My russian fireplace / masonry stove
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arcticcatmatt said:
No. Not an excuse or an explanation. Black creosote build up will be burned off with one hot fire. It's that simple.
Aye,
Marty
Looks to me like where he has his fires in the back is clean. The front, where he does not load is dark. Maybe if you did a full load front to back it would all be clean.
If the exhaust up top is clear while running, aside from cold start or reload, I'd say your fine.
If the exhaust up top is clear while running, aside from cold start or reload, I'd say your fine.
Just riff'en on this whole Russian stove thing.
This kind of concept was big for awhile in the 80's tptb had a name for that concept in began with an H, I forgot it. I sure don't mean to disparage the owners of these fireplaces. If you move into a house that has one fine...try and make the best of it. But for the average Joe that's thinking about an alternative heating source putting one of these monstrosities in there home had better think twice. The brick work along would buy you 2 or 3 top of the line EPA stoves if your floor could even support the ton and a half of bricks...and all that just to be warm?
If I wanted to be warm we'd be burning oil or gas. When you have 4 naked kids coming out of the bath on a minus 20 day warm doesn't cut it. Nor does it cut it when you take 'em ice fishing all day or ya come in after being outside working on the farm all day in the winter. You want know your labors are to be rewarded and it's heat form a free standing stove that will set you free.
And I haven't even touched on the fact that for all your labors you don't get to be dazzled by a dancing fire with this pos. WTF is up with that? Is it me? Tell me is it me?
This kind of concept was big for awhile in the 80's tptb had a name for that concept in began with an H, I forgot it. I sure don't mean to disparage the owners of these fireplaces. If you move into a house that has one fine...try and make the best of it. But for the average Joe that's thinking about an alternative heating source putting one of these monstrosities in there home had better think twice. The brick work along would buy you 2 or 3 top of the line EPA stoves if your floor could even support the ton and a half of bricks...and all that just to be warm?
If I wanted to be warm we'd be burning oil or gas. When you have 4 naked kids coming out of the bath on a minus 20 day warm doesn't cut it. Nor does it cut it when you take 'em ice fishing all day or ya come in after being outside working on the farm all day in the winter. You want know your labors are to be rewarded and it's heat form a free standing stove that will set you free.
And I haven't even touched on the fact that for all your labors you don't get to be dazzled by a dancing fire with this pos. WTF is up with that? Is it me? Tell me is it me?
The Russian stove, aka the Mason stove, is the fireplace of the devil. If my house had one I would take it down brick by brick... :D
I don't know why you dislike it. Hey, your in central NY too, come over and we will see who can hold their hand on the piece of junk the longest, you go first 
I never heard of them before and I just checked out the website (http://mha-net.org/). Check out the pic gallery - it's friggin cool.
wow ! i love ithica it is truly gorges. i may be wrong but i think it is called a grubka. spent some time over your way in the 70's. the design doesn't look right but i think that was the idea. peace.
arcticcatmatt said:I don't know why you dislike it. Hey, your in central NY too, come over and we will see who can hold their hand on the piece of junk the longest, you go first
That's the whole point I'm trying to make. Sure we can't touch our stove cause it's flesh burning hot...but because it's that way it warms our house on the coldest day...and you know how cold it can get of here. remember that one weekend about 6-7 years ago when it was 30below and few vehicles would start? Well our backup didn't turn on then. Now if our stove was just warm to the touch would it warm this old farm house up? Of course not. I don't' claim to be one of the great thinkers here but one thing I firmly believe in is that you have to start out hot to end up warm.
You have a concept fire pit there...if your family is happy with it then it's victory for you...that's all that matters.
Masonry stoves originated in Europe. A big maker, Tulikivi is out of Finland. Yes, where it gets very, very cold. Then there are the Russian masonry fireplaces. Last I heard it gets cold there too.
Heat is heat whether it's coming from a small point source of a wood stove or a large thermal mass of masonry. The benefit of a masonry heater is that it burns cleanly, heats evenly, only gets loaded once or twice a day, looks great and offers a nice warm spot to sit and is safe. I can dig your appreciation of that hot stove when coming in from ice fishing, but that is not everyone's lifestyle. For some of us old farts, less work is a good thing. And a warm spot to sit feels good on the bones. But I can appreciate your fondness for your stove too. A good wood stove is great, so is a good masonry heater.
Heat is heat whether it's coming from a small point source of a wood stove or a large thermal mass of masonry. The benefit of a masonry heater is that it burns cleanly, heats evenly, only gets loaded once or twice a day, looks great and offers a nice warm spot to sit and is safe. I can dig your appreciation of that hot stove when coming in from ice fishing, but that is not everyone's lifestyle. For some of us old farts, less work is a good thing. And a warm spot to sit feels good on the bones. But I can appreciate your fondness for your stove too. A good wood stove is great, so is a good masonry heater.
savageactor7 said:arcticcatmatt said:I don't know why you dislike it. Hey, your in central NY too, come over and we will see who can hold their hand on the piece of junk the longest, you go first
That's the whole point I'm trying to make. Sure we can't touch our stove cause it's flesh burning hot...but because it's that way it warms our house on the coldest day...and you know how cold it can get of here. remember that one weekend about 6-7 years ago when it was 30below and few vehicles would start? Well our backup didn't turn on then. Now if our stove was just warm to the touch would it warm this old farm house up? Of course not. I don't' claim to be one of the great thinkers here but one thing I firmly believe in is that you have to start out hot to end up warm.
You have a concept fire pit there...if your family is happy with it then it's victory for you...that's all that matters.
just think of it as an extra thick soapstone stove.
Some strong talk Savage...not much real time knowledge.
"WTF is up with that? Is it me? Tell me is it me?" Savage R. You got it, it is. And WTF are those kids running around nekkid for at
-20 ????? Drop a dime on this man.
We heat with wood, that's a 24/7, stump to stove heating. And have for too long...we like it. We know stoves, we know wood.
When we built our place Downeast ourselves --check your climate charts--we seriously considered a Masonry Stove/Fireplace/Heater AS PART OF THE CONSTRUCTION. We asked owners of the masonry stoves about efficiency, construction costs, maintenance, warmth, wood use.
All 6 homes had used it for at least 4 seasons as their only heat source.
Here goes the intelligent pros and cons without the put-downs or rants from the unwashed.
Pros:
Even heat over the daily cycle.
Uses about 1/2 the wood of a stove for the same space and BTUs.
One fire/day for most of a northern winter in Maine.
No cleanout--one full air hot fire transfers to the thermal mass which gives out even heat.
No fire tending.
Cons ( we finally decided to stick with 2 good cast iron wood stoves, since we already had one )
Very expensive --easily 5X the net cost of 2 high end cast stoves--long amortization.
Our wood on our woodlot is "free", and I enjoy the harvesting process managing the woodland including pulp.
We know wood stove technology and the PITAs maintaining them.
The home has to be designed around the masonry fireplace/stove.
The masonry fireplace needs serious extra foundation support.
The masonry fireplace takes up a large footprint--the house has to be larger and more open---more expense.
You don't "tend" the fire ( could be a solid "pro" !!)
That's it. Many have the Masonry Fireplaces and love them. Like anything there is a long learning curve and a financial committment. It is another lifestyle. We're comfortable with both ways of using wood to heat.
JMNSHO
"WTF is up with that? Is it me? Tell me is it me?" Savage R. You got it, it is. And WTF are those kids running around nekkid for at
-20 ????? Drop a dime on this man.
We heat with wood, that's a 24/7, stump to stove heating. And have for too long...we like it. We know stoves, we know wood.
When we built our place Downeast ourselves --check your climate charts--we seriously considered a Masonry Stove/Fireplace/Heater AS PART OF THE CONSTRUCTION. We asked owners of the masonry stoves about efficiency, construction costs, maintenance, warmth, wood use.
All 6 homes had used it for at least 4 seasons as their only heat source.
Here goes the intelligent pros and cons without the put-downs or rants from the unwashed.
Pros:
Even heat over the daily cycle.
Uses about 1/2 the wood of a stove for the same space and BTUs.
One fire/day for most of a northern winter in Maine.
No cleanout--one full air hot fire transfers to the thermal mass which gives out even heat.
No fire tending.
Cons ( we finally decided to stick with 2 good cast iron wood stoves, since we already had one )
Very expensive --easily 5X the net cost of 2 high end cast stoves--long amortization.
Our wood on our woodlot is "free", and I enjoy the harvesting process managing the woodland including pulp.
We know wood stove technology and the PITAs maintaining them.
The home has to be designed around the masonry fireplace/stove.
The masonry fireplace needs serious extra foundation support.
The masonry fireplace takes up a large footprint--the house has to be larger and more open---more expense.
You don't "tend" the fire ( could be a solid "pro" !!)
That's it. Many have the Masonry Fireplaces and love them. Like anything there is a long learning curve and a financial committment. It is another lifestyle. We're comfortable with both ways of using wood to heat.
JMNSHO
downeast said:
One more pro: the heat is radiant, not convective - it's a bit hard to explain quickly, but think of standing in the sun on a cool day and how warm you feel. Instead of being warmed by warm air around you, you are being warmed by radiation penetrating your skin. It means you can keep the air temp a bit cooler than normal. This only applies when you are in a direct sight line of your masonry mass, but the additional benefit is there is much less air movement (which serves to dry your skin, circulate dust, and cool you off like any breeze will - it's why I hate my forced hot air). A masonry heater is like an oversized dry sauna. Heat don't get no healthier than this!
One more con: slow to heat up, slow to cool down - which means you really need to plan your fires well. As someone said, it's like a giant soapstone stove. So you gotta wait a few hours to get warm. And the stone will radiate for hours, which is great in the winter. But if you want a quick shoulder-season warmup, the thing will keep cooking and you may be opening a few doors and windows - not such a bad thing if you like fresh air.
arcticcatmatt I was entirely wrong in dissing your fireplace/stove the way I did...please accept my sincerest apology and I hope you stick around the forum. Since we're neighbors can I souvenir ya a face cord of prime splits as a token of friendship?
arcticcatmatt said:
arcticcatmatt,
Please don't be discouraged by any naysayers here. Unless there is something structurally wrong with your Masonry Heater, or it is really poorly designed then you are darned lucky.
These are much more popular in Europe where wood is in relatively short supply since on average they use a lot less wood than a "conventional" wood stove. If I remember correctly they only use about 25% as much.
I wish I had time to give you a really good overview of what they are and how they work, instead I will simply encourage you to do your research. Check out the MHA site. Sign up for their Yahoo chat group and post your pictures there. And try searching this board using the term "Masonry Heater", Contraflow (or Contra Flow), Tulikivi (or Tulikivi, I forget the correct spelling and I'm sure others have misspelled it as well), etc.
I think it's especially important that you have it inspected by someone that knows what they are doing to make sure it doesn't need any repairs and that you figure out how to run it properly, not merely for efficiency reasons but due to the possibility of carbon monoxide poisoning.
Good luck and please keep us posted.
~Cath
I think their pretty darned impressive. They can have cook tops- right? Is there any way to accomodate an exchanger for DHW as well?
I would definitely consider one if building a house. An amazing central defining feature.
I would definitely consider one if building a house. An amazing central defining feature.
savageactor7 said:
Hey thats no problem. As much as I need firewood I could not accept free wood from anyone for any reason. I appreciate the offer, top notch, but not needed.
I am a 28 year old first time homeowner. I just bought the place 5-6 months ago. I purchased $250 in dry wood, I also drove 4 hrs back where I am from and cut up a ton, then went back TWICE to spit it and get it. I got alot of wood from there but my meter says its not dry enough, its only 26% on the inside
. So sadly I learned a lesson, I am going to run out of wood. This stove REQUIRES dry dry hardwood. I had a professional come the other day to clean chimneys and inspect, he passed everything. The bad part about this stoves design is the builder did not put in enough cleaning ports, most of the stove cannot be looked at.
I understand it would be hard and probably not smart for someone to add one of these to their home, the home has to be almost designed around the stove. Heck, underneath the stove is about 2.5 feet of solid concrete and that sits on top of 12? feet of a cinder block base built to support the stove right down to the basement floor.
Sorry if I got anyone going, it was not my intent.
I think its preference, and housing situation. I wasn't really sold on the masonary stove idea until I saw one in action.
My friends recently built a large solar addition onto their cabin, basically made a whole separate house. A stone mason
friend of ours built the masonary stove and the addition was constructed around that. With the solar gain from all of the
southern facing windows, and thick insulation, during average winter temps they only need to fire the heater about once
every 1 1/2 to 2 days. The mass stays warm for that long. Of course, they fire it more often when the temp really drops.
They kept the woodstove in the old part of the house, so they have the best of both worlds.
I don't know about running DHW tubes through it, but there is a bread oven directly above the firebox. The oven stays hot
enough to bake bread for several hours after the fire goes out. I've attached a pic of the stove, but its from just after it was
constructed. The glass hadn't been installed yet. Unfortunately, I don't have a recent pic.. I've since helped them lay a brick
floor over the plain cement floor. The brick really sets off the color of the stove.
If I ever build a house, I will probably go with one. However, I'm in an old farm house now, and I couldn't imagine heating
this place with a masonary heater. In a situation like this, you really need something to put out a quick heat. Soapstone
wouldn't cut it here either, unless I was around 24/7 to keep the stove going and thats not always possible.
My friends recently built a large solar addition onto their cabin, basically made a whole separate house. A stone mason
friend of ours built the masonary stove and the addition was constructed around that. With the solar gain from all of the
southern facing windows, and thick insulation, during average winter temps they only need to fire the heater about once
every 1 1/2 to 2 days. The mass stays warm for that long. Of course, they fire it more often when the temp really drops.
They kept the woodstove in the old part of the house, so they have the best of both worlds.
I don't know about running DHW tubes through it, but there is a bread oven directly above the firebox. The oven stays hot
enough to bake bread for several hours after the fire goes out. I've attached a pic of the stove, but its from just after it was
constructed. The glass hadn't been installed yet. Unfortunately, I don't have a recent pic.. I've since helped them lay a brick
floor over the plain cement floor. The brick really sets off the color of the stove.
If I ever build a house, I will probably go with one. However, I'm in an old farm house now, and I couldn't imagine heating
this place with a masonary heater. In a situation like this, you really need something to put out a quick heat. Soapstone
wouldn't cut it here either, unless I was around 24/7 to keep the stove going and thats not always possible.
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I like going on vacation in the winter too much to be tied to my house every day to feed a fire.
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