Re-introduction to Wood Stoves

[daleeper]

A couple of questions that haven't been hit too hard yet. How important is dealer support. If you buy a simple stove, it should last like your parent's has. You are also using it as backup heat, and as heat for the basement, so if it were to have to be shut down for a few days, it really wouldn't be that big a deal unless it happened to be when you had a power outage. Dealer support may not be that good at that time anyway.

Cat vs non-cat has been beat to death over time on the internet. Either will serve you well if you follow the instructions, and the good folks here on hearth.com on how to run them properly.

One thing about a stove in the basement, especially with central forced air heat. The central air in our home would not keep up at all with heating the basement on its own in our house. With the wood stove down there, we can spend time in that space, as you remember from your childhood. When cold weather really sets in around here, that basement takes a few days of wood heat before the floor gets warm down there, and that is with the stove running 24/7. Great for when the power is out. We are not good chefs on the wood stove, so we grill with propane when power is out.

 

[Swedishchef]

From my experience, the 2300 is a beast of a heater. I can get 8 hours of great heat and the stove is not overly pricey.

a 30 foot chimney will cost about $1500 or so (in this neck of the woods).

Personally, I always find that budget is key. you could spend $5000 on a stove or $1000. It all depends on what you want: steel vs cast iron, cat vs non cat, etc. I think that a smart choice is to get a big stove since you can always make a small fire in a big stove but not a big fire in a small stove.

I love BK but was not ready to pay $3500 for a wood stove. That is the equivalent of 1.5-2 years electricity billls where I live . $5000 in a wood stove setup is quite a bit for someone who may be on a restricted budget.

The old stoves put more heat out the chimney than they did in the house. A friend of mine replaced his old dragon with an Enviro Boston and now burns 1/3 less wood. Night and day difference.

Start getting wood now!!

Andrew

 

[Bigg_Redd]

Luckily, BK is one of those manufacturers that is quite willing to accept phone calls and offer as much help as possible.

Kuma too. My dad called with some questions as a prospective buyer and ended up shooting the sh_t with the guy for half an hour about stoves, saws, wood, and the old days.

 

[Highbeam]

In the olden days, the dealer was more important. These days we have the interwebs with endless knowledge and the ability to have just about anything shipped to your door.

I question the likelihood of the survival of the manufacturers that depend on their dealer networks to provide information, support, and service. With a new generation of stove buyers coming "online" the old business model needs to be booted.

I am completely happy with the two stoves in my signature. I didn't buy them by chance but by after carefully considering all of the options.

 

[stovelark]

Hello- Well I do believe dealer support is still important, most of the stove companies still do as well. I know some folks do not get the most optimum support occasionally, but I'd like to think most dealers do have their customers' best interest in mind. I know the one I work at does. We screw up too, but not too often.
For the op- the best advice is see all the stoves you can, whittle the obviously too expensive, or maybe non aesthetically pleasing ones and I bet with good seasoned wood any contenders will serve you well. We're all biased to a degree with what we have (why would we not buy the best one available for ourselves??), which is fair. I've been happy with all my stoves I've had, but some were better. I really liked my Jotul Oslo for its looks, day to day just work and do its job, built like a tank and heat output. I will say though, this Enviro 1700 Kodiak is a great heating beast, easy to operate (even easier and quicker to temp than the Oslo, a steel vs cast characteristic) and a great value to own. There's just so many good stoves out there, whichever one you get you'll be happy with. I too join in with the non VC crowd, I'd stay away from any stove that forces smoke downward to be re-burned, it just goes against physics.
Apologize so long-winded, I look forward to seeing what you get... take care.

 

[webby3650]

I question the likelihood of the survival of the manufacturers that depend on their dealer networks to provide information, support, and service. With a new generation of stove buyers coming "online" the old business model needs to be booted.

I'll agree that some manufacturers need to be more customer friendly, there is no reason to say they need to boot the whole set-up. Many of the manufacturers do very well at answering calls and taking care of complaints and are very busy making people happy behind the scenes. Unfortunetly the bad experiences are the only ones that get repeated typically. More realistically, manufactureres need to can dealers that don't represent their product well or provide customer service after the sale. There is a very large poplutation of people out there that have no desire to do any of the footwork. They want a dealer to take care of the whole job, start to finish. It wouln't matter to some people if the stove was half-price on-line, they would buy from a brick and mortor store that will take care of all the work and provide service later.

 

[northwinds]

Ok, just so that I understand... how do I determine a rear combustion stove? Will it state that somewhere in the brochure? So far the Jotul seems to be the easiest to use. I also may be getting a little overwhelmed by the things I read on here about the Quadra fire and not giving off a lot of radiant heat, etc. I truly appreciate all the input, this has been a huge help.

Depends on the stove. The Quad Isle Royale gives off a lot of radiant heat and is well-liked for its low maintenance needs among owners who have put their stoves to the test over many years of 24/7 burning. However, if you are on a budget, I'd look at the Englander stoves.

 

[wildcat2003]

Well, I got the installed price for the QF Millennium 3100 ST and I'm $650 over budget. I'm also getting a quote for an installed PE Super 27. When looking at recommended heating areas, should I include the up stairs? I would think that with a convection stove that would need to be factored in since I have a 4' wide stair well that is completely open. I will also talk with the QF dealer to see if there are some things I can remove to shave some money off of the 3100. I don't think I need the ST, ash pan (I've scoped lots of ashes and don't mind it) and maybe I can save a few $$. I've looked at the Englanders and I just don't really like the appearance. The Osburns look really nice but since the dealer is 2 hrs away I would need to find someone to install the chimney which the dealer that I spoke to around here (QF) won't install the chimney if they don't sell the stove. Thanks again for all the advice.

 

[Bigg_Redd]

When looking at recommended heating areas, should I include the up stairs?

No. As much as we'd like for them to be central heat, a wood stove is a space heater.

 

[stovelark]

Hey Wild, If you can get the heat released from the basement to upstairs, consider upstairs as part of the load. If its not readily able to flow upstairs, it will still warm the floor and help upstairs. If its 1100sqft unfinished downstairs, I'd get as big a heater as you can, longer burn times and longer wood holding capabilities. Quadrafires are very capable, high quality heaters. So are PE, Enviro, Osburn, Lopi. Seems you are leaning towards steel stoves, don't blame you either. They are durable, reliable convection heaters that will help heat upstairs as well convectionally. Don't rule out Englander either, they make a great value heater. You mentioned the 3100 ST (step top) version, that's much more than the Millenium series, which is flat top, pedestal only, but same firebox. The super 27, Enviro 1700 Kodiaks, you might want to check out too. Osburns are good stoves too, sounds like you are moving towards non cats as well.

 

[JA600L]

If going with Quadra-Fire I would step up to the 4300 Millenium. Mine barely has enough to burn all night, but it gets the job done.

 

[stovelark]

Agreed JA, the extra burn time and not much more cost (about 200 more from 3100 mill to 43 mill), bigger firebox would only help the situation.

 

[Benchwrench]

Your budget is $3500? my stove was nearly $3500.
you may find your "over budget" funds in an alternate idea such as labor, a little elbow grease and a willing neighbor perhaps, or a couple neighbors and BBQ. You can save alot of coin this way.
also I think you may feel you're over budget because of the need for 30' of chimney.

moral of the story: don't skimp on your stove choice, chimney pipe, or anything else over a few extra bucks that can be made up or found elsewhere.
Your decision today will affect your heating experience for decades.

 

[Bigg_Redd]

moral of the story: don't skimp on your stove choice, chimney pipe, or anything else over a few extra bucks that can be made up or found elsewhere.
Your decision today will affect your heating experience for decades.

x2

Think of this as a 20 year investment. $1000 over 20 years = $50 per year = $4.17 per month = $.14 per day.

I bet you've spent $5000+ on desktop computers in the last 20 years that you aren't even using anymore.

 

[Highbeam]

I do believe that you can heat the whole house with a woodstove. The whole house won't be the same temperature but the area, and more importantly the volume, of the entire house is what I would use.

 

[northwinds]

I heat my entire raised ranch from the lower level up. I think the wild card is how the concrete floor will soak up the heat. I know that in my house which has carpeted lower level floors, insulated walls and a wide open staircase, the heat easily travels up to the main floor. As Highbeam notes, the stove room will be warmer than the rest of the house but is not too warm in my own situation.

 

[begreen]

Agreed, with a few caveats. If you are fortunate enough to have a floor layout that is relatively open and are able to place the stove in a near central position, a house can be comfortably heated by the wood stove alone. There may need to be some tweaking to make this work well depending on the home layout. Confounding factors could be cathedral ceilings, offset stove location, small door openings, leaky doors/windows/sills, poor insulation in some parts of the house, etc.. Some corrective examples would be the use of a fan or ceiling fan, opening up the stove room to other rooms by enlarging doorways, tightening up the house, etc.. For example, in our house initially too much heat was heading upstairs due to a flat ceiling between the living room and large open stairway. To achieve a better balance I added a false 16" beam dividing the ceiling spaces. This has effectively slowed down the flow of heat to upstairs so that there is little temperature variation between rooms now.