New construction - thinking Quadra-Fire 4300 - any thoughts appreciated!

[BrotherBart]

The first ACC i Did the customer freaked about the stove ticking. It is a little wierd.

Level the stove. Steel stoves "talk" to ya a lot less when they are dead level.

No no BB, he's talking about the new timer that controls the start-up air. You push the rear air control all the way in to activate the timer and then set it to the level you want. After the timer counts down it shuts the start up air shutter and the stove burns at the settings you left it at.

Ah. Ok. Be sure that the thermo for the 30 doesn't tick and stuff. Annoys old people. I can start it, keeping it going without melting down is the thermo's job.

 

[Corie]

I have to admit I'm mildly baffled by the use of a timer, just doesn't seem to be a great idea. I guess they have their ideas and I have mine.

 

[Gooserider]

One idea I haven't seen mentioned that I think is always worth throwing out when talking about new construction is a Masonry Heater, as opposed to a wood stove. Never owned one, but all descriptions seem to say that a properly sized and designed masonry heater is an ideal solution for efficient low hassle heating, and is a generally neat concept. Essentially they carry the idea of a soapstone stove to the ultimate, but use a different method of burning than an EPA stove.

A masonry heater is a heavy masonry structure containing a firebox and a highly convoluted smoke path It must be centrally located in the home, and works best with an open floor plan. The idea is that one builds one or two largish, fast burning, very hot fires per day in the firebox. The fires burn clean because they are given plenty of air, if you burned an EPA stove the same way it would be overfired. (you basically CAN'T over fire an MH) The heat and smoke travel through the convoluted smoke path, and the masonry captures and stores almost all of the heat, which is then radiated from the surface of the masonry over the next several hours, giving a very uniform temperature.

Some folks incorporate bake ovens into the structure (people that do bread baking claim these are some of the best ovens possible) and others add heat exchangers that can help with DHW or radiant floor heating in other rooms (i.e. bathrooms) There are many options in terms of designs and so forth.

Downsides are the size and weight, they are also slightly pricier than a standard masonry fireplace. The other big downside is that they do have a LONG time lag from first fire to useable heat, so you will probably want a backup system to get the house up to temp after a trip (probably not a bad idea in any case!) They also require that one keep an eye on the weather forecasts a bit as one needs to plan how much / how often to burn about 12 hours ahead so as to avoid over / under heating...

If I were ever in a position to be building a new house, I'd need a really good reason NOT to put in an MH as opposed to a wood stove...

Gooserider

 

[Burnin up VT]

Hmm strange - I stopped receiving updates to this thread and didn't notice most of the replies on this page.

It's been a few months since my last post and we're well underway with construction. We've got the 1st floor framed and are starting on the 2nd. Very exciting! I've taken some time off of thinking about the wood stove because we're mired in all the other decisions that come with a new house.

I figured I'd respond to though Gooserider: the masonry heater you describe sounds exactly like a Russian fireplace, and that was something that was recommended to us. In the end what we really wanted to do was to put in an energy efficient fireplace, and the design of our house is based around that (still is). The one negative you didn't put in your list is cost - a wood stove means you don't have to do any of the masonry which saves a considerable amount of money. Our plans have us only masoning the unit itself, and we're still saving $8-10+k by (temporarily) going with a woodstove over that masoned efficient fireplace.

The plan is that down the road we will finish the basement. The wood stove currently in the main room will then be put it in the basement and we'll put in the masonry and the efficient fireplace in the main room on the first floor.

The decision to mason only the fireplace unit itself and not the entire chimney (16+ ft in the main room) was made because we want to keep things as open as possible visually - currently with a wood stove (and by masoning only the fireplace unit itself) you can see throughout the entire first floor. The chimney would really block things.

Just for fun here's a shot of the framing so you can see the layout. The hole you see is where the staircase will be rising up through the center of the house -and the wood stove is in front of that in the living room (it's a sunken living room). The kitchen is to the right, and the dining room to the left.

EDIT TO ADD: Well that's weird - it screwed up the thumbnail - click through to see the real photo, not the under-the-sea version.

 

[stoveguy13]

The better choice would be the 5700 it is going to do alot better job i that size house and when or if you move it to the basement it will be a much better choice.

 

[Burnin up VT]

When it ends up in the basement it isn't going to be the main source of heat, although obviously heat does rise... The house itself is 2000 sq ft finished to begin (the basement isn't finished to start), although that living room is tall and has quite a bit of glass in it. That's definitely one thing I'm still not sure about - whether I should go with the bigger stove or not.

 

[Hogwildz]

Just a thought, but if you are building new, why not a Quad 7100 fireplace? I think they have ducting also to get the heat to other areas more efficiently? Someone else know better info?

 

[Burnin up VT]

Just a thought, but if you are building new, why not a Quad 7100 fireplace? I think they have ducting also to get the heat to other areas more efficiently? Someone else know better info?

Something like that is the final plan, but for cost reasons we're going with a freestanding stove. I imagine it will be 5-8-10 years before we put in an efficient fireplace. There are quite a few things we're going to be doing as time goes on - this being just one of them.

The Quad 4300 seems like it's a killer price for the stove you get, plus we actually like the clean lines and simple style - we think it will go well with the rest of the house. Down the road it's going to be gorgeous to drop in some native stone masonry and an efficient fireplace, but right now it just didn't make the budget cut.

 

[Hogwildz]

Thats makes sense. If your going to be adding a fireplace with ducting, you might want to plan accordingly during the build. As far as where the duct will run I mean, if your going to do duct off of it. Might be a PITA do run the duct chases later.

 

[stoveguy13]

When it ends up in the basement it isn't going to be the main source of heat, although obviously heat does rise... The house itself is 2000 sq ft finished to begin (the basement isn't finished to start), although that living room is tall and has quite a bit of glass in it. That's definitely one thing I'm still not sure about - whether I should go with the bigger stove or not.

We sell alot of quads and we are in new england as well the real deal with the 4300 is that it is really more of a 1500 sqft heater in your area and the 5700 is a better size for you if you want to heat the house 24/7

 

[Burnin up VT]

Very true. You can see the size of the hole that is going to be in the ceiling (because of the stairs) so we're thinking heat getting upstairs won't be an issue... And the stove is basically right underneath that hole. The ceiling in the living room angles up to two small windows that are in the 2nd floor as well - one in the master bedroom and one in the bathroom - the only room that might be a bit hard to heat and we should probably think about ducting would be the kids room. But really, growing up in vermont, if they're not in a cold bedroom at night they might grow up weak, so maybe we'll put in the ducting but never hook it up

 

[Burnin up VT]

When it ends up in the basement it isn't going to be the main source of heat, although obviously heat does rise... The house itself is 2000 sq ft finished to begin (the basement isn't finished to start), although that living room is tall and has quite a bit of glass in it. That's definitely one thing I'm still not sure about - whether I should go with the bigger stove or not.

We sell alot of quads and we are in new england as well the real deal with the 4300 is that it is really more of a 1500 sqft heater in your area and the 5700 is a better size for you if you want to heat the house 24/7

Very good to know. Does the 5700 come in a flat-top? The website seems to indicate that it is only available as a step-top?

 

[stoveguy13]

where in vt are you?

 

[Burnin up VT]

The house is going up in Addison - off of Rt 17. We're currently trying to sell a condo in Burlington with very little luck...

 

[stoveguy13]

Nice up in that neck of the woods is the condo near stowe or is it downtown burlington always lookinf for a good ski house (5700 for sure)only step top

 

[Burnin up VT]

Stowe is 50-60 minutes - the condo is in the new north end of burlington - about 10 minutes from downtown (20 on a bike - we're right on the bike path).

We did (broken link removed) for the condo.

 

[stoveguy13]

condo looks nice move it closer to stowe and you got a deal ;-) how about a 5700 for the condo

 

[Burnin up VT]

condo looks nice move it closer to stowe and you got a deal ;-) how about a 5700 for the condo

I could throw away all my clothes if I put a 5700 in here - maybe I'd save enough in bills by not washing clothes to buy that energy efficient fireplace after all

 

[Gooserider]

Hmm strange - I stopped receiving updates to this thread and didn't notice most of the replies on this page.

Yes, it is not that hard to accidentally "unsubscribe" from a thread - I've done it a few times.

It's been a few months since my last post and we're well underway with construction. We've got the 1st floor framed and are starting on the 2nd. Very exciting! I've taken some time off of thinking about the wood stove because we're mired in all the other decisions that come with a new house.

I figured I'd respond to though Gooserider: the masonry heater you describe sounds exactly like a Russian fireplace, and that was something that was recommended to us. In the end what we really wanted to do was to put in an energy efficient fireplace, and the design of our house is based around that (still is). The one negative you didn't put in your list is cost - a wood stove means you don't have to do any of the masonry which saves a considerable amount of money. Our plans have us only masoning the unit itself, and we're still saving $8-10+k by (temporarily) going with a woodstove over that masoned efficient fireplace.

Agreed, the "Russian fireplace" is one variant on the Masonry Heater, there seem to be several different "flavors" of MH, mostly with differences in just how they handle the smoke path out of the firebox. Not sure if there is that much difference in performance between the different designs. I'd also agree that a MH is more expensive up front, so you are saving there for sure. The MH advocates claim that it pays back over time through lower maintainence and operation costs, plus more uniform heating performance, but I don't know of any definite proof of that.

The plan is that down the road we will finish the basement. The wood stove currently in the main room will then be put it in the basement and we'll put in the masonry and the efficient fireplace in the main room on the first floor.

The decision to mason only the fireplace unit itself and not the entire chimney (16+ ft in the main room) was made because we want to keep things as open as possible visually - currently with a wood stove (and by masoning only the fireplace unit itself) you can see throughout the entire first floor. The chimney would really block things.

Style is one area that I certainly won't debate, everyone's taste is different - I'd probably say that a masonry chimney going up was a neat visual element... However I'm glad to hear that you considered the idea and made a decision based on reasons that you found suitable - That you like what you end up with is the important thing.

Just for fun here's a shot of the framing so you can see the layout. The hole you see is where the staircase will be rising up through the center of the house -and the wood stove is in front of that in the living room (it's a sunken living room). The kitchen is to the right, and the dining room to the left.

EDIT TO ADD: Well that's weird - it screwed up the thumbnail - click through to see the real photo, not the under-the-sea version.

Looks pretty good, and don't worry about the thumbnail - something in the board software seems to ALWAYS make the thumbnails look strange, not sure why.

Gooserider

 

[dtabor]

Burnin up VT,

Hey fellow VTer, welcome to the site. I just found this post. Im over in Lamoille Cty myself. Sitting in Stowe right now working in fact!!

Anyway, After reading all your posts. Was the Stove and Flag works the place that gave bad reviews of the Defiant?? Just wondering as I have a Defiant sitting in their store room waiting for me to put in my hearth pad so it can be installed. They were VERY positive on the Defiant when I was there looking around. If they are telling you different, they may be getting a call from me prior to install time!!

Ive been down 17 quite a few times. Nice area down there in Addison.

D

PS, Stowe is only 40 min or less from Burlington via I89 Less you get hooked up in the city traffic on the way out! hehe

 

[TMonter]

I can speak directly to Quadrafire's warranty being good.

My 3100i had a secondary manifold defect that caused a crack. Quad replaced the stove within 30 days with a brand new one (They could have just repaired the stove).

I heat about 1500 square feet of a 2200 square foot house with my Quad and it's comfortable.

I've yet to hear of a bad experience with a Quad that wasn't related to improper chimney installation.

 

[Burnin up VT]

dtabor - actually I was in Stove and Flagworks earlier today. The guys (and gals) in Stove and Flagworks are great - everyone I've met in there has been really nice and passed along great info. I had one guy in there a while ago (can't remember his name now) mention something about the QC of VT Castings, but the main guy talking about the lackluster quality of CT Castings was in the Chimney Sweep up on Rt 7 in Burlington.

I brought my wife in today just to 'ok' the look of the thing - she loves the 4300 as do I. Nice, simple, clean - it just looks like a serious heater. And once again for the price it seems hard to beat. Everyone I've talked to in there has said if they were going to buy a stove to heat their house it would be a Quad, and people keep pointing to the 4300 as more than enough for a new construction 2000 sq ft house that is well laid out for a stove. It's nice hearing that when it's definitely one of the most affordable stoves in the place.

We walked out with a receipt for the 4300, the outside air kit, and a big smile on our faces. Can't wait to get this thing installed and burning! In the end if this ends up being too small we can always put it in the basement early and get a larger stove, but I've got a good feeling about this one.

 

[BrotherBart]

That stove is gonna get'er done just fine. Just remember that if you are whacking up wood getting ready for it that you need to cut that stuff at 18" or less. Twenty will be too tight a fit and make a mess of the glass loaded N/S.

Congrats and we eagerly await pics of another fine steel stove.


BroBart (who had to go out every day last winter and shorten some more wood for the next day)