tent / camping gear

[aussiedog3]

Tent sizes seem to be rated way on the high side considering persons only and no gear.
You might get 3 people in a 3-4man tent and no gear.
Figure on half as many people as the tent is rated for, and will probably fit normal gear like a backpack or duffle bag and a pair of boots.

 

[Ashful]

Tent sizes seem to be rated way on the high side considering persons only and no gear.
You might get 3 people in a 3-4man tent and no gear.
Figure on half as many people as the tent is rated for, and will probably fit normal gear like a backpack or duffle bag and a pair of boots.

Interesting. We used to always figure one of the "men" in the tent was the gear. So, "4-man" tent = 3 people plus gear.

In our case, it will almost always be 1 adult + 1 or 2 children. Very occasionally maybe 2 adults + 2 children... but the chil'uns are small.

 

[Swedishchef]

Good grief. We are talking about camping in the backyard with a four year old. Not summitting Everest.

I agree. But Joful did say that his budget ran to $800. And I am a believer in buying something ONCE, not 5 times in my life if possible. Investing $250 in a decent tent once is better than panicking and running out at the last minute to find another tent when you notice 3 of your poles are bent and the tent won't allow to be setup anymore. Or after 2 weekends in the backyard, you kid says "Jimmy's dad took him to this awesome state park nearby, can we go next weekend?". You could always setup tarps with ropes (in trees) over the tent in a good rain but that too sucks: running around as the rain starts. Trust me, this is from a 33 year old with plenty of camping experience. I have had walmart tents, canadian tire tents and now I only buy Sierre Design tents.

ANdrew

 

[Swedishchef]

Interesting. We used to always figure one of the "men" in the tent was the gear. So, "4-man" tent = 3 people plus gear.

In our case, it will almost always be 1 adult + 1 or 2 children. Very occasionally maybe 2 adults + 2 children... but the chil'uns are small.

Trust me,..if there's gonna be 4 people in the tent, get a 4 person tent (or 5 ish...especially if you're getting a cheaper priced tent, the budget will allow for it). Even if the kids are small. They will wanna wiggle and move around a bit. they wont just get in the tent and sleep within 3 minutes. I went through this last year.

 

[thinkxingu]

I will have to disagree with thinkxingu... you don't want down, unless you're camping in very cold weather or a very dry area. Once down gets wet, it has zero insulating value. When a synthetic bag gets wet, it's wet and miserable, but it retains much of its insulating value.

No love for down, huh? I've had about a dozen bags and none of the synthetics have touched the warmth, weight, breathability (more important to me than water resistance), compressibility, comfort, or longevity of down (I use a Western Mountaineering Megalite I bought for $150 in 2000 in the Whites, which I'll put up against most any area for weather conditions). And the reality is that the tent and stuff sacks are what keeps things dry--with today's down bags' water resistance feathers and waterproof exteriors, synthetics just can't compete.

OP: if you don't have ANY sleeping bags, two Coleman rectangles would be a good start--those are useful in many ways. Just don't expect much warmth.

Side story: wife and I were in Arcadia when a brand-new FJ Cruiser pulled in to the site next to us and began to unload the "Walmart Coleman Special Kit": bags, tent, stove, lantern, pads, headlamps--literally EVERYTHING Coleman. This was late August--days in the low 80's, nights in the 50's--and that couple was up no later than 3 AM shivering by the fire. There's simply no substitute for good gear.

Sorry for the camping gear derail--to me, part of the fun of packing IS the gear!

 

[stoveguy2esw]

back in the day we used to "camp out" in a GP Medium most of the time

 

[Ashful]

I love down, and have Euro down comforters on our beds, but it's not for kids camping, IMO. Based on my own experience as a camping kid, they destroy bags way too quick to justify the cost of down. Also, you CAN get a very warm synth bag, it just won't be as light or compressible. No matter, we're not backpacking in the arctic...

 

[bassJAM]

I love down, and have Euro down comforters on our beds, but it's not for kids camping, IMO. Based on my own experience as a camping kid, they destroy bags way too quick to justify the cost of down. Also, you CAN get a very warm synth bag, it just won't be as light or compressible. No matter, we're not backpacking in the arctic...

That's the way to look at it. Get some cheap gear to get you and your boy outside, because there's a chance it might get destroyed while he's learning the ropes, or heaven forbid, never used again. Heck, even with I was in Scouts, most of our gear was army surplus or cheap gear from The Sportsman's Guide, and we still had a blast. We had a record going once with 40 straight camp outs where it rained on us, except for the weekend it never got above 32° when it snowed, and we never once complained about our gear. Kids will have fun no matter what. It's only been since I've become an adult and have my own money to spend that I've been buying good camping gear, but I also take better care of it now than I would have as a kid, or even a teenager.

I've been on some great camping and backpacking trips as an adult to some pretty cool places, and love the fact that just about all of my gear is wool / down / synthetic / nonstick / titanium / ultralight / waterproof / overpriced. But I can't say that I've had any more fun as an adult as I did as a kid in my synthetic sleeping bag, cotton clothes, hand-me-down cookware from Mom's kitchen, sleeping under a tarp because I let the younger kids in the Scout group use the good tents. It's about the experience, not the gear. I think as adults we tend to forget about that and want the best of the best and a tool for every job (think about how many of us have CAD). But kids don't (or at least shouldn't) care about that stuff.

 

[Ashful]

We had a record going once with 40 straight camp outs where it rained on us, except for the weekend it never got above 32° when it snowed, and we never once complained about our gear.

I think we were in the same Troop!

 

[thinkxingu]

"Kids will have fun no matter what." I can agree to a point. One of my first nights camping out I was real cold for a good portion of the night and I didn't look forward to going again. Luckily for me, the next time I went out I was real comfy in an old military down bag. Those times made an impression on me, and are why I make sure I do everything I can- including spending a little more money on gear- to prevent my 4- and 2-year-olds from having bad experiences.

That being said, a blanket and tarp tent will suffice in warm and dry weather.

 

[TradEddie]

Bro Bart nailed it. A major expedition, it is not!.

Good advice, as always from BB.

I've got an expensive backpacking tent that has been through some of the most horrendous weather imaginable, and it has shared my adventures in some amazing places worldwide but when it came time for car-camping with the kids, I bought a nice spacious cheap tent from Target. That was one of my best buys ever. Why be crammed into a small space unless your life depends on it? Four people in a four person tent is very very tight, I think I got a six person, and there are only four of us. (The good tent still comes in the car, just in case the forecast is wrong, but even the cheap tent has withstood heavy thunderstorms admirably using a tarp as an additional footprint.)

My second best camping buy ever was a Therm-a-rest. No matter the weather, the comfort of these is worth spending money on.

Sleeping bags are rated for "survival" at the lowest quoted temperature, assuming the sleeper is also wearing appropriate underclothing. You will not be happy sleeping, if you sleep at all, at that lower temperature. Buy the kids cheap sleeping bags for now, with blankets or quilt/duvets on top if necessary. Don't buy a good one for them until they are big enough for an adult bag.

For light, LEDs all the way in this day and age. I still bring the propane lantern, but it rarely gets used anymore.

TE

 

[bassJAM]

My second best camping buy ever was a Therm-a-rest. No matter the weather, the comfort of these is worth spending money on.

I used to laugh at my dad when he'd camp with us, and sleeping on the ground would ruin his entire day. Not I'm 31 and completely understand. Now I've got a cheap foam mattress for just camping, and an ultra light and compressible Stoic air mattress for backpacking. It makes a WORLD of difference!

 

[TradEddie]

I used to laugh at my dad when he'd camp with us, and sleeping on the ground would ruin his entire day. Not I'm 31 and completely understand. Now I've got a cheap foam mattress for just camping, and an ultra light and compressible Stoic air mattress for backpacking. It makes a WORLD of difference!

Just like me, I camped on a tight budget and always considered those an extravagance, then one time I was given one to use, and I would never be without one now.

TE

 

[peakbagger]

A couple of things to keep in mind on tents.

Any tent put away wet will mildew no matter how expensive it was. Once mildewed throw it away.

Any tent left in damp place (basement) can deteriorate when stored

UV deteriorates most tents especially synthetics, if you are going to leave they tent up as a play tent for days at a time throw a tarp over it or just buy a walmart special

Nylon tents are usually waterproofed with polyurethane that deteriorates over time, some manufacturers will replace if it happens. Some cheap tents wont last more than a couple of years. The odor of old polyurethane is reminiscent of fresh cut red oak.

Most bug spray destroys water proofing, Spray a tent with it to keep away the bugs doesnt so anything for the bugs and damages the fabric.

Most synthetic tents are flammable and even the so called fireproofed version can still can damaged from heat. There should be not open flames at all in a tent which is contrary to many folks wanting to use a candle or stove in a tent .

Most Scout troops buy tents with two doors. It cuts down on a lot of traffic through the tent and is safer.

Ask around, many folks have spare tents. I have at least one I would give away to anyone who wanted to go camping with their kid.

 

[DBNH22]

I bought a Quest tent in the late 90's that I used about six or seven times per season for about four or five years and then never used it again. I took it out of the attic last year and aired it out and it was in good condition and still useable.

These days Dick's Sporting Goods carries Quest:

(broken link removed to http://www.dickssportinggoods.com/product/index.jsp?productId=30766776&lmdn=Brand&cp=4406646.4413993.4414966)

This tent goes for $150 sleeps six people and comes with a rain fly. It's kind of midlevel as you were suggesting. If there's a Dick's in your area you may want to check it out. they usually have them set up in the store.

Whichever tent you get I'd advise applying some type of sealant to the seams on both the tent and the rain fly.

 

[jharkin]

I think we were in the same Troop!

Wow I missed this one. I think I was in the same boy scout troop also - it always rained on every campout, hike, backpacking trip, jamboree, you name it. We wouldnt even bother to trust the tent waterproofing and would bring huge sheets of 4mil plastic to make the bottom of hte tent into a tub, and it was a ritual to line our packs with trash bags and go over very seam with seam sealer before trips. Having your boots squish squish sqish all weekend because they soaked though inspite of the dozen waterproofing treatments you used (and we tried everything - silicone, sno-seal, biwell, you name it) was par for the course. this was especially fun on day 2 of a 3 day backpack when it was 40 degrees out, everything was soaked and there was 10 miles to the nearest road....

This was the 80s when GoreTex was prohibitively expensive and there where no cell phones or GPSs to call for help. I miss those days


I can remember only one time we bailed out and went home. A council jamboree where the rain was so bad the entire campground flooded with a foot of water. Otherwise we stuck it out in anything and I came home nearly hypothermic far too many times.

builds character cant wait to take my boy....

 

[bassJAM]

^ I feel lucky compared to you! It always rained, but our troop bought about 5 Kelty tents the year I joined. They were reserved for scouts that had at least 1st Class rank, so you can bet I had 1st class as soon as possible! My brother said they lasted through about 5 years, 12 weekends per year, before they started leaking which I'd call consider pretty good considering some boys treated them better than others. Lower ranked scouts were stuck in old Coleman tents with tarps over them, and they still leaked.

 

[Ashful]

Great description, Jeremy. That sounds like at least half our trips out. I do remember one time when we got bizarrely warm weather in February, and were running around in T-shirts. Just about every other trip it seemed we'd get hit with some major rain. We even had the remnants of a tropical storm pass thru one night during one two-week outing, in which lightning actually hit the lean-to shelter where we had stored all our backpacks, just a few yards from our circle of tents. No one injured, but probably a few soiled sleeping bags, that night. My years in scouts were maybe 1980 - 1988. My grandfather was an active scout 1922 - 1990, and I have his 50 and 60 year pins stowed away somewhere.

 

[jharkin]

Cool Joful... Similar experience but a little later on, I think - i started cubs around '82 or 83 and boy scouts from around 87 till '94 when I graduated HS. We typically camped 1 weekend a month during the school year Sep-May regardless of weather, including at leas t one winter cabin trip and one big backpack in the white mountains every year. Did 2 weeks of summer camp at a camp called Workcoeman in Northern CT. I was a JLTC leadership instructor at a camp called Lake of Isles (closed down now and sold off the land to be a casino i think) and we also got to do some fun high adventure trips - an annual weekend at the Ookpik winter base in Maine (xcountry ski camping and building igloos) and we got to go to the West Point jamboree twice( my buddy and I snuck off the campground and into their basic training obstacle course and brought home some spent smoke grenades as souveniers ).

Rain at almost everything, and we didn't have any high end gear. The troop had old Eureka green timberline A-frame tents and I remember taking those backpack trips with nothing but work boots for footwear, a simple rubber coated nylon poncho and an old fashioned external frame pack. We would lug those heavy eureka tents and coleman white gas stoves up the mountain on backpacks. Soooo uncomfortable by todays standard.

 

[Jags]

Every time I see the local boyscout troops drive by with the equipment trailer on Fri night, my first thoughts are.."Gonna rain this weekend"