Smokin EKO

[mousebndr]

Hi All

We just turned on our new Eko 60 and it's going great, the only issue is we only get a 7 hour burn time (till no fuel left in chamber) which seems low compared to what I read here. The burn time does not worry me all that much since the storage seems to fill in the shortfall but I still wonder if we have got the unit setup right.

I get a flame in the gassification chamber which has a tinge of blue and it fills the U of the refractory. Playing with the secondaries really does not seem to make much of a differences to the flame.

The biggest issue is the smoke, the unit smokes a lot. Opening the gassification chamber door you get a fair bit of smoke and opening the main chamber you get heaps of smoke. When in full gassification mode with a good flame there is also a lot of smoke pouring out of the flue.

I also can't seem to manage a prolonged gassification, when I poke the coals is rips up to a beautiful flame but if I go back 20mins later there is hardy a flame at all.

From what I have read in the fine tuning eko forum this seems to indicate the primaries are too open.... but they are already at 9mm...

Current settings are:
Wood 17%-20%
4000L storage
Primaries 9-10mm (they are closed as far as they will allow, one side went to 9mm the other won't get smaller than 10mm)
Secondaries 3 turns
Blowers 50%

 

[huffdawg]

Your wood might be bridging. IE. hanging up on the sides. as the stuff underneath burns away. whisch usually means the chunks are to big or too long.

You should run your fan at 80 to 100 % till the fire gets going good, then decrease.

Also congrats on the new system. I only get 3 to 4 hours burn time on my EKO 40 . It makes quite a difference what kind of wood your burning also. How long did it take to heat up your storage? Thats the beauty of storage ,you can burn wide open , more efficient.

Huff

 

[Eric Johnson]

My two thoughts are: Wood that's not dry enough or, Refractory still needs to dry out and break in. The refractory on new gasifiers still contains moisture and you have to burn it for a few days (or weeks) to get it all dried out so that you get a good burn going. Moisture--either from the wood or any other source--kills the reaction. So, patience is probably in order. My 60 smokes like bastid every fall when I crank it up for the first time, since I don't fire it in the summer and it sucks up moisture from the air. If your wood hasn't been cut and drying for two years, it's probably a bit wet and won't really burn right. That's a fact most people don't want to accept at first, but I've found it to be true. If you're getting blue smoke, it's because of moisture. You need to cut your wood two years in advance. As to your burn time, 7 hours sounds about right for a 60. I can get about 8 hours in the dead of winter if I really load it up with good wood. It all depends on your load and other unique features of your setup, so any estimates on burn time are pretty suspect without some important facts to base them on.

 

[mousebndr]

Hmmm thanks it was a bit better last night so that may be it

What about the secondaries? From what I read here it should be like adjusting an oxy torch but mine never seem to make a difference

I also seem to get lots of bridging... Been trying all sorts of stacking tricks to get the coals down low.

 

[stee6043]

Where have you read here that a 7 hour burn is too short?? Holy smokes, that's a long burn. That's double what most of us get with gasifiers on storage. You should be shooting for something closer to 4 hours max. 3 hours with a really premium load of wood and an excellent burn. If you're getting 7 hours you've got some tuning to do.

My experience is that smaller splits is bar-none the best and most tried and true solution to bridging. Of course this is typically a solution that can't be tried until year two if you already have your stacks set for this year. Split small and watch the bridging issue go away almost instantly.

 

[mousebndr]

Where have you read here that a 7 hour burn is too short?? Holy smokes, that's a long burn. That's double what most of us get with gasifiers on storage. You should be shooting for something closer to 4 hours max. 3 hours with a really premium load of wood and an excellent burn. If you're getting 7 hours you've got some tuning to do.

My experience is that smaller splits is bar-none the best and most tried and true solution to bridging. Of course this is typically a solution that can't be tried until year two if you already have your stacks set for this year. Split small and watch the bridging issue go away almost instantly.

OK sounds like I should be happy with the 7 hrs, nice

Thanks will try to half a few of the splits I have and see what happens.

Any idea on where I am going wrong with tuning? My primaries are 9mm and secondaries still not showing much difference. Should I be worried?

 

[taxidermist]

when you say you fan is 50% is that the speed or the amount the shutter is open? Also like they said you need smaller splits,7 hrs tells me you might be using some bigger rounds and you have a lazy fire in the upper chamber. Spend some time and split a pile into smaller splits and run that and report back
Rob

 

[mousebndr]

when you say you fan is 50% is that the speed or the amount the shutter is open? Also like they said you need smaller splits,7 hrs tells me you might be using some bigger rounds and you have a lazy fire in the upper chamber. Spend some time and split a pile into smaller splits and run that and report back
Rob

50% on the shutters. My controller allows me to set max % of blower in the service mode but I have not played with that

 

[huffdawg]

I wonder if his burn times seem unusually long, if the boiler is idleing on him for some reason . you also get blue smoke then . Do you notice if your fans kicks out at all during the seven hour burn times.

Huff.

 

[mousebndr]

I am usually asleep But it's always above 80c when I get up.

I have never heard the fan go off while it's been going during the day

 

[huffdawg]

-To set your fan speed push and hold in the ok button till the red light above it blinks.
- then push the ok button once . the n100 will display
- then push the stop button to slow down fan speed and the start button increase fan speed
- once desired speed is displayed press ok .

I printed out page 14 of the manual and keep it close to the boiler room.

 

[huffdawg]

What temp does your storage get up to. if your storage temp is satisfied before your wood burns out your boiler will idle .

 

[mousebndr]

What temp does your storage get up to. if your storage temp is satisfied before your wood burns out your boiler will idle .

Boiler is set to 90c and the storage gets up to about 80c at the top and 50c at the bottom so it's not been fully charged as yet

 

[taxidermist]

50% on the shutters. My controller allows me to set max % of blower in the service mode but I have not played with that

Yep I know I have a eko 60,How big is the wood your burning?

 

[mousebndr]

Yep I know I have a eko 60,How big is the wood your burning?

Splits - about 30cm long and 20-25cm diameter at the thickest part (triangle shaped)

 

[taxidermist]

Splits - about 30cm long and 20-25cm diameter at the thickest part (triangle shaped)

so thats 11in long x 9in thick?

mine are 51cm long and 11-14cm thick

 

[Fred61]

Bridging occurs for more than one reason. If your wood is too wet, the coals deplete and the moisture in the log above is slowed from replacing them because moisture is slowing combustion.

 

[maple1]

Did you moisture test on a freshly split surface?

 

[taxidermist]

also are you loading side to side our front to back? I load front to back and I also let the coals/ash build up on the sides because it forms a V to help so i dont get bridging.

Rob

 

[mousebndr]

Did you moisture test on a freshly split surface?

Yep pretty steady 17.5%, that tree was dead for 10 years before I split it so it's very dry hardwood

 

[mousebndr]

also are you loading side to side our front to back? I load front to back and I also let the coals/ash build up on the sides because it forms a V to help so i dont get bridging.

Rob

I load so the splits are parallel to the unit, I get two splits in length ways and 3-4 across at the top. After I have a good bed of coals in the middle of the chamber I fill it right up.

Will try to get coals up on the side and see what happens

 

[huffdawg]

I fill mine right up. first with kindling and then the rest with small splits. I light it from the secondary chamber with map gas torch. I wait for 2 to 3 minutes close bypass and then start with fan on 100% once no smoke coming from chimney I turn fan down to 60 %. that works good for me. Minimal smoke !

 

[rkusek]

so thats 11in long x 9in thick?

mine are 51cm long and 11-14cm thick

I agree with the others that it sounds like bridging. With storage and fan on 100%, I would think you would have a max burn time of around 4 hrs (if bottom of tank is still 50C). Triangle shapes 20-25cm wide to 30cm long is like 9in x 12in. which is too big around. Eko manual says max diameter is 7in. and length is 23in. My prefered size is about 4in x 20in. or about 10cm x 50cm. Others here say a playing card size for the face of the split. Since I never cut perfect length logs in woods, I always try no to cut them a few inches shorter than the max. Even then, it seems I still get a 23-24in piece every now and then and it goes at the very top of the loading at an angle. My bridging problems disappeared when I went to the smaller splits. Plus the wood dries out quicker too. One word of warning however, I could see where really small splits that were very dry could be a problem (huffing & puffing) on a system without storage that has to idle a lot but with storage that should be less of a concern. A couple winters ago (no storage), I had to mix some wetter wood (25%) on the top 1/2 of a load of small splits that were really dry tp prevent huffing and puffing. All that said, I think if you split your pieces to 1/2 or 1/3 of what they are, load evenly, and see what burn times you get.

It could be the burning out the initial moisture in the refractory too like Eric said. I do remember the first few burns being that way. What are your pump start settings? I think many of us here found settings like 165 (pump on) and 160 (pump off) or something similar help achieve and maintain good gassification. The default settings are much less than this.

 

[mousebndr]

I agree with the others that it sounds like bridging. With storage and fan on 100%, I would think you would have a max burn time of around 4 hrs (if bottom of tank is still 50C). Triangle shapes 20-25cm wide to 30cm long is like 9in x 12in. which is too big around. Eko manual says max diameter is 7in. and length is 23in. My prefered size is about 4in x 20in. or about 10cm x 50cm. Others here say a playing card size for the face of the split. Since I never cut perfect length logs in woods, I always try no to cut them a few inches shorter than the max. Even then, it seems I still get a 23-24in piece every now and then and it goes at the very top of the loading at an angle. My bridging problems disappeared when I went to the smaller splits. Plus the wood dries out quicker too. One word of warning however, I could see where really small splits that were very dry could be a problem (huffing & puffing) on a system without storage that has to idle a lot but with storage that should be less of a concern. A couple winters ago (no storage), I had to mix some wetter wood (25%) on the top 1/2 of a load of small splits that were really dry tp prevent huffing and puffing. All that said, I think if you split your pieces to 1/2 or 1/3 of what they are, load evenly, and see what burn times you get.

It could be the burning out the initial moisture in the refractory too like Eric said. I do remember the first few burns being that way. What are your pump start settings? I think many of us here found settings like 165 (pump on) and 160 (pump off) or something similar help achieve and maintain good gassification. The default settings are much less than this.

Thanks. I think the split sizes are probably the problem, I will hack them up a bit this weekend to see how we go. Thanks for all your suggestions.

My pump switches on > 65C (so 149), the pump is a laddomat 21 which charges the storage - a magic device that! The zone pump is on a different circuit out of the storage tank.

Should I be worried about the secondaries not making much difference to the flame? Whenever I check the flame it is often blue (not always sometimes its yellow).

 

[taxidermist]

Thanks. I think the split sizes are probably the problem, I will hack them up a bit this weekend to see how we go. Thanks for all your suggestions.

My pump switches on > 65C (so 149), the pump is a laddomat 21 which charges the storage - a magic device that! The zone pump is on a different circuit out of the storage tank.

Should I be worried about the secondaries not making much difference to the flame? Whenever I check the flame it is often blue (not always sometimes its yellow).

sounds like your good on the secondaries. You will not always have a blue torch flame....... lots of things change thru the burn.

Rob