Princess thermostat problem

[moresnow]

I was going to post a question this morning but did not really know how to word it so it would make sense. Now I know why I am having this problem and need some help.
It seems that no matter how open I had my thermostat I could not get any flames in the stove. this has been ongoing for about 3 days now. I have been getting a lot of smoke roll out when i try to add more wood too, and my wood is not really burning enough to make much heat just " mulling away very slowly" no flames at all unless the by-pass was open. Well just a second ago I went to make sure the thermostat was wide open, and the dial will go around and around . What do I need to do to fix this??

Unless I missed it?
What did you find when you pulled the cat and stovepipe for a cleaning?

You state that your stat/knob are tight together and stop in the clockwise direction at 6pm. Good.
Your pipe/cap are clean. Good.

Clean the cat with the vinegar/water method. Vacuum the upper inside part of the stove behind the cat and around the bypass.
Tell us what you find.

 

[Jeff in Maine]

Never changed to my knowledge. I never said it had outside air if that is what you are referring to?

In any case moving on.
I moved the stove myself and did a thorough cleaning of the cat and surrounding by-pass door area. It looked to me the cat was at least partially blocked up if not completely.

I took a few photos of what I saw I did not photos of the front of the cat but I did get 2 (so-so) photos of the back of it. The stovepipe had maybe a cup or less of crap in it tiny black/ gray particles. So, I wire brushed out the interior of it.

The thimble into the chimney had some loose flakey stuff clinging to the top and gray dust gathered at the bottom. I vacuumed this as well as wire brushed it out.

The interior of the stove through the pipe exit had about an inch of very fine ash on the bypass floor area i vacuumed this as well as checked the snap over/ cam over of the bypass door it was fine.

The back of the cat was very ash covered of the places that i could see. So, i vacuumed this area immediately behind it as well. Then i got my small air compressor and blew the cat out front to back. I did get quite a lot more out so, I went back in with the vacuum and cleaned it up from the back and front just in case.

Then I removed the Condor Cat Thermometer and man was that gunked up I had just cleaned it about a week ago too. I guess having the cat basically nonfunctional caused that to get dirty again. So, I cleaned it all off. I have noticed for the last week and a half or so the cat either took over an hour to get active or never got there at all. I was at first blaming the cat probe, but I also knew it was brand new this last October. So, that got me wondering. I wondered about the cat but the same day I discovered the Dial movement and I guess the though

t about the cat turned into thermostat worries.

Then I moved the stove back into position and started a fire, I guess that is the only way to tell if there will be an improvement. From dead cold to active cat took approximately 22 min

 

[Jeff in Maine]

Unless I missed it?
What did you find when you pulled the cat and stovepipe for a cleaning?

You state that your stat/knob are tight together and stop in the clockwise direction at 6pm. Good.
Your pipe/cap are clean. Good.

Clean the cat with the vinegar/water method. Vacuum the upper inside part of the stove behind the cat and around the bypass.
Tell us what you find.

I did not say the pipe was clean, I said the chimney and cap were clean. I just posted my findings a moment ago. I did not clean with vinegar though that may be needed at some point. Yes, the thermostat knob has a hard stop at the 6 position I was just worried when I noticed it would easily turn backwards beyond the 12 position. I guess I had never tried that before so when it did that, I got thinking maybe the thermostat was bad. That DOES NOT seem to be the case it seems that the knob does that on all stoves.

 

[TheElementalCashew]

If you find your cat gets plugged with fly ash often, the ceramic version of the cat has much larger holes and should be less susceptible to plugging.

 

[showrguy]

Found, fixed problem !!

 

[stoveliker]

The cat clogging was likely the issue.
What is your chimney height? Too much draft sucks fly ash into the cat. This might work better with a key damper.

How old is the cat (sorry did not read back again). If you burn constant from Nov-Feb, and partial in Oct and Mar, then in 3-4 years, the cat may be reaching the end of its life. Get a new one this summer and store it so you have one on hand for when the cat dies.

 

[Jeff in Maine]

Found, fixed problem !!

Maybe ?? Who knows I sure hope you are right.

 

[Jeff in Maine]

October of 2022 the cat was new. We burn from Mid-October 24/7 till April 15th or so maybe longer. I build a fire in October and run it till mid spring pretty much. Yes I should have a spare. EDIT I forgot you asked about chimney height it is an 8" square flue and stands 23' tall about 4' above the roof peak. The stove thimble is about 5' off the ground.

 

[Jeff in Maine]

Thank you to all that responded with ideas. Jeff

 

[jjam]

I was going to post a question this morning but did not really know how to word it so it would make sense. Now I know why I am having this problem and need some help.
It seems that no matter how open I had my thermostat I could not get any flames in the stove. this has been ongoing for about 3 days now. I have been getting a lot of smoke roll out when i try to add more wood too, and my wood is not really burning enough to make much heat just " mulling away very slowly" no flames at all unless the by-pass was open. Well just a second ago I went to make sure the thermostat was wide open, and the dial will go around and around . What do I need to do to fix this??

sounds like wet wood needs to be split and dried two years / do moisture test on wood

 

[stoveliker]

October of 2022 the cat was new. We burn from Mid-October 24/7 till April 15th or so maybe longer. I build a fire in October and run it till mid spring pretty much. Yes I should have a spare. EDIT I forgot you asked about chimney height it is an 8" square flue and stands 23' tall about 4' above the roof peak. The stove thimble is about 5' off the ground.

Okay. The cat should still be okay (but get a spare indeed; no expiration date anyway, and you want to avoid having a dead cat midwinter and having to wait for a new one then).

Your chimney is not ideal; too large cross section. I'm not sure whether the draft would be too high here - that is best measured with a manometer.
The clogged cat (and it being ash, not creosote) suggests that draft is too high.

 

[Jeff in Maine]

yea maybe someday,
EDIT-- I agree that the draft is high, it will hold a sheet of tinfoil flush to the thimble on its own if you move the stove pipe out of the way, always has. I have had another thought; this winter I have burned more poplar and fir and in larger amounts than ever before. I wonder if these species have finer ash than Maple Birch Beach ect? I can remember when I cut the wood there were a few large poplars in my way so I dropped them and a few big firs as well and added them into the pile.

 

[Jeff in Maine]

sounds like wet wood needs to be split and dried two years / do moisture test on wood

yea I never thought of using dry wood... go back a read post 20

 

[joop]

why should we read when we can assume.first three letters in assume lol

 

[joop]

did you figure it out?

 

[Jeff in Maine]

Yes it appears to have been ash covered cat

 

[joop]

easy fix

 

[Jeff in Maine]

Yes, not too bad.

 

[Highbeam]

yea maybe someday,
EDIT-- I agree that the draft is high, it will hold a sheet of tinfoil flush to the thimble on its own if you move the stove pipe out of the way, always has. I have had another thought; this winter I have burned more poplar and fir and in larger amounts than ever before. I wonder if these species have finer ash than Maple Birch Beach ect? I can remember when I cut the wood there were a few large poplars in my way so I dropped them and a few big firs as well and added them into the pile.

It's not the fir. Douglas fir makes near zero ash and the ash is heavy. Now poplar is the opposite, like burning a wad of newspaper. Lots of fluffy ash to clog that fine steel cat.

I'm not a fan of steel cats. They clog up more easily. Your cat should be young enough to not have expired yet but I only get two years dependably while burning softwoods and/or softer hardwoods.

The black gooey looking accumulation on the cat meter probe is not normal. I get accumulation but it's very dry, brown, and powdery. Hopefully clearing the ash out makes everything work like normal.

 

[Jeff in Maine]

We do not have Doug Fir in Maine,.. we have Balsam Fir, think Christmas trees and wreathes. The messed-up probe was from the nonfunctioning cat I believe, it was all dusty tan 2 weeks earlier. Then the Cat clogged, and we got the black crusty probe.

 

[stoveliker]

Indeed, the cat might not produce enough heat to sustain itself when only a few cells are open (active) - leading to a stalled cat and crud on the probe (and elsewhere...).

 

[Highbeam]

We do not have Doug Fir in Maine,.. we have Balsam Fir, think Christmas trees and wreathes. The messed-up probe was from the nonfunctioning cat I believe, it was all dusty tan 2 weeks earlier. Then the Cat clogged, and we got the black crusty probe.

Our Christmas trees and wreaths are usually Doug fir! Just really common here. We have some noble and silver firs too if you want to pay double.

 

[Jeff in Maine]

I know when I said I had also been experiencing some smoke roll out for the last couple weeks someone said a cat would not cause that, a bypass not being open would. I believe the cat was definitely to blame for that. As since I cleaned out the cat there has been zero smoke roll out before I cleaned the cat the cat was not even up to 300* after running the stove hours and the interior of the stove was always full of black acrid smoke. I am not a pro when it comes to the intricacies of these stoves for sure, but the bypass was open.

 

[Highbeam]

I know when I said I had also been experiencing some smoke roll out for the last couple weeks someone said a cat would not cause that, a bypass not being open would. I believe the cat was definitely to blame for that. As since I cleaned out the cat there has been zero smoke roll out before I cleaned the cat the cat was not even up to 300* after running the stove hours and the interior of the stove was always full of black acrid smoke. I am not a pro when it comes to the intricacies of these stoves for sure, but the bypass was open.

Even with the bypass open the cat still allows flow. The bypass opening is pretty small and the actual bypass door only opens a little bit. I agree that a plugged up cat will increase the likelihood of rollout. These stoves are already prone to that since the door opening is taller than the bypass opening.

 

[Jeff in Maine]

Since cleaning the cat no smoke rolls out. The cat was not passing much air at all, it was better than 2/3rds plugged solid. I never had much smoke roll out unless I opened the door too quickly and "sucked some smoke out that way". Prior to me cleaning the cat when I opened the door every time for a week it would set off the smoke detector 8' away. Since cleaning it has not happened again.

Knowing the symptoms now I will catch this problem much sooner next time.
Cat thermometer not getting very far into the active zone and not staying there long, maybe a 1/2 hour.
Cannot get any appreciable heat from the stove like normal.
Smoke rolling out when door opened, smoke detector going off scaring the hell out of my dog.
Black acrid heavy smoke inside the stove, door glass solid black.
Thermostat / air controller having ZERO effect on the fire in the stove even set to the 6 o'clock position there is very little increase in the flames inside the firebox.

Maybe these symptoms are obvious to some, but they sure had me stumped for a bit. Someone someday can read these symptoms and possibly figure out their issue from this.