Summit Insert - Glorified Fireplace and Nothing More - Faulty Install?

[Nelson]

This may sound silly but try knocking a few pieces of your wood together. If it has a loud, hollow sound, it should be relatively dry. If it doesn't have a hollow ring to it (more like a dull thud), it's likely too wet.

 

[Grisu]

Btw. I also recommend an IR thermometer to check your stove temps. That will tell you if you even get your insert hot enough.

 

[Rossco]

Contact the installer. They might bring a few dry splits and investigate the problem.

Atleast eliminate one possible theory.

 

[BrotherBart]

I hate it when these show up every year and I can't stop over with an arm full of splits and make that bad boy walk and talk.

Did it a couple of times with members that were local.

 

[Hogwildz]

Why the hell are you trying to burn today? Way too warm, and that may also be part of your problem.
It ain't the stove, that leaves the liner or the wood.
Where in PA are you?

 

[mfetcho]

I have a PE T6 and I burned today when it was 61 deg. outside with no issues. I know everyone on here is so set on the moisture of the wood being so critical, but there is some leeway here. I have burned over the 20% and my stove cranks it. I cleaned this year after a year of burning with next to nothing for creosote. They can handle more then I read on this site. It sounds like you have an issue going on, but I don't know what. I would contact the shop you purchased the stove at.

 

[weatherguy]

I have a PE T6 and I burned today when it was 61 deg. outside with no issues. I know everyone on here is so set on the moisture of the wood being so critical, but there is some leeway here. I have burned over the 20% and my stove cranks it. I cleaned this year after a year of burning with next to nothing for creosote. They can handle more then I read on this site. It sounds like you have an issue going on, but I don't know what. I would contact the shop you purchased the stove at.

Sure 25% will burn, oak under 2 years is probably 30%+. The wood won't go to waste, you can let it season and either find some dry wood or burn a compressed wood product.

 

[thechimneysweep]

Sounds like something is blocking the air supply intake for your Summit. The Summit ships with a cover over the room air intake, to facilitate combustion of air introduced into the fireplace from outside. If your installers didn't provide for outside air to the existing fireplace, you need to remove the room air cover as described on page 8 of your owner's manual at (broken link removed to http://www.chimneysweeponline.com/pemanualsuminsb.pdf)

 

[JoeysDad]

Hi all,

I spoke with the installer and he indicated the wood brick in the stove has considerable moisture that needs to evaporate over the first several fires to get the full effect. He said the next start shouldn't be nearly as difficult and to contact him if it is. I'll be attempting this soon.

I also ruled out the possibility of the wood being the problem. I checked a random sample of 10 logs from my wood and the highest moisture content reading was 18.4%.

 

[begreen]

Did they remove the air intake knockouts?

For your next fire, try resplitting a batch of splits until they are 2-3" thick. Retest for moisture on the freshly split face of the wood. If it is higher, that is part of the problem. If so, bring the freshly resplit wood into the house and let it sit in the open room air for a day or two. Then try starting the fire with this wood.

Note that draft will improve as temps drop, quite notably when it gets below about 45F outside.

 

[bholler]

well i think his explanation doesn't sound right the moisture in the bricks should have been driven out with your break in fires. Did you test you wood on a fresh split face? If so and your wood is good it is either lack of enough air in the house or faulty install. The first thing i would check is the cover that the chimney sweep referred to i personally don't have experience with the stove so i cant help more but if the wood is good get the installer out to check it out he should stand behind it. We have gone out many times usually it is simple operator error but sometimes we find negative pressure problems or other issues

 

[JoeysDad]

Did they remove the air intake knockouts?

They really should have... I don't know if I can tell with the stove installed without pulling it. Is there anything I can feel for under there to tell?

 

[begreen]

 

[Woody Stover]

try knocking a few pieces of your wood together. If it has a loud, hollow sound, it should be relatively dry. If it doesn't have a hollow ring to it (more like a dull thud), it's likely too wet.

I've found the "ring test" to be hit and miss. Some pieces just don't ring, no matter how dry and a lot of wood that isn't quite dry enough to ring will still burn OK. After a while, you get a feel for the heft of various species but again, it's hard to tell exactly how dry it is unless it's just super-light. There's a sticky thread at the top describing how to test wood with a multimeter.

Note that draft will improve as temps drop, quite notably when it gets below about 45F outside.

Still, I think it should pull OK with 19' of stack even if it's not real cold out.

I think about 19 feet is the official height.

Is this installed in a masonry fireplace, and if so is a liner installed to the top?

 

[Hogwildz]

Here is some photos for reference.
The box is what they should have removed.
If they left it with any other parts, it was removed, unless they took it or disposed of it.
If it ain't there and they didn't take it, chances are it's still on the insert.
The other photos show the holes where it was mounted. And the two side shots are the screws needed to be removed to remove the plate under there for access to removing the box once unscrewed. I left the plate low, resting against the hearth to help keep debris from making their way back underneath.

 

[Cynnergy]

My Super 27 bricks were really wet for my first few fires - so much so that I had a few drips of creosote out of the stove on the first two fires. It took me at least 3 burns to get the stove over 400F. After that, things started going much better.

 

[lml999]

I will buy a moisture reader, but this stuff should be decent. I just bought it though with assurance it's been seasoned > 1 year from a reputable supplier.

Borrow some known good wood from a friendly neighbor. One armful, start from scratch, see how that burns.

My bet's on the wood. I bought wood once from a reputable supplier, and the stuff wouldn't burn no matter what I did.

 

[Bigg_Redd]

Hi all,

I just had the Summit insert installed yesterday and am having a horrible time with it. It looks great, but so far only operates as a fireplace. I can get the fire ripping and roaring pretty well with little smoke in the house, but only with the door open. As soon as close the door, the fire goes down to embers within a minute or two, killing the fire I had going at a strong rate. The air control is set to START, and I have a few windows open to ensure proper draft. No matter what combination of wood, kindling, and paper I have tried, closing the door has 100% always resulted in the destruction of the fire. After 5 hours of this I'm beyond frustrated.

BTW, I paid top dollar to have this professionally installed, so install error SHOULD be out of the question. What the heck could I possibly be missing here?

If I were a betting man I'd bet your chimney isn't tall enough. Or, if it is tall enough there's something blocking it.

 

[Bigg_Redd]

I just bought it though with assurance it's been seasoned

This means your wood is green, and if you're lucky will be OK by next year.

 

[BurningBrutus]

This may be a really dumb question, but is the lever all the way to the left, wide open? when you close your door?

 

[brenndatomu]

What was the outside temp when you were trying to burn? A combination of warm ambient air temp/ wood that is not super dry/ and wet firebricks would make for a hard time for sure. Also, try adding some kiln dried lumber (2x4s or?) to the load mix, or bust up a pallet, that stuff is super dry.
It is pretty common for people to have a hard time on the first few fires, I did, I guess it is the wet bricks?
I was gonna ask the same question as Brutus, ^^^ are you sure the air control is in the wide open position? I'm not familiar with this stove, anybody else?

 

[JoeysDad]

From what I can tell, I'm burning well now. It took a couple really hot burns and many starts to "break" this unit in. Now I can start it effortlessly like I expected. I'm having a heck of a time keeping the glass looking clear though. The first couple of times it stayed f

My Super 27 bricks were really wet for my first few fires - so much so that I had a few drips of creosote out of the stove on the first two fires. It took me at least 3 burns to get the stove over 400F. After that, things started going much better.

Bingo. That's what the installer said too when I spoke with him on Saturday.

After getting the box hot multiple times, the fires all of a sudden started enduring, even with the door closed. It seems quite likely the firebrick was releasing moisture initially and that it was putting out the fire when the door was closed.

I'm able to start it now without even thinking. I just set it up, light it, close the door, and check back in about 30 minutes to see flames everywhere. I turn down the air control to about the middle and let that go for a little before finally putting it to roughly between the middle-low air control setting.

I've been able to achieve overall great temperatures and have not used oil for our heating needs since temperatures started going down (thermostat is set to 40). Last night the temperature got down to 32 degrees but inside I was hovering at a consistent 71 degrees without issue. I actually had to turn down the fan and air control because the house was getting far too hot. At one point I had the house at 78 degrees and just couldn't take it anymore. The insert had made it's point. My house is a piece of cake to heat for this thing.

Any significant concerns about heating the house are basically gone. My focus will now be on making the house tighter.

 

[Cynnergy]

My glass is easy to keep clear as long as you burn it at a decent temp for a decent amount of time. I think I cleaned it twice last year (weekend-only burner). Yours should too if you're getting that sort of performance. Keep at it and if you still have issues, let us know.

 

[tarzan]

As mentioned above, get yourself a bundle of kiln dried wood. Quick and easy way to start the trouble shooting process.

Sorry, didn't see your last post before posting this so if you do try some kiln dried wood it probably wouldn't be a good idea to light it and leave for 30 minutes with the primary air control all the way open.

 

[Ram 1500 with an axe...]

From what I can tell, I'm burning well now. It took a couple really hot burns and many starts to "break" this unit in. Now I can start it effortlessly like I expected. I'm having a heck of a time keeping the glass looking clear though. The first couple of times it stayed f


Bingo. That's what the installer said too when I spoke with him on Saturday.

After getting the box hot multiple times, the fires all of a sudden started enduring, even with the door closed. It seems quite likely the firebrick was releasing moisture initially and that it was putting out the fire when the door was closed.

I'm able to start it now without even thinking. I just set it up, light it, close the door, and check back in about 30 minutes to see flames everywhere. I turn down the air control to about the middle and let that go for a little before finally putting it to roughly between the middle-low air control setting.

I've been able to achieve overall great temperatures and have not used oil for our heating needs since temperatures started going down (thermostat is set to 40). Last night the temperature got down to 32 degrees but inside I was hovering at a consistent 71 degrees without issue. I actually had to turn down the fan and air control because the house was getting far too hot. At one point I had the house at 78 degrees and just couldn't take it anymore. The insert had made it's point. My house is a piece of cake to heat for this thing.

Any significant concerns about heating the house are basically gone. My focus will now be on making the house tighter.

Bingo...... Sometimes you just need to relax, keep at it and all will be good.....your a newbie so it's ok, the glass issue will be a forgotten issue by February or so....keep at it.....