Question about new lines chimney

[coffeecup86]

Hiya folks.

I made a couple threads last season, I’ll give a quick back story. Recently bought a house. It had a pellet stove vented into a 8in terracotta lined chimney. Yikes.
We replaced the pellet stove with a wood stove. We had a lot of issues getting fires going in the dead of winter. Took a peak and saw ice in the chimney. Dang!
So we recently had our chimney lined with a 6in stainless steel liner, and a new cap. Previously we had a lot of back draft also, which caused a gross creosote smell to waft into the house.

Anyhow, the job is done, we are excited as heck and got a fire going on a chilly morning. It did start a lot better, but it was only 40 outside.
I’ve noticed we still have some air seeping in from a couple areas near where the stove pipe breaches the bricks. It still smells like creosote. I know it’s not from the new line, it has to be from the old chimney (they never cleaned it out prior to lining it) and we have no idea when it was last cleaned before we moved in.

The smell is so offensive. The entire living room smells of it. We did just get a lot of rain, and it is humid. Should this be happening?
Also, final question, the liner they installed was just stainless steel. The only insulation they put in was near the breach. If our old chimney got ice in it prior, will this one get cold and have issues with condensation and stuff too?

Thanks everyone!

 

[bholler]

Hiya folks.

I made a couple threads last season, I’ll give a quick back story. Recently bought a house. It had a pellet stove vented into a 8in terracotta lined chimney. Yikes.
We replaced the pellet stove with a wood stove. We had a lot of issues getting fires going in the dead of winter. Took a peak and saw ice in the chimney. Dang!
So we recently had our chimney lined with a 6in stainless steel liner, and a new cap. Previously we had a lot of back draft also, which caused a gross creosote smell to waft into the house.

Anyhow, the job is done, we are excited as heck and got a fire going on a chilly morning. It did start a lot better, but it was only 40 outside.
I’ve noticed we still have some air seeping in from a couple areas near where the stove pipe breaches the bricks. It still smells like creosote. I know it’s not from the new line, it has to be from the old chimney (they never cleaned it out prior to lining it) and we have no idea when it was last cleaned before we moved in.

The smell is so offensive. The entire living room smells of it. We did just get a lot of rain, and it is humid. Should this be happening?
Also, final question, the liner they installed was just stainless steel. The only insulation they put in was near the breach. If our old chimney got ice in it prior, will this one get cold and have issues with condensation and stuff too?

Thanks everyone!

Complete cleaning is required prior to installing a new liner. Insulation is most likely required as well. My bet is they did nothing but shove a bare liner down the chimney which isn't code compliant and does nothing to improve safety. If that is the case it should be redone properly

 

[coffeecup86]

We have had one heck of a time reaching out to these people.

They came out and put some sort of chimney clay around the pipe breach and said it’ll help with the smell. It did for about 3 days. The smell is so bad today, because it’s damp. We will be calling back again.

Also, the other day we must have had weird weather, we had a back draft fire. Smoke all through the house. This is exactly what we had last season, this is exactly why we spent $2200 to line this thing. I feel we paid far too much for this now knowing it’s unlined. I wish I was home the day this did this. Lol.

Asp, they put the stove pipe on, and it’s angled down towards the brick, so the female end is angled down, that is also incorrect right? Creosote can leak? It’s hardly angled. But it is ever so slightly.

 

[Eman85]

What does the chimney look like on the outside of the home? Is it on an outside wall? Does it stick high enough above the ridge? What size pipe does your stove require? I'm a little confused about the ice in the chimney deal, how did the ice get in the chimney?

 

[begreen]

The chimney must be cleaned before lining, no exceptions. This is not optional. Not doing so is dangerous.

The backdraft is in part due to the lack of vertical pipe off of the stove before turning toward the chimney, and yes that pipe should run uphill at least 1/4" per foot to the chimney. The 90º turn is not helping. It would probably work better with a pair of 45 elbows in an offset.

How tall is the chimney liner?

 

[coffeecup86]

The exterior chimney is a cinder style. It is exposed and on an exterior wall. This is why we opted to have it lined as we had issues with it being very cold last season.

We finally were able to have the company come back out and look at this, after we called the fire chief to come look at our stove. We attempted a burn and it wouldn’t draft, there was smoke just recirculating. The temp of the stove never got above 220. The next morning the glass was black and we haven’t been able to stop smelling creosote in the living room.
Anyway, the fire chief comes out, looks up the clean out in the basement and says he can see daylight? We scratch our heads because it’s lined….so there is NO cap on the bottom of our liner?

Once the company gets here they troubleshoot everything, including our stove that we purchased in January. He said they will be back out on the 11th to pull the liner out and re do it.
He cut some off the interior pipe thinking that would help, but it did not.

He called my husband a day later and said he thinks it’s our wood stove, that maybe the cats have gone. My husband promptly calls the manufacturer of our stove, as it would still be under warranty. She giggled and says our stove does not have that. But helps him troubleshoot for some time. Says it’s either the liner or our house is to airtight, which is doubtful as it’s a 1920s home and super drafty haha.

Anyway, I’m bumming that we have to wait until the 11th, my eyes burn from the creosote. It legit is so bad we have to change our clothing before leaving the house. We all smell. Everything smells.

I’ll also add, our chimney is the proper height for draw, this is not an issue, as we never had a problem prior, except for when the chimney was cold.
We have had 3 professional (inspector included) say it’s a proper height but I do believe there is a pic in an older post of mine.

I appreciate everyone for listening. This is beyond frustrating

 

[stoveliker]

Your stove looks like it saw wet wood. that'll affect everything from draft to creosote.

That window is horrible with liquid creosote dripping down.

What is the moisture content of your wood? How long has it been split and off the ground, covered? Species?

 

[coffeecup86]

Your stove looks like it saw wet wood. that'll affect everything from draft to creosote.

That window is horrible with liquid creosote dripping down.

What is the moisture content of your wood? How long has it been split and off the ground, covered? Species?

The wood we have been burning is seasoned wood from last season, and a cord from a friend that has been sitting for approximately 3 years. I have no idea of the moisture content as I don’t have a means to check that. It is all pretty gray in color.
The wood is a mixture of birch, oak, beach, ash and some cherry. Not sure if that matters.

Our wood is stored in the back of our garage, which is fully covered. Our friends wood he gifted us, was in a covered shed.

The creosote came out of nowhere. It could have been from some wood,

 

[EbS-P]

sounds like you have several issues.
1. The creosote smell
2. Correct liner install
3. Low stove temp.

1 and 2 can be related. 2 and 3 could be related. 3 could be wet wood contributing to 1.

So best tackle these as separate issues even though they are or can all be related.

Start with the liner and install. Verify the entire chimney was cleaned. You have a clean out take a bright flashlight and look up. What do you see can you post some pics. Next verify the liner is capped as the bottom and top plate is sealed at the top.

Every wood burner needs a moisture meter 30$ on Amazon General Tools MMD4E Digital Moisture Meter, Water Leak Detector, Moisture Tester, Pin Type, Backlit LCD Display With Audible and Visual High-Medium-Low Moisture Content Alerts, Grays https://a.co/d/cw8vphI


Take a systematic approach and be persistent.

Evan

 

[stoveliker]

The oak might not be good (since last season), but the rest could be good if indeed covered and split for a year.

Then it's back to a draft issue, or choking down the stove too much.

Verify if the chimney (and cap) is not obstructed.

Is the clean out sealed properly? Air leaking in there will kill the draft and could lead to all that you see/smell.

 

[neverstop]

The exterior chimney is a cinder style. It is exposed and on an exterior wall. This is why we opted to have it lined as we had issues with it being very cold last season.

We finally were able to have the company come back out and look at this, after we called the fire chief to come look at our stove. We attempted a burn and it wouldn’t draft, there was smoke just recirculating. The temp of the stove never got above 220. The next morning the glass was black and we haven’t been able to stop smelling creosote in the living room.
Anyway, the fire chief comes out, looks up the clean out in the basement and says he can see daylight? We scratch our heads because it’s lined….so there is NO cap on the bottom of our liner?

Once the company gets here they troubleshoot everything, including our stove that we purchased in January. He said they will be back out on the 11th to pull the liner out and re do it.
He cut some off the interior pipe thinking that would help, but it did not.

He called my husband a day later and said he thinks it’s our wood stove, that maybe the cats have gone. My husband promptly calls the manufacturer of our stove, as it would still be under warranty. She giggled and says our stove does not have that. But helps him troubleshoot for some time. Says it’s either the liner or our house is to airtight, which is doubtful as it’s a 1920s home and super drafty haha.

Anyway, I’m bumming that we have to wait until the 11th, my eyes burn from the creosote. It legit is so bad we have to change our clothing before leaving the house. We all smell. Everything smells.

I’ll also add, our chimney is the proper height for draw, this is not an issue, as we never had a problem prior, except for when the chimney was cold.
We have had 3 professional (inspector included) say it’s a proper height but I do believe there is a pic in an older post of mine.

I appreciate everyone for listening. This is beyond frustrating

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assuming that the liner doesn't extend down to the basement; if you stick a flashlight in the cleanout and take a picture you should be able to see the tee (again assuming the liner terminates at the tee where your stove connects to it). if you don't see a cap then you've found a major problem. if this is the case then the company should fix this on their own dime.

 

[Rickb]

It sounds like they didnt extend the liner down past the tee and put a cap on it. so it just pulling draft right through the bottom of the tee.

 

[begreen]

^^This^^ The draft is being seriously diluted by sucking air through the uncapped end of the liner. The stove can not get into the secondary burn. Don't use it until repaired.

 

[stoveliker]

Yes, that is what I meant to say above, even if I may not have used the right terminology.