Ugh, ok, just about out of options with Prescott EXL...

[SmokeyTheBear]

Just my two cents, the operators manual does not give that average user enough information to properly clean this stove.

That is true for most of the manuals I've seen.

In two words, they stink.

When my stove was installed they showed me how to clean the stove according to the manual.

I laughed and said Ok, where are the ash traps hidden?

Meanwhile mooney is getting an education in all of the places to look for his problem.

mooney, when you replaced your door gasket did you do the dollar bill test in several places around the door. I hate to say this but more than one person has replaced their gaskets only to discover that:

1: They stretched it so that it can't seal correctly.

2: It really wasn't the gasket that was the problem, but the door hinges loosening up or the latch no longer engaging.

3: They bought an incorrect replacement size.

With gaskets, looks can be deceiving.

I totally agree... I didn't do the dollar bill test, please explain. I did replace the gasket with a 5/8" rope that I was careful not to stretch. I'm pretty sure it needed replacing anyways as where the two ends of the rope came together was fraying and if it wasn't already leaking air, it would have been shortly.

And yes, I think the manual sucks. ;-)

I was trying to be nice and not use that s word.

With the stove off and cold

Place a dollar bill in the door and close it so the dollar bill is between the door gasket and the stove.

Then pull the dollar bill out it should offer quite a bit of resistance, as in being very difficult to move if at all.

Do this test in at least two spots on each side of the door.

If the test fails in any spot you need to revisit the gasket/door hinge/latch situation as you have an air leak.

 

[mooney]

Update:

Well, after the last major cleaning, it's been a day and a half and I think the problem stove is cured. It was either one of two things:

1. I banged the heck out of the back wall with the bricks removed. "Some" extra stuff fell down, but not a huge amount. I also fashioned a 1/2" tube on the end of my shop vac and ran it up both sides of the ash traps.

2. I used my shop vac to suck out the air intake tube. My thought was possibly that something got up there. Not sure what, but I'm fairly sure I heard something go clink when I did that. I then used my 1/2" tube vacuum tool to go as far up the air intake as I could.

The difference? Night and day. Brilliant flame, embers floating, and very little ash on the glass, which is consistent with it's normal usage.

So at the end of the day, I learned a huge amount about the stove, I think I'm now capable of cleaning every single nook and cranny.

I also learned that just because the air intake tube "shouldn't" get clogged, it's now a part of the cleaning regimen.

Thanks all for all the great advice!

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

You mean what I said back in post reply #3 in this thread might have been it, who'd thunk that.

It might have been easier if the very first thing you did took care of the problem, however now you know the stove's entire air path and that is worth its weight in gold.

Enjoy the heat.

 

[mooney]

You mean what I said back in post reply #3 in this thread might have been it, who'd thunk that.

It might have been easier if the very first thing you did took care of the problem, however now you know the stove's entire air path and that is worth its weight in gold.

Enjoy the heat.

Oof... I know you told me so, I just couldn't see the blockage!

As for the air path, I'm still not totally clear on that. I don't know where the air goes once it comes into the intake.

Also, I believe I understand the exhaust air path (Out the large vertical hole below the VersaGrate), but I don't understand how the air from the room air fan gets from the bottom of the stove to the heat exchanger.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

mooney,

Picture this, your stove is a pipe the air intake is at one end and the exhaust is at the other. There is a bulge in the middle through which the intake connects to the burn pot area within the bulge, above the burn pot inside the bulge is the connection to the exhaust. Your air path (assuming the stove is mechanically sound) is into the intake through the burn pot which sits in the burn pot area and from there out the exhaust.

The convection fan is on one end of another pipe and there is a set of pipes that go through that bulge above the burn pot and exit the front with a pipe leading to the convection fan. The air gets sucked into the fan and blown through the pipes picking up heat on the way through the pipes above the burn pot.

So a pellet stove is just a bunch of pipes through which air flows, in one set of pipes it is the convection air and the other it is the combustion air.

Where the convection air pipes comes in contact with the heated combustion air is the heat exchanger.

ETA: There is a bit of folding, crossing, bobbing, and weaving that actually takes place but that is in essence what the beast is.

 

[Xena]

... I don't understand how the air from the room air fan
gets from the bottom of the stove to the heat exchanger.

Glad to hear you are back in business. (broken image removed)
Here's a diagram from one of the st croix pdf's
that should help to make things clearer.

 

[mooney]

Whoa... thanks to you both for the description and the image. I've never seen that image anywhere in their PDF's, that certainly would have helped.

Ok, so following that diagram, the convection blower is pushing air up behind the wall and out through the heat exchanger.

That's all crystal clear. Where I'm still a little fuzzy on is the combustion side.

Smokey's description of the process makes perfect sense. In the diagram however, I'm unclear as to how the exhaust fan is pulling the air from the intake pipe, through the burn pot and then to the exhaust. I also assume that as the fly ash migrates upwards towards the steel baffle, that it hits that baffle and then goes over the wall and drops down to be collected in the ash traps.

So that's the last piece of what I don't quite get.

Thanks

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Your getting there, all of the problems start because the fly ash doesn't have a direct path out through the vent, it deposits itself along every surface it comes in contact with and even faster as the exhaust cools as it goes through the system. It also really hates going around sharp bends and through all downward passages and through horizontal ones. A venting system can be severely compromised if any horizontal portion doesn't actually have a slight rise.

However from a heat transfer stand point it is better if the air flow gets slowed down which all of the bends accomplish.

Now the combustion air flow starts with the air entering the shell of your house if there is no OAK and a sealed intake system. It proceeds into the air chamber under the burn pot. Some of the air flow gets forced through the area between your igniter and its tube, this fraction aids in quickly starting a fire and must be kept clean just as the air chamber under the burn pot, what also happens is crud gets sucked into the air intake especially if inside air is used, and as the pellets burn ash also falls into the air chamber.

We won't mention that having little ones around can add to what might end up in various stove orifices. Even some of the bigger ones have been known to add to the situation.

The ash traps are interesting in that they collect a lot of ash but don't start causing problems until the ash level gets above the exhaust exit in the trap, this is frequently raised a bit above the floor of the ash trap and not in a direct drop line from where the trap opens at the top near the heat exchanger.

Well I'm about typed out, my wrist says I've done enough for today.

 

[hossthehermit]

Just found something very interesting... I went online and was looking at a copy of the Owner's Manual, and it shows 3 ash trap clean outs. 1 on either side of the burn pot, AND it shows a clean out behind the ash pan. I thought I had missed something, but I just checked and there's no ash trap clean out.

Anyone else have a clean out there?

Probably not on all models. I DO have one on mine. Were you looking at the right manual?

 

[mooney]

Just found something very interesting... I went online and was looking at a copy of the Owner's Manual, and it shows 3 ash trap clean outs. 1 on either side of the burn pot, AND it shows a clean out behind the ash pan. I thought I had missed something, but I just checked and there's no ash trap clean out.

Anyone else have a clean out there?

Probably not on all models. I DO have one on mine. Were you looking at the right manual?

I was, I was looking at the Prescott manual. It clearly shows for both the EXL and the EXP that there are 3 ash trap cleanouts.

 

[hossthehermit]

Just found something very interesting... I went online and was looking at a copy of the Owner's Manual, and it shows 3 ash trap clean outs. 1 on either side of the burn pot, AND it shows a clean out behind the ash pan. I thought I had missed something, but I just checked and there's no ash trap clean out.

Anyone else have a clean out there?

Probably not on all models. I DO have one on mine. Were you looking at the right manual?

I was, I was looking at the Prescott manual. It clearly shows for both the EXL and the EXP that there are 3 ash trap cleanouts.

"Curiouser and curiouser", said Alice.

 

[Xena]

mooney here is another diagram.

 

[mooney]

Brilliant Thanks

 

[woodsman23]

Only the newer models have the 3 ash clean outs after 2007. Mine is an 07 and onlt has 2

 

[mooney]

Only the newer models have the 3 ash clean outs after 2007. Mine is an 07 and onlt has 2

Ahh, that makes sense. Mine was installed fall of 2007.

 

[magsf11]

in the past few months I have been readind about everyones problems,including mine, with their ST. Croix and have learned so much. glade you got your problem fixed, I found out the hard way this yr about the head achs a poor(non) preforming stove can cause. everyone in this fourm is great.

 

[tchdngrnby]

in the past few months I have been readind about everyones problems,including mine, with their ST. Croix and have learned so much. glade you got your problem fixed, I found out the hard way this yr about the head achs a poor(non) preforming stove can cause. everyone in this fourm is great.

Confusious Say: "You must become "one" with the stove Grasshopper....

Luckily the St. Croix Prescott's are not very complicated stoves. Getting yourself set up with a variety of cleaning tools such as brushes, hand tools, a good vacuum, a leaf blower, and then being somewhat anal in sticking to a cleaning schedule, goes a long way in keeping this stove belching heat.

The number one cause of poor perfomance is a dirty stove. Having burned both wood, and most recently pellets, for my main source of heat, I have become accutely aware of the importance of ensuring that I keep these appliances clean. Restricting combustion air to a stove results in a poor quality burn. Restricting the stoves ability to discharge combustion products has the same effect.

When the quality of your burn goes south, its time to roll up the sleeves and do the deed.

Paul V.

 

[MSmith66]

mooney here is another diagram.

While cleaning any St.Criox stove , most people do not clean behind the firewall. The manual dose not show you that. If I can find the Tech Bulletin, I will post it.
There are two round plugs, one on each side of the burn pot ( not below, like the ash ports). If you have an older model, you need to drill a hole on each side of the burnpot.
Use a flexable 24" cable on the end of a drill, insert cable in hole and turn drill on. This will loosen up all ash. The NEWER models have a 3rd ash door behind the ash pan. When using this cable, you are cleaning the area that the new models have the 3rd ash door.

 

[MSmith66]

When using this method, you are cleaning the # 6 area of the diagram.

 

[ajdaktor]

Just found something very interesting... I went online and was looking at a copy of the Owner's Manual, and it shows 3 ash trap clean outs. 1 on either side of the burn pot, AND it shows a clean out behind the ash pan. I thought I had missed something, but I just checked and there's no ash trap clean out.

Anyone else have a clean out there?

The third door is only on newer models. I use a piece of 3/16" steel cable or a spring style drain snake to clean behind the rear wall and knock the ash down into the cleanouts. There are two 3'8" holes behind the brick also that can be used for access.

 

[MSmith66]

There was a fellow on here that does service on those stoves and said there was a tech bulletin out for the area that was difficult to clean and was causing trouble.

https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewreply/587179/

Hmm... I'm almost positive I've seen those cleanouts behind the wall. I use a flexible brush to push up into the ash traps. Maybe I need to go buy some tubing and fashion an attachment to my shop vac to see if I've missed anything.

These holes are located next to each side of the burn port behind the brick, if the brick came with the stove. Pop out the spring plugs and use a 1/4" poly tube to clean ( Poke) into the holes. You can also pull the combustion blower and with a mirror, see the 1/4" tube in the combustion area. keep poking the 1/4 tube in and turn the tube in all directions. With the mirror, see alot of ash fall into the combustion area. This is a very ""TIGHT"" area that the manual does not cover. The newer Hastings stove have a plate behind the ash drawer that you remove with a 1/4 nut driver and can clean it out there. Hope this helps.

 

[MSmith66]

There was a fellow on here that does service on those stoves and said there was a tech bulletin out for the area that was difficult to clean and was causing trouble.

https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewreply/587179/

Hmm... I'm almost positive I've seen those cleanouts behind the wall. I use a flexible brush to push up into the ash traps. Maybe I need to go buy some tubing and fashion an attachment to my shop vac to see if I've missed anything.

These holes are located next to each side of the burn port behind the brick, if the brick came with the stove. Pop out the spring plugs and use a 1/4" poly tube to clean ( Poke) into the holes. You can also pull the combustion blower and with a mirror, see the 1/4" tube in the combustion area. keep poking the 1/4 tube in and turn the tube in all directions. With the mirror, see alot of ash fall into the combustion area. This is a very ""TIGHT"" area that the manual does not cover. The newer Hastings stove have a plate behind the ash drawer that you remove with a 1/4 nut driver and can clean it out there. Hope this helps.

The damper is also a very ""Tight"" adjustment. Once th stove has been lite,Close the damper and then open 1/8" open let burn until pellets burn down and room blowwer turn on. Then adjust damper if needed. I have worked on one stove that used the same damper settign from level one to level 5.

 

[maglite67]

close the damper down on a #2 pencil. next get a 1/4" piece of plumbers snake about 3 feet long. put snake on a drill and drive it up ash traps should be able to see the snake come up to the heat exchanger behind back wall. do both sides and you should be able to clean from one trap to the other. could remove blower again and run snake towards front of stove thats why st croix put in that 3rd clean out can't clean cross pipe. could also try a leaf blower with an air compressor leave blower on vent go inside and give short controlled bursts the blower will suck out all the fly ash. also make sure versa grate is moving quick check on one with digital control boards is open the door hit start the versa grate should travel for 20 secs and then go out on vac error #2 light.

 

[ajdaktor]

Just found something very interesting... I went online and was looking at a copy of the Owner's Manual, and it shows 3 ash trap clean outs. 1 on either side of the burn pot, AND it shows a clean out behind the ash pan. I thought I had missed something, but I just checked and there's no ash trap clean out.

Anyone else have a clean out there?

The third door is only on newer models. I use a piece of 3/16" steel cable or a spring style drain snake to clean behind the rear wall and knock the ash down into the cleanouts. There are two 3'8" holes behind the brick also that can be used for access.

Try New England Pellets, they are burning great this year. They had some issues in the past with longs and dust but seem to have resolved it. The new ones burn very hot with very little ash.

 

[ARGlock]

close the damper down on a #2 pencil. next get a 1/4" piece of plumbers snake about 3 feet long. put snake on a drill and drive it up ash traps should be able to see the snake come up to the heat exchanger behind back wall. do both sides and you should be able to clean from one trap to the other. could remove blower again and run snake towards front of stove thats why st croix put in that 3rd clean out can't clean cross pipe. could also try a leaf blower with an air compressor leave blower on vent go inside and give short controlled bursts the blower will suck out all the fly ash. also make sure versa grate is moving quick check on one with digital control boards is open the door hit start the versa grate should travel for 20 secs and then go out on vac error #2 light.

VERY GOOD ADVICE! That's basically what the Tech Sheet says to do!!

Is the stove running well now?


AR