So the shopping begins...

[mellow]

I have had both, a Cat and currently tubes. Both seem to frustrate the wife at times, but that is not the stoves fault.

My next stove/insert will be a Cat, the consistent heat output wins hands down in my book, this whole burn to 500 then shut the air down and let it get to 550 mess is the pits. I liked getting it up to 400 then shutting it down and letting the cat do the work. It is a wonderful thing seeing nothing but the cat glowing and your top plate cruising at 550.

There are other cat stoves out there other than BK and Woodstock, but you do get what you pay for.

 

[snowleopard]

We have some folks here that burn two (or more!) stoves in their houses. You could run a search, or start another thread asking for more info about life with more than one stove.

 

[eclecticcottage]

Will be interesting!
Used to be the weather man around here would give you heating degree days and seems you could get the total at the end of the season..maybe I'm wrong but you don't hear that talk anymore.
Sure has been warm...my sleds are getting restless.lol.

I haven't even looked at mine this year! We don't even have snow in the UP yet which is crazy...........

It is crazy!


Back on topic..lol.

Would you rather teach your wife how to run a cat stove or a tube stove..I'm curious to what people would say.

Lol...well...I haven't ever played with a cat stove, but DH is catching onto the non-cat ok. He wants to damp her down too soon usually but he's finally got the stacking in the fire box down so he doesn't have logs falling into the glass on a regular basis and gets that the splits or bricks need to "breathe" more now too (he liked to stack too tight so the fire couldn't get any air between the splits).

Next will be the pre-epa "cone" stove, which he should be good at since his family had one (you know, the open kind with no glass/doors, just a screen, popular in the 70's I believe-it's not a Preway but similar) that's in the sunroom and not being run this season. Then a pellet stove for an addition we want to put on.

 

[HotCoals]

The reason I say to go a little bigger then need be is you never know how tight the house is.
Very cold temps do hit some areas big time...not to forget wind.
Not having a big enough stove during those times can be disheartening.
I'm also saying even a big cat stove such as a BKK or whatever will cruise at lower temps then a tube stove if need be.
I don't think many would argue the fact that a cat stove does a better job in the shoulder season.
Not only that but I can always put in less wood and still burn very efficiently.
Check out the efficiently ratings ratings between the two types.
I know for a fact that I can run my stove in 45-50 avg temps and not overheat the house much and go 30-40 hours in that scenario.
Will your tube stove do that?

 

[BrotherBart]

Points made hotcoals. This isn't a cat vs. non-cat thread.

 

[HotCoals]

Points made hotcoals. This isn't a cat vs. non-cat thread.

Well with all due respect sir..it kinda is.
He wants the best stove for his install for the money..I find the money part secondary because of the useable years involved.
Once he decides on which type of stove he wants we can work it from there.
I'm not saying a secondary tube stove is out of the running..noway sir...just saying a cat stove should be considered.

 

[Jags]

Lots of thoughtful posts already so I am going to cut to the chase. Since you already stated that a Blaze King or the BMF (progress) is an option - go with one of those. I personally would go with the BMF cuz the BK's just don't tickle my fancy for appearance.

Best of both worlds. Big stove, lots of fuel with the ability to be toned down when you don't need kick'in BTU's. Win-Win.

Just one dudes opinion.

 

[HotCoals]

From the op's first post.

As I figure, some of the questions should be:
- Can it heat that house?
- Cat/non-cat?
- Englander= +/- $600-900 or so, Woodstock +/-$2400 or more- I would expect there to be as dramatic a difference as between a Chevette and a Mercedes. Could anyone specify whether that’s true?
- N/S loading I think would be kind of nice, but I’m doing ok now with E/W (I may be over-thinking here…)

Any thoughts from the gang here would be welcome…

 

[eclecticcottage]

I note this from your first post: "though it does need to be ‘pretty’ for final approval". That may rule out the BK Princess, depending on what the Mrs. considers "pretty".

This I have to agree with. Aside from the guardian model, I find their stoves to look pretty ugly. And with just a quick look, I tend to think that's a non-cat-my Lopi is more efficient and has lower emmissions.

 

[HotCoals]

The Princess is a cat.
Now I have to check the numbers..lol.
Normally a tube stove wont win there.
Not to mention those numbers can be deceiving.
Are those numbers at optimal burn or for the whole burn comes to mind...(avg).
Maybe someone could enlighten me to that.

 

[HotCoals]

It seems those two stoves are perfect to compare.
The numbers are close all the way around..except for burn times..and that explains why the Princess has half the heat output but twice the burn time..roughly.

The princess.

Minimum Heat Output 6,400 Btu’s/hr
Average High Heat Output 40,000 Btu’s/hr
Overall Efficiency 82.5%
Emissions 2.42gr/hr
Wood Length 16â€/20â€
Low Burn Time 20 Hours
Unit Dimensions

Width 27†/ 685.8mm
Height 34 3/4†/ 882.65mm
Depth 29†/ 736.6mm
Weight 430# / 195kg
Flue Diameter 6†/ 152.4mm

The Lopi 1750

Heating Capacity
1,200 to 2,000 Sq. Feet Steady State Efficiency
78.8%
Weight
430 Lbs. Heat Output
72,400 BTU's / Hour
Maximum Burn Time
10 Hours Firebox Size
2.2 Cubic Feet
Maximum Log Size
18 " Emissions
1.9 Grams Per Hour
Construction
5/16" to 3/16" Steel Plate

 

[eclecticcottage]

I should say I think the guardian is a non-cat. The site says the princess and king are cats....

 

[HotCoals]

I should say I think the guardian is a non-cat. The site says the princess and king are cats....

10-4..I thought you were referring to the princess because of the post you quoted to..my bad.
But it seems the The Princess and the Lopi 1750 is a great comparison..cat/non cat.

 

[HotCoals]

If the OP would like to see more info on those two stoves to compare.
Either stove will heat you home nicely..but if you're looking for long burn rates at lower btu's in your warmer climate i would recommend the Princess.
The Princess can put out the btu's also if called upon.

(broken link removed to http://www.blazeking.com/EN/wood-princess.html)
(broken link removed to http://www.lopistoves.com/productuide/detail.aspx?id=247#Specs)

 

[certified106]

If your going to be a serious 24/7 burner go with either the Woodstock or Blaze king, you'll be glad you did.

So by that I assume I am a non serious heat my house 24/7 burner...........
I do think the Progess is an awesome stove though and would have considered it had it been for sale when I replaced my stove

 

[eclecticcottage]

Hmm...weird, I figured a cat would have a lower emmissions output than a non-cat, especially since it's showing a higher efficiency.

What are the clearances on the Princess? The Republic is unreal low on the back, which is why we bought it over any other stove, save the Endeavor, so the hearth wasn't so far into the room which was originally only going to be about 12' deep (it ended up 14' when we decided not to rebuild the closets we had to tear out to redo the floor/floor joists).

Edit, I found them in the manual...I think it's 16" or 13" on the back.

Also, if you're liking the Republic, it has a "nicer" sister stove, the Endeavor. I actually like the Republic better...and not just cuz it's less expensive either.

 

[HotCoals]

Hmm...weird, I figured a cat would have a lower emmissions output than a non-cat, especially since it's showing a higher efficiency.

What are the clearances on the Princess? The Republic is unreal low on the back, which is why we bought it over any other stove, save the Endeavor, so the hearth wasn't so far into the room which was originally only going to be about 12' deep (it ended up 14' when we decided not to rebuild the closets we had to tear out to redo the floor/floor joists).

I think the numbers are so close that it's a moot point of the diffs...closer then I thought they would be.

 

[bluedogz]

Points made hotcoals. This isn't a cat vs. non-cat thread.

Well with all due respect sir..it kinda is.
He wants the best stove for his install for the money..I find the money part secondary because of the useable years involved.
Once he decides on which type of stove he wants we can work it from there.
I'm not saying a secondary tube stove is out of the running..noway sir...just saying a cat stove should be considered.

Actually, it is but I totally did not want to incite a p****ing match.

I am trying to determine which stove can do the job. For example, I could drive a Toyota Yaris for like $9k, but if I have 3 kids it'd be a bad idea regardless of budget. If an NC30 is suitable (for $600 or so), woo-hoo! If it isn't, better to find out without buying it.

The money part is SORT OF secondary, in that I see a stove as an investment, but also cannot swear I'll keep this house for the useful life of a $3k stove. So, there's a little bit of, 'Will I own a Progress or whatever long enough to make it worthwhile?'

 

[BrotherBart]

People need to tell you the good and the bad about stoves that they own or have owned. Not all the bad stuff about ones they don't own is my point. In a thread like this when we start talking to each other instead of the OP it is a good sign that it is heading off the rails and not helping.

"My daddy can whip your daddy." etc. :lol:

 

[HotCoals]

Points made hotcoals. This isn't a cat vs. non-cat thread.

Well with all due respect sir..it kinda is.
He wants the best stove for his install for the money..I find the money part secondary because of the useable years involved.
Once he decides on which type of stove he wants we can work it from there.
I'm not saying a secondary tube stove is out of the running..noway sir...just saying a cat stove should be considered.

Actually, it is but I totally did not want to incite a p****ing match.

I am trying to determine which stove can do the job. For example, I could drive a Toyota Yaris for like $9k, but if I have 3 kids it'd be a bad idea regardless of budget. If an NC30 is suitable (for $600 or so), woo-hoo! If it isn't, better to find out without buying it.

The money part is SORT OF secondary, in that I see a stove as an investment, but also cannot swear I'll keep this house for the useful life of a $3k stove. So, there's a little bit of, 'Will I own a Progress or whatever long enough to make it worthwhile?'

Well maybe you could take the stove with you if the new owner didn't want it..or just put your old stove in.
There are so many variables and what ifs.

I hope we have helped you and have not confused you even more.
I still stand by my recommendation of a cat stove for your climate just on the facts of less chance of overheating your house in mild temps and for long easy burns.

 

[HotCoals]

People need to tell you the good and the bad about stoves that they own or have owned. Not all the bad stuff about ones they don't own is my point. In a thread like this when we start talking to each other instead of the OP it is a good sign that it is heading off the rails and not helping.

"My daddy can whip your daddy." etc. :lol:

I did say I'm not impressed on the t-stat all that much on the Blaze Kings.
I did say both types of stoves will heat his house nicely.
I don't think I'm out of line saying a cat stove will burn longer and lower since those are facts.

I think of a nice tube stove as a car with a turbo.
I think of a cat stove as a diesel truck without the smoke.lol.
One revs way more to get to the same place.

I know..analogies are seldom useful...lol.

 

[Hogwildz]

As neither a tube"r", nor a cat"er", Having a S.S. baffle box, which is non cat secondary, in a "larger" stove, the Summit, I have no problems running the Summit in the shoulder seasons, without overheating the house.
Granted the long burn times of the cats or BK's re impressive. But the insinuating that a secondary burn stove cannot heat without overheating in the shoulder season, or get decent burn times, Is complete BS.
I can let the firebox alone for 12-14 hrs in the shoulder seasons, and still have coals to relight a new load. I can also load partial loads and get the same effect, but with more frequent loading. Yes, I cannot get 24 hours out of a load, and that is impressive. But when the temps hit the teens and single digits, I still think the difference of the cat vs non cat plays less and less as the temps drop.
I personally would love to have a BKK just to see for myself how much is real world, and how much is BS. But I ain't spending $4K+ for the chance to check it out.
No rush Blue, research and make an informed decision. Whichever you decide, I'll help if needed.
My opinion.....you cannot beat the cost, support, and performance with the Englander. Hands down, the most stove for the money spent.
Not to mention, you get to see a fire, and not just a glowing cat though black soot covered glass....LMAO, just had to say it, sorry.

 

[HotCoals]

As neither a tube"r", nor a cat"er", Having a S.S. baffle box, which is non cat secondary, in a "larger" stove, the Summit, I have no problems running the Summit in the shoulder seasons, without overheating the house.
Granted the long burn times of the cats or BK's re impressive. But the insinuating that a secondary burn stove cannot heat without overheating in the shoulder season, or get decent burn times, Is complete BS.
I can let the firebox alone for 12-14 hrs in the shoulder seasons, and still have coals to relight a new load. I can also load partial loads and get the same effect, but with more frequent loading. Yes, I cannot get 24 hours out of a load, and that is impressive. But when the temps hit the teens and single digits, I still think the difference of the cat vs non cat plays less and less as the temps drop.
I personally would love to have a BKK just to see for myself how much is real world, and how much is BS. But I ain't spending $4K+ for the chance to check it out.
No rush Blue, research and make an informed decision. Whichever you decide, I'll help if needed.
My opinion.....you cannot beat the cost, support, and performance with the Englander. Hands down, the most stove for the money spent.
Not to mention, you get to see a fire, and not just a glowing cat though black soot covered glass....LMAO, just had to say it, sorry.

I do agree with that statement.

 

[begreen]

Guess that makes us "box'ers" Hog. All part of the mani-fold family of secondary combusters.

 

[HotCoals]

Not to mention, you get to see a fire, and not just a glowing cat though black soot covered glass....LMAO, just had to say it, sorry.

That's ok.
If I want to see a fire I just add air.
Once you learn the stove..black glass is not a huge problem.
But for me..the 24 hour reloads are priceless..just sayin'.
I have gone 35-40.