Propane Price Lock in Rate is a Joke

[bogieb]

A propane tank (technically called a bottle) .

Is a 500 gallon propane tank still called a bottle? Now, if it was a stand up 100-150 gallon tank, I can see "bottle" being the correct term. Just the behemoth that is laying in my yard looks like it should be called a tank to me. Maybe bottle is the correct term for gaseous contents and tanks are for liquid? Inquiring minds want to know!

 

[SidecarFlip]

A bottle on it's side is still a bottle. Thats what my hunting friend who owns the propane company calls them so I presume thats correct. He's got a bunch of 50,000 gallon ones for storage.... He calls them bottles too. Keep in mind that while they are filled with liquid propane, the propane that comes into your house is in a gaseous state. The 'pickup' tube in the tank is in the airspace at the top. Bottles come 2 ways, with a long tube for liquid and a short one for gaseous. Thats why they only fill a tank to 85%, it has to have headspace at the top for the gaseous part.

He owns a tank-bottle facility in Adrian, Michigan where he has around 20 50K storage units with a rail siding and it comes in in rail cars.. Glad the weather turned nice, I'm farming my butt off....

 

[bogieb]

Thanks for the education Sidecar!

 

[Grisu]

A bottle on it's side is still a bottle. Thats what my hunting friend who owns the propane company calls them so I presume thats correct.

It does not seem that all propane dealers follow that convention: http://www.missiongas.com/propanetanks.htm

 

[SidecarFlip]

It does not seem that all propane dealers follow that convention: http://www.missiongas.com/propanetanks.htm

Just stating what Mr. Rod Garst or Garst Propane, LLC., refers to them as.....

I was brought understanding that a tank was a container for unpressurized material and a bottle was for containment of pressurized material. Like a Thermos bottle. The inner and outer envelope contain a NEGATIVE pressure to insulate thecontents of the inner envelope.

No matter however, propane is much cheaper (at least around here) than pellets or corn. I locled in a pre buy (10% down) at 99 cents for 1500 gallons yesterday.

 

[ScotL]

The propane tanks don't have to be ugly.

 

[Bioburner]

There is one painted like a ear of corn somewhere in MN. Probably Olivia

 

[Grisu]

Long cylindrical shape - I wonder what other designs someone could come up with?

 

[SidecarFlip]

Long cylindrical shape - I wonder what other designs someone could come up with?

I'd do that but my wife might object.....

You can only 'decorate' them if you own them. Supplier tanks cannot be painted or illustrated... and in some states you can bury them, I think Ohio is one. You can't here and I might illustrate mine (just not like a male organ)....lol

Ican tell propane will stay low fr a while. Amerigas is offering a 2 SEASON LOCK IN RATE here.

I have allegiance to my local supplier (and hunting buddy) but I found the 2 year lock in interesting.

 

[SidecarFlip]

Wow, this thread is 5 pages and still interesting and informative. Must be a Hearth record........ just say'in.

 

[bogieb]

I'd do that but my wife might object.....

You can only 'decorate' them if you own them. Supplier tanks cannot be painted or illustrated... and in some states you can bury them, I think Ohio is one. You can't here and I might illustrate mine (just not like a male organ)....lol

Ican tell propane will stay low fr a while. Amerigas is offering a 2 SEASON LOCK IN RATE here.

I have allegiance to my local supplier (and hunting buddy) but I found the 2 year lock in interesting.

One of the big propane companies is doing the 2 year lock also, or so their radio advertisement said. Catch is, you have to change from oil to propane and have them install the system. Have no idea what the lock in rate is but the average price for propane in July was $2.65/gal. Average price for oil was $2.57/gal. With oil being more efficient than propane at about 2/3 the cost of propane per million BTU, I am unsure why anyone would switch.

 

[SidecarFlip]

They didn't expound as to the particulars on the radio, just the 2 year lock in. Rod (Garst LP) told me he expects propane to stay low until at least after the Presidential elections and maybe longer if the current production rates maintain themselves. NG is very abundant too. Many power plants are switching to NG from coal. Propane is a derivitave of NG (I think).....

Don't usually listen to the radio but when I'm farming I have it on as a diversion from boring. Going round and round in a field gets old pretty quick. In the old days you had to pay a lot of attention to what your implement was doing. In this 'computer controlled age'. implements think for themselves, you just drive the tractor. Pretty soon , tractors will drive themselves....lol

I've never paid (in as long as I can remember) under a dollar a gallon for propane........ I'll take it. Saving literally hundreds of dollars equates to more spendable income elsewhere.

Pellets aren't coming down at all. I suspect thats because pellet mills (at least the big ones) have gotten into exporting pellets (commercial grade, diffenert, larger dimensions than consumer grade pellets) to the EU, it's become BIG business according to Biomass Magazine as in ship loads being exported and specialized loading facilities being built. I subscribe to Biomass as part of my business dealings.

I'm amazed at the tonnage being produced and exported, hundreds of thousands of tons. That leaves the residential pellet user in the dust so to speak. Domestic residential users are now playing 'second fiddle' to bulk exportation. Producers can and will keep domestic prices as high as possible, they make their profits on the exports.

When I get some time, I'll quote some tonnages and reference the articles.

 

[SidecarFlip]

Big problem with 'new technology in farming' is, it comes with a price and that prices is the purchase price of new equipment. Your average medium sized tractor now costs upwards of 65 grand (got 2) and a lowly round bailer is 30 plus m (just bought one last fall). Tillage equipment is high too. A new combine is over 175 grand (I'm looking at a new Case axial flow).... Equipment only lasts so long and then the breakdown/repair frequency gets stupid. You don't want a breakdown in the field, especially a major one when it's time to deal with harvest or planting.

Like J.Paul Getty said, you have to spend money to make money, problem is, the prices of produced products aren't increasing, in fact they are coming down and inputs (herbicides, fertilizer and peszticides as well as seed is going up too).

Viscious circle and lots of payment books......

 

[SidecarFlip]

Being a child of the 60's, I especially like the 'Yellow Submarine' propane bottle with the big hot dog one coming in second. Gives me some ideas for decorating my owned ones.....

 

[ScotL]

I saw a few pictures of Pig decorated propane tanks too. So I guess the are Propane Pigs as well as Pellet Pigs.

 

[SidecarFlip]

My wife looked at the decorated propane containers and siad we should do the same... Now, trying to decide the motiff... We have 3, 2 side by side and one next door at out rental property.

 

[Dpopps]

I got my lock in price today, $1.44 gal. and $1.34 if I pre buy. For the first time the contract says if the price is lower, they will charge the lesser amount. current price is $1.34.

 

[SidecarFlip]

Where abouts are you in Michigan? I'm down by Toledo and we locked in at 99 cents. BTW, gasoline last night in Toledo (I work there) was 2.03 a gallon regular unleaded, 2.53 a gallon in Dundee, Michigan.

Anything below $1.75 a gallon beats pellets hands down.

 

[Bioburner]

Just plugged in some numbers into St.Croix fuel conversion table and corn needs to be south of $4 to beat $1 propane figuring both stoves burning at 80% efficiency. Looks like the Bixby will still be pretty busy this next heating season.

 

[SidecarFlip]

My Bryant is well over 85%, it's a condensing unit. Old crop corn is hovering about $3.85/bu/15% here right now. I think considering the crap weather, corn will rise above 4 smackers this fall.

Pellets are out of the question however. Basically 250 a ton, thats pie-in-the-sky compared the propane and/or corn....

 

[Bioburner]

Corn fell some more today with the crops looking excellent around here and no heat pressure. Could use some rain but not hurting yet. Local elevator buying for $3.11, so I could get for 3.36 and that's a dime less than I bought on 7/7/14

Never got around to installing a whole house Amana 90 plus as it sits in the shed. Will have to install if I sell the house. Use the freestanding gas fireplace upstairs (80%) and have a mini boiler for the infloor as backup in the basement.

The little fireplace had a total cost less than $200 installed and that would take a long time to overcome upgrading to something higher and with no ambiance or ability to run if power goes out.

 

[SidecarFlip]

Our furnace and about 90% of everything else is on standby Generac. The HWH isn't. It's on a seperate meter at a reduced rate. We had the Bryant installed years ago. It's been basically trouble free except the hot surface ignitor that needs cleaning ocassionally. My wife would prefer the Bryant over the multifuel stove anyway but propane has been to high (until late) to use it except for those really cold windy days. I kept on 60 on the t'stat all the time.

Crops are poor here, too much rain. If I hadn't side dressed (by hand) my sweet corn it would be yellow now. Lots of fields will be chopped and the wheat came off with fungus.

least I got most of my hay finally cut and baled. I sold it all before I cut it, good dry hay here is a rare commodity. Last 2 weeks have been good haying weather. I really made up for the rank cut (8 weeks overdue). I've cleared over 3 grand on one cut and I'll get a second with some urea. Gonna be a good hay year for me.

I need to, I have a huge bailer payment. I bought a new NH computer round bailer last fall. What a whiz. I just sit in the tractor and watch the video screen. When it's full bale, it tells me to stop, then it wraps and tells me to eject and we go again. I can control all the inputs like how many wraps of net, the density, I can switch to twine on the fly and it allows me to choose how many wraps of twine and the spacing.... all on the console in the air conditioned tractor. Automation comes at a price however and I still make my money on small squares. I have a 10 year old NH 575 high capacity square bailer, very capable machine and basically trouble free but still very mechanical.

I cut with a NH disc machine and rake with a Giehl rotary... I like NH hay tools...obviously.

 

[Arti]

U Just
Passed Gas !

Painted on the side of my lp tank....

 

[SidecarFlip]

U Just
Passed Gas !

Painted on the side of my lp tank....

Any graphics or just words????

My wife wants me to do one tank like a big pickle. Mine are already green (I own them so the green blends in with the trees where they sit). I really like the yellow sub motif though. I may do one similar, I do have 3 to choose from A pickle a submarine and one more to do something with.....

 

[SidecarFlip]

Corn fell some more today with the crops looking excellent around here and no heat pressure. Could use some rain but not hurting yet. Local elevator buying for $3.11, so I could get for 3.36 and that's a dime less than I bought on 7/7/14

Never got around to installing a whole house Amana 90 plus as it sits in the shed. Will have to install if I sell the house. Use the freestanding gas fireplace upstairs (80%) and have a mini boiler for the infloor as backup in the basement.

The little fireplace had a total cost less than $200 installed and that would take a long time to overcome upgrading to something higher and with no ambiance or ability to run if power goes out.

I specifficalyl want old crop corn or roasting. It's always below 15% RM and usually it's been in the grain tank at the co-op getting pressed by hundreds of tons of pressure, sort of compacted. My co-op has 3 huge Belens and 3 bigger precast concrete bunks. I always have them deliver and auger it into my GSI tanks pre cleaned and ready to 'feed' the steers and the stove. I usually get 750 bushel at a delivery.

No matter, I'll be getting shelled corn delivered burning or not. I have mouths to feed, that continues unabated.