Should dealers take care of warrenty issues for stoves bought off the internet?

[MrGriz]

I just cast my vote for yes, they should honor the manufacturer's warranty. However, I do not think this is simply a black and white issue that has an unqualified answer. HB hit on it with his reply.

I believe that a dealer should honor the warranty, but with a much lower priority than honoring a warranty claim for a customer who bought from them. As a customer I would certainly expect that if I bought on the internet or from a different dealer and then called someone else for help, I would have to take a back seat to their customers. Maybe I'm not the normal customer, but that just makes sense to me.

I am cheap and I tend to look for a bargain whenever I can. That being said, there is often a trade off between cost savings and service. Take the big box stores for example. If I know exactly what I need and I know I don't need any technical advice, I am likely to opt for savings over service. On the other hand if I need some advice or assistance, I am more than willing to pay a bit more to go to a specialty store where I can get the information I need along with the product. Consumers need to remember that there is more to value than price alone.

 

[MountainStoveGuy]

it would be nice if manufactures woudl step up and pay reasonable warrenty labor wages. As it stands at the moment, it will cost me at least $100 to come fix your stove that you bought somewhere else. Why should my company be penalized for your decision to buy the stove elsewear? I also think that it stinks to put a customer on the back burner because they didnt choose to buy it from you. Wages should be reasonable, and so should the time frame that people get help. This time of year, if i waited untill i could afford the lousy wage the manufactures pay you would be cold untill spring.

 

[MrGriz]

MSG, I agree that it stinks to put a customer on the back burner. Don't you have to weigh the options though. On one hand, you take the best care of those who bought from you as possible. On the other, you put your customer on the back burner for someone who did the same to you when they bought.

It's a tough spot to be in. One of the big problems here is that the manufacturers don't seem to be supporting their dealers well. Mfr's need to understand this situation and at a bare minimum cover the dealers cost for performing a warranty repair. More reasonably they should make sure that you actually make a profit on the repair. After all, if they don't, eventually there will be no dealers left to perform their repairs warranty or otherwise.

I believe that you brought up the auto business earlier in this thread. I have almost a 20 year background in the auto business and could relate to this analogy well. Dealers could actually make money based on the factory's payment for warranty repairs. Since this was the case, most dealers would not put one warranty customer ahead of another simply based on where the vehicle was bought. It looks like this is the way that the stove industry needs to move. That being said, I do know if a couple of dealers that would prioritize their customers for warranty repairs and make someone who bought elsewhere wait. Incidentally, these were also dealers who had a reputation of charging a premium for their vehicles.

There is no easy answer; it's not a simple yes or no. What is the balance between customer service and good business practices?

 

[MountainStoveGuy]

I want to service everyone the same, and have it not cost me money, i dont care if i make money on the warrenty call or not, i would just like to break even and make every one happy. As it stands right now, no customer gets put on the back burner, but if they didnt buy if from us then they have to pay for labor, not parts. Its not the best situation, but its the only one that works for us. Manufactures dont care, i think they use it as a tool to keep people in there own service area and prevent calls to the manufacture, above everything, the manufacture does not want to be answering calls from consumers. Which is one of the main reasons most dont allow internet sales. They know if we sold it, that we are going to have to fix it. So whats there incentive to change?

 

[budman]

From a customer:

One of the main things I was looking for when I bought was a complete solution.

I went with a stove store that installed their own stuff, with their own staff.

The last thing I wanted (after dropping a bundle of money) was to have a problem, and have the dealer and the installer himming and hawing, finger pointing, etc.

I can see where you guys are coming from, if you aren't going to make money on the warrenty claim. I mean, I don't work for free either.

BTW, are these warrenty issues mainly pellet stoves, or wood stoves?

Kenny. Well said i have done the same and very happy with the stove,company and install and know
they will be there when needed!

 

[BrotherBart]

It can go all sorts of ways. When I bought the Jotul F3 and F100 from a local dealerthey came out to do the installations. After the F100 was installed in the warehouse they came over to install the F3 in my office at the house and dropped it on the sidewalk. The door wasn't latched and it broke the top hinge off the cast iron front housing of the stove. The dealer proceeded to get closed down by his bank while stalling about getting another stove. Luckily I wouldn't let them take the broken one back until they got the new one. It was a $1,400 door stop for a year until a very helpful dealer from a long way away from here helped get the part and I rebuilt the stove myself.

I never looked at it as a warranty issue. But the other local Jotul dealer couldn't be bothered to order me the part even though I wanted to pay full retail for it. I hope he goes broke too.

 

[GVA]

It's none of my business to tell you guy's you should or shouldn't, so I didn't vote...

But I know that the dealers are getting screwed on service calls for a stove that they didn't sell, and the guy 30 miles away did. He made his money on that gold warranty and then the manufacturer canned his contract to sell their stoves because his service sucked......... So now the dealerthat's left in the area has to take on all the warranty work for the other guy, and is losing money..... He may come to find out many were installed improperly and that is causing the unit to fail and that is not covered under waranty right? Any way the manufacturer would need to step up and add the extra cost of having the nearest dealer come do the repair work, the dealer should not be the one absorbing that cost.

IMO I think that the manufactures waranty should be just that not the selling dealer/manufacturer. And these guys should get a clue as to the cost of a certified guy to go and troubleshoot and fix the problems and yes this includes travel time and fuel, maybe then the certain recurring problems with these units will be fixed before they leave the factory..... As we all know cleaning related problems are not covered under warranty.
As far as internet sales I wouldn't touch them but that's your call.

So dealers heres a question for ya what % of your service calls related to improper maintainance? Just wondering?

 

[HarryBack]

I'd have to say upwards of 85%......5% manufacturing "errors"......9% actual righteous part failure......1% other.

 

[Roospike]

How many service calls are done a year per an average dealer?
I'm sure the selling of pellet stove is a big hit on the dealer vs not selling / servicing pellet stoves.

 

[HarryBack]

somewhere around 200 for us, and yes, mostly pellet stove service issues. Due to their mechanical nature, and the nature of the customer in avoiding to maintain said appliance, I can imagine pellet stoves being more service-intensive than other types of stoves.

 

[webbie]

I voted no - because I know how stove companies work. They rarely pay the actual price of fixing a problem. Also, most issues have to do with other factors - installation, use, etc....so those are not warranty anyway.

In truth, I think it is 100% up to the dealer UNLESS they have some sort of contract with the manufacturer that states otherwise.

Many customers look at it like the car biz, but it is very different - the first difference being that the customer is unlikely to drive the stove into your repair shop!

 

[Eric Johnson]

I don't know of this is an appropriate observation for this thread, but I used to know a saw dealer who would try to get warranty authorization for saws that were ruined (seized up) by misuse. Sort of like the dealer and the customer conspiring to defraud the manufacturer. My impression was that the dealer felt he could win a customer for life (and probably all his friends) by phoneying up a warranty claim.

Is that a legitimate concern on the part of the manufacturers?

 

[MountainStoveGuy]

absolutly. I wonder how many bad installs get passed over on warrenty... for example, some one hooks up line voltage to the valve and blows it. sends it in for warrenty, the manufacture tests it out, and knows what happened. BUT the dealer is a good customer of the manufacture and they let it slide. Like harry said, 1% or less of the stoves are defective out of the box, there is usually something wrong with the install or the user. Now this is not so true about pellet stoves, they dont work out of the box all the time. With that, its usally a bad snap disk or control board. 99% of my warrenty work is on pellet stoves. the other 1% us usually somthing other the warrenty.

 

[Webwidow]

I vote no with exceptions.
In season our crew was too busy doing our own installations and deliveries to take on outside warranty work. We could be 2-3 weeks behind.

We would always be polite return calls, and help the customer out as best we could over the phone. We would go over their installation and so on. tell them what parts were needed. At times the stove company would ask us to go out and do outside warranty work, which we would.

We stocked way more parts than we needed. If we sold a unit we would switch out parts immediately with our inventory. We made sure the stove was working prior to leaving.

We had a list of sweeps who knew how to install stoves and gave them the outside warranty work. At times, when things would slow down our installers would take on outside warranty work as well. This worked well for all.
However we sold our business back in 98, not too many direct stove sales back then.

On a personal note, I believe the buyer must take on some of the responsibility, obviously they decided to save a few bucks and buy online and not locally. Understanding full well that a stove is not toaster and that it could not be easily shipped back if they ran into problems. They found your store for warranty work, logically they could have purchased the unit from you. Right??

And once you touch a stove in an effort to help out, you now own that stove and customer for life. For better or worst.

That is why I try to buy locally from locally own shops. They (YOU) are the ones who support the community and the dollars stay in town. This should be a two way street.

.

 

[PaulyV]

If PE states on their website beware of buying a stove off of the internet. (On PE’s website, Jotul’s for that matter, they tell you that they will not back a stove sold over the Internet.

PE’s statement: )

(broken link removed to http://www.pacificenergy.net/websales.html)

Why the Hell would they allow someone from Texas to sell them online free shipping and a heck of alot cheaper than a dealer. Where are there morals? Hypocritical I think.

 

[MountainStoveGuy]

i would guess the ebay dealer hasnt got caught yet.