Upgrading Soapstone Stove Only After a Year

[Vic99]

Yeah, typically my Homestead works as it is designed . . . which is why I think it is a good stove. I guess if the stove literature was more releastic instead of idealistic I may have originally gone with the Heritage. I take responsibility too for trying to make a smaller stove work.

Initially I had to change the configuration of the fireplace a bit to make the Homestead fit. It's frustrating when you take measurement and then actually get the stove to the house, but it doesn't quite make clearances. After the mason came in and modified my fireplace area I found that I could actually fit a Heritage there, but I already had the Homestead paid for and just went with it. I needed more insulation anyway.

Good for my house, but not great.

 

[Vic99]

Mike,

I'm just afraid that the Mansfield will both cook us out of the room and dominate the room. It's 15 x 15. I have a 4 foot arachway and a 28 inch archway leading out. I am going to widen the 28 inch arch to 3 or 4 feet next year, depending on what I can get away with, so that will help, but I definitely don't have an open floor plan. Pipe work prevents that change easily.

What's your set up like, Mike?

How's your insulation?

Ranch or Multistory?

 

[mikeathens]

Mike,

I'm just afraid that the Mansfield will both cook us out of the room and dominate the room. It's 15 x 15. I have a 4 foot arachway and a 28 inch archway leading out. I am going to widen the 28 inch arch to 3 or 4 feet next year, depending on what I can get away with, so that will help, but I definitely don't have an open floor plan. Pipe work prevents that change easily.

What's your set up like, Mike?

How's your insulation?

Ranch or Multistory?

We live in an OLD 1800's log cabin/farmhouse. It is about 1800 SF, with spotty insulation. I do what I can to improve it when I see an opportunity. It is about 20X24 two story in the front, with a single story addition in the back, flat roof (or close to it, 1/12 or 2/12 pitch). The stove sits in this addition area. Chimney is straight through the roof, fairly open floor plan. The flat roof area is (from what I can tell)is not much better than R-19, grossly inadequate. I can feel cold air coming from around the top plate in that part of the house.

Our logs are 12x12 (or larger) poplar, chestnut, and oak; dovetail corners with 1" to 10" chink joints with various degrees of insulation between. The roof in the cabin is underinsulated, but better than the back part. It's home, though. The mansfield is just right...

 

[edthedawg]

Love it! Rockin' the PV array on top of the 1800's log cabin

 

[Highbeam]

I have the heritage in a 1700 SF rambler, recently insulated which made a huge difference. I can't believe that the tiny Homestead is only 7% smaller. Perhaps hearthstone blew the measurement like they did the burn time. Looking at them there is a huge size difference. You've got two problems:

1) The stove doesn't make enough heat
2) The burn times are too short

Both of these problems can be solved with a larger stove of either cat or non-cat construction.

The largest woodstock is going to solve #2 but not solve #1 since a 2.3 CF stove can only make as much heat as another 2.3 CF stove when run at the same temp.

You'll need to go bigger to prevent making the same mistake twice. Go to a mansfield, go to a blazeking, a summit, or any other 3cf stove. Someday, maybe woodstock will make a bigger stove. I would love to try the fireview.

There was a member, I forget his name but from Colorado, that went from a heritage to a mansfield and solved all of his problems which sound eerily similar to your troubles.

 

[Vic99]

7% size difference is for the firebox. 2.0 vs. 2.3. Actual height is 360 vs, 475. Very significant.

My wife has also been following this thread. We are leaning more toward the fireview and the mansfield now . . . although will require more significant changes, like top venting. I imagine, though, that will make for easier sweeping.

We are going to reconfigue the room a bit in the summer, and maybe partly knock down a wall, so we have to take that into account.

 

[Highbeam]

Oh, well, since the wife is involved, have her take a look at the mansfield. I actually find it a little, well, not so pretty. The feet and door look funny to me. The fireview is nice to look at. I understand the 7% firebox volume difference but just look at those stoves, the heritage looks much larger. Maybe just an illusion.

 

[mikeathens]

I totally agree, highbeam. I'm wasn't too crazy about the mansfield's looks compared to the heritage (I still hear it from the wife), but it is one hell of a furnace. I actually get some sleep now. It ain't looking so bad now.

 

[bcnu]

I have the Homestead and am happy with it. I was pretty much aware of burn times etc after spending many hours of research on this site before buying. Also had a dealer who actually came to the house. The Heritage would be too big given our room arrangement/regular ceilings etc. I want to look at the Woodstocks again as I like the possibility of longer burn times. Being retired, it's not much of a concern to keep the stove going. But being retired, I'd rather tend the stove less and perhaps save on the amount of "free" wood I have stored up. Maybe I can get the feds to give me a bailout so I can stimulate the economy. :bug:

 

[Vic99]

Highbeam,

I agree. When you look at the Heritage and the Homestead side by side there is no comparison. That's why it was initially my first choice when considering an upgrade.

As I wrote in another thread, I just replaced the door handle and the door gasket, so my stove is much tighter now. Perhaps this was slowly getting worse over time and I hadn't noticed the gradual decline in performance. I realize that my burns won't suddenly shoot up to 8 hrs, but I'm interested to see what happens on a very cold day since I've made some insualtion improvements, have drier wood, etc.

 

[regalflyer]

Hearthstone Heritage misery. It is hard to start, will not reload without smoke entering the room, will not burn 8 hours, and leaves excessive coals from an overnight attempt. I have a good draft indoor chimney, professional installation with cold air intake. It burns at high output when fully loaded for an evening burn with the air control closed all the way resulting in an overheated house. Then in the morning it is cold in the house with a pile of unburned coals left over. I run the air control to full open in the morning and get a little more heat output, but the coal pile takes hours to burn down without enough heat output. This is not my first wood burning appliance, but I am ready to ditch this one. It is heating an 1800 sq foot house well when freshly cleaned out and running wide open with 2 splits in it. I can't keep the coal bed form growing and I cannot run it wide open all the time to help reduce the coals.

Anyone solved this or have any operatingtips for this stove? I have very bad feeling towards Hearthstone at this time.
Thanks

 

[Todd]

Most of the time these problems are due to draft, not the stove. What kind and size of chimney? How many 90 degree elbows? What kind of wood are you burning and how dry is it?

 

[cstrail]

My advice - Get the fireview. I researched this for over 1 year on here and locally. I ended up with the fireview. I was concerned with the CAT also, but it is so easy my 10 year old daughter knows when to flip it and how to adjust it now. That makes it real easy, I will load the stove and let it burn until the wood is good and charred and the cat is ready to flip and then she will flip it up and adjust the air for me. Could not be any easier. I heat an old 1700 SF victorian style house 24/7 with this stove and it has no trouble keeping up.

 

[Highbeam]

Hearthstone Heritage misery. It is hard to start, will not reload without smoke entering the room, will not burn 8 hours, and leaves excessive coals from an overnight attempt. I have a good draft indoor chimney, professional installation with cold air intake. It burns at high output when fully loaded for an evening burn with the air control closed all the way resulting in an overheated house. Then in the morning it is cold in the house with a pile of unburned coals left over. I run the air control to full open in the morning and get a little more heat output, but the coal pile takes hours to burn down without enough heat output. This is not my first wood burning appliance, but I am ready to ditch this one. It is heating an 1800 sq foot house well when freshly cleaned out and running wide open with 2 splits in it. I can't keep the coal bed form growing and I cannot run it wide open all the time to help reduce the coals.

Anyone solved this or have any operatingtips for this stove? I have very bad feeling towards Hearthstone at this time.
Thanks

Geeze Paul, that's rough. You ought to make a new thread with your issues to get more readers than just us reading about the upsizing issue here. You either have a problem with your installation and stove or you are too familiar with the old style of non-EPA airtight stoves that burned much differently than these modern ones. I suspect an overdraft situation. A new stove from another brand will do the same thing.

I looked at the Homestead and figured out why it looks so small. They have this huge bulbous cast iron butt on them that hangs way aft. In that butt the additional volume is stored so the homestead might just be a 2 CFer. Why on earth would you not want to have the additional soapstone?

 

[Todd]

[quote author="Highbeam" date="1228689509
I looked at the Homestead and figured out why it looks so small. They have this huge bulbous cast iron butt on them that hangs way aft. In that butt the additional volume is stored so the homestead might just be a 2 CFer. Why on earth would you not want to have the additional soapstone?[/quote]

I measured my Homesteads fire box and it came up short of 2cu ft. I don't remember what it was, maybe 1.7? I think the Homestead has that big cast iron butt because it's designed as a insert/hearth stove. They even have a surround for it.

 

[regalflyer]

I believe the stove is sized well, it has no trouble keeping up with the house with just 2 splits on top of the bed. I am thinking that maybe I need to check the draft? - once the wood pile is charred, I cannot keep the burn below 400 to 450 (center stone) even with the air control closed all the way. This is so frustrating because I cannot seem to get enough air to burn the pile of coals either. The dealer said dampers are not required with these. I have never been able to open the front door without a lot of discharge going into the house. The stove is set up for top exhaust, so I normally use the side door. I open very slowly, with some discharge anyway. My biggest problem with this stove is too much coal in the morning - I can't get it burned down even at wide open all day, so I have to empty the pan twice to keep from overfilling when raking coals & ashes onto the grate. I have read and employed all the tricks I can find for excessive coaling to no great effect. Previous to this house, I ran an EPA Quadrafire fireplace insert that would go for 3 days before I had to shovel out half a pail of ash/coals. I thought that was bad as I watched the backyard coal/ash pile grow. How does your Heritage run on a daily basis? What characteristics - can you describe a daily or weekly routine? I never ran an older stove, but I am amazed at the non EPA stove my friend has. It burns everything down to ash that is easy to dispose of and it runs a long time without emptying. Thanks

 

[bcnu]

[quote author="Highbeam" date="1228689509
I looked at the Homestead and figured out why it looks so small. They have this huge bulbous cast iron butt on them that hangs way aft. In that butt the additional volume is stored so the homestead might just be a 2 CFer. Why on earth would you not want to have the additional soapstone?

I measured my Homesteads fire box and it came up short of 2cu ft. I don't remember what it was, maybe 1.7? I think the Homestead has that big cast iron butt because it's designed as a insert/hearth stove. They even have a surround for it.[/quote]

Homestead literature says it has a 2.0 cu ft. firebox. Mine is placed so that the bulbous back is inside the fireplace and the stove itself sits on the hearth. I also use the surround. Have a nice lazy fire going right now which suits my mood perfectly

 

[geka]

Love our Heritage. I was on this blog a few months ago as my hubby and I were trying to figure out what stove to get to replace our aging VC Defiant. By all standards because our house is around 2800 SF we should have purchased the Mansfield...BUT the logistics of working it into the fireplace and all made us opt for the back venting Heritage. Wow is this little stove great. We have a fantastic draft and after 8 hours there are coals left, the stove is still warm and the wood catches quickly to where we have a nice fire in no time. Not to say that this will work for all of you but it is working for us. Our stove is in the keeping room FP which is in the center of the house. Love it. Thanks bloggers for all your assistance.

 

[Vic99]

Alright, an update . . .

About 2 weeks ago I replaced the door gasket and the handle. This made my stove tighter. Confirmed with the dollar bill test. Also inspected the stove for any damage and found nothing other than a few hairline cracks everyone gets.

I may be dealing with "Florida Bungalow Syndrome". Essentially my chimney draft may be TOO good. Last couple of nights it was around 20-23 degrees F outside. I reloaded the firebox at 180 F one night, 250 another night. Both times I had to intervene to prevent an overfire.

Stove vents straight back through the central chimney, bends 90 degrees up, twists about 30 degrees and then shoots straight up for another 23 ish feet. Total height is probably 26-27 feet. Doesn't look like there is an easy way to install a flue damper as I'd have to bore into brick first.

So now my wife and I are cautiously leaning toward a Mansfield install this summer. I figure that all that extra heat will be a good thing. We are going to knock a non-load bearing wall down between two 15 x 15 ft rooms to make one large 30 x 15 with an 8 ish ft high ceiling. I will also update all the wall coverings and insulate them. Looking into spray foam, but may go cellulose. I also plan to install a damper on the stove pipe. I figure that the pipe will vent up 3 feet then go back 2-3 feet into a brick chimney. This should allow for an easier clean out than my current set up.

What do you reckon?

 

[Todd]

[quote author="Highbeam" date="1228689509
I looked at the Homestead and figured out why it looks so small. They have this huge bulbous cast iron butt on them that hangs way aft. In that butt the additional volume is stored so the homestead might just be a 2 CFer. Why on earth would you not want to have the additional soapstone?

I measured my Homesteads fire box and it came up short of 2cu ft. I don't remember what it was, maybe 1.7? I think the Homestead has that big cast iron butt because it's designed as a insert/hearth stove. They even have a surround for it.

Homestead literature says it has a 2.0 cu ft. firebox. Mine is placed so that the bulbous back is inside the fireplace and the stove itself sits on the hearth. I also use the surround. Have a nice lazy fire going right now which suits my mood perfectly[/quote]

Measure it and see. I think Hearthstone includes everthing above the baffle as part of the firebox.

 

[lazeedan]

This is my second year with the Homestead and with much reading, trial anrd error and better wood (mostly white and red oak) I'm getting much better burn times. Are you done experimenting? It was 14 this morning and after 9 hours the house was still 68 and stove top was 200. We our very pleased with the Homestead.

 

[Todd]

Alright, an update . . .

About 2 weeks ago I replaced the door gasket and the handle. This made my stove tighter. Confirmed with the dollar bill test. Also inspected the stove for any damage and found nothing other than a few hairline cracks everyone gets.

I may be dealing with "Florida Bungalow Syndrome". Essentially my chimney draft may be TOO good. Last couple of nights it was around 20-23 degrees F outside. I reloaded the firebox at 180 F one night, 250 another night. Both times I had to intervene to prevent an overfire.

Stove vents straight back through the central chimney, bends 90 degrees up, twists about 30 degrees and then shoots straight up for another 23 ish feet. Total height is probably 26-27 feet. Doesn't look like there is an easy way to install a flue damper as I'd have to bore into brick first.

So now my wife and I are cautiously leaning toward a Mansfield install this summer. I figure that all that extra heat will be a good thing. We are going to knock a non-load bearing wall down between two 15 x 15 ft rooms to make one large 30 x 15 with an 8 ish ft high ceiling. I will also update all the wall coverings and insulate them. Looking into spray foam, but may go cellulose. I also plan to install a damper on the stove pipe. I figure that the pipe will vent up 3 feet then go back 2-3 feet into a brick chimney. This should allow for an easier clean out than my current set up.

What do you reckon?

Sounds like a good plan to me. You have all winter to think and plan about it.

 

[Vic99]

"This is my second year with the Homestead and with much reading, trial anrd error and better wood (mostly white and red oak) I’m getting much better burn times. Are you done experimenting? It was 14 this morning and after 9 hours the house was still 68 and stove top was 200. We our very pleased with the Homestead."

Lazedan,

That's great. What is the size of your house? How many stories? Insulation?

 

[Vic99]

I've been experimenting with Aluminum foil. As Hearthstone owners know, when you shut the damper all the way, there is still a small opening for air.

It's in the teens out there and VERY windy. At 11 p.m. on a stove that I filled about 85%, with all sugar maple (averaging about 18% moisture), the stove top hit 520 F. I then plugged 1/2 of the "closed" opening with foil. I have less secondary burn and stove topped out at 525.

It's 11:25 p.m. now and stove top is 505 F and the secondary burn is lazy, but burning. Stove room is 75F, kitchen (tough to heat) is 66F. We'll see tomorrow morning.

 

[Stevebass4]

i'll be watching CL to see when you put your stove up for sale - been wanting to upgrade to a soap stone stove for a while (have a small insert now)