

 

[ohlongarm]

He was claiming a 20% difference and I said it was not that much. So yes my statement was correct.


Ok I thought the "steel cats" were still hurt by thermal shock just not as badly as ceramic ones. If they are not hurt by it at all then sorry I was wrong


But wont you need longer to get that cat up to temp with wet wood? And by burning at a higher temp for the first few hours reduce your efficiency? Like I said.

I am not bashing Blaze kings or cat stoves in general they are great stoves. I just get tired of the couple guys who constantly act like any stove other than a bk is junk and not worth using.

Not any but a few not worth using after I tried them,Quadracrap,Morso aka Morjunk,Buck ,NC 30 good if you only need 4 hours of heat,and Jotul,hard to regulate and short burn times in extreme conditions,now mind you this goes back over a two decade period. Things have probably changed but for the last five years the BK line has never failed in any way,despite some horrific winters,I don't have time to babysit a woodstove. Now no offense to anyone owning any of the aforementioned,your results may vary towards a more favorable light. Unfortunately these were my experiences. On my second BK now,not yet burned it who knows it could wind up in the pile along with the others.Buck was the absolute worst of the worse their largest stove wouldn't heat a 400 sq foot room to a comfort level.Almost bough a Pacific Energy Summit ,till my nephews cracked in the middle of winter first winter used that is and PE gave him a case of the arse to make it right.

 

[bholler]

Not any but a few not worth using after I tried them,Quadracrap,Morso aka Morjunk,Buck ,NC 30 good if you only need 4 hours of heat,and Jotul,hard to regulate and short burn times in extreme conditions,now mind you this goes back over a two decade period. Things have probably changed but for the last five years the BK line has never failed in any way,despite some horrific winters,I don't have time to babysit a woodstove. Now no offense to anyone owning any of the aforementioned,your results may vary towards a more favorable light. Unfortunately these were my experiences. On my second BK now,not yet burned it who knows it could wind up in the pile along with the others.Buck was the absolute worst of the worse their largest stove wouldn't heat a 400 sq foot room to a comfort level.Almost bough a Pacific Energy Summit ,till my nephews cracked in the middle of winter first winter used that is and PE gave him a case of the arse to make it right.

Well I don't know I work on just about all of those stove brands regularly and have friends and family who heat with many of them as well. I have heard relatively few complaints about those brands. And if you have had that many problems with reputable stove brands I have to say it is probably not the stove. My father has heated with a quad for 15 years with no other heat in the house what so ever. He easily gets 8 to 10 hour burns. My uncle has had a buck for 10 years or so same as my father no other heat and no problems. Yes Bks will burn longer and a little cleaner and more efficient. But the other stoves when run correctly with good fuel work very well also.

 

[bholler]

I apologize for your misunderstanding. I only know of a couple of stoves that are unsafe junk and not worth using. The rest are all quality items made with thought to satisfy a market segment.

No problem I am not offended or anything I just occasionally have to point out that bk is not the only good stove maker around lol. I know you don't think that but you are obviously very passionate about them and your posts can come off that way at times

 

[ohlongarm]

No problem I am not offended or anything I just occasionally have to point out that bk is not the only good stove maker around lol. I know you don't think that but you are obviously very passionate about them and your posts can come off that way at times

Agreed,but I will offer this up,when a better heating ,more efficient,longer burning,virtually maintenance free woodstove arrives in the marketplace,guess what?I will buy it.Also remember some people set their standards a little higher than others,case in point,one of our officers only buys GM cars,best cars on planet earth,despite the fact his new SRX 2016,is in the shop every other week.He says they're the best?Get my point. It's what makes the individual happy.

 

[DUMF]

Not any but a few not worth using after I tried them,Quadracrap,Morso aka Morjunk,Buck ,NC 30 good if you only need 4 hours of heat,and Jotul,hard to regulate and short burn times in extreme conditions,now mind you this goes back over a two decade period. Things have probably changed but for the last five years the BK line has never failed in any way,despite some horrific winters,I don't have time to babysit a woodstove. Now no offense to anyone owning any of the aforementioned,your results may vary towards a more favorable light. Unfortunately these were my experiences. On my second BK now,not yet burned it who knows it could wind up in the pile along with the others.Buck was the absolute worst of the worse their largest stove wouldn't heat a 400 sq foot room to a comfort level.Almost bough a Pacific Energy Summit ,till my nephews cracked in the middle of winter first winter used that is and PE gave him a case of the arse to make it right.

Whiskey Tango Foxtrot , ohlonga, you gotta say what you mean.
Be more assertive, will ya ? More opinionated, huh ?
You got some kind of oil furnace ?

Now for a word from our sponsor...................

From a committed wood stove burner, an OCD firewood fool, heating with so many different stoves over decades that the grey matter up there is saturated---stoves are like sexual attraction. There are an infinite number of variables on all sides. You like redheads, she likes skinny men with no brains, etc.. etc...We have the BK fans, the Jotul freaks, the PE boys, even some swearing by ( and at VC). Hell, I even once thought that those Ashleys were golden ( can you believe a creosote maker could be loved ?). Cat, non-cat. Who cares if the appliance puts out for you ( yes ).
BTW: I honestly admire the BKVP as the ONLY rep to participate on this forum. Thanks, even though those stoves are not pretty (to us) and big $$$$.
So there ohlonga.