Moisture content poll.

[tfdchief]

Battenkiller? Where are you? He did a test that showed the mc was just a general idea.. that really 20% was more like 25
I don't know if anyone remembers but mm weren't wood specific.. there was a chart that u needed to check because if it read 20% for that wood species u might have to add or subtract however many % points...
Point is in his testing ideal wood was 15-25% and it was unlikely that many get to 15% or less as most areas across the country never sustain that low of outside humidity % ..
So again if I could find it the point was most of us with our best wood outside will never get below ~18%
Unless we store indoors or a controlled environment..
Hopefully batten will chime in or someone will remember it...
For the record I try to get my wood in at least a day before and it burns great

I fear he is burning 5 % MC pellets and "can't come to the phone" :cheese:

 

[Flatbedford]

I don't own a moisture meter. Wood should be dry enough that it doesn't steam or his when you toss it on a bed of coals.

 

[oldspark]

Mine was simpler but far less informative. :lol:

i kinda miss BK.

 

[tfdchief]

Mine was simpler but far less informative. :lol:

i kinda miss BK.

Me too!

 

[oldspark]

I don't own a moisture meter. Wood should be dry enough that it doesn't steam or his when you toss it on a bed of coals.

Good point, that will be somewhere between 20 to 25%.

 

[Jags]

Mine was simpler but far less informative. :lol:

i kinda miss BK.

We gotta go yank that dang pellet stove out of his new place. The thing is ruining him.

 

[iceman]

Battenkiller? Where are you? He did a test that showed the mc was just a general idea.. that really 20% was more like 25
I don't know if anyone remembers but mm weren't wood specific.. there was a chart that u needed to check because if it read 20% for that wood species u might have to add or subtract however many % points...
Point is in his testing ideal wood was 15-25% and it was unlikely that many get to 15% or less as most areas across the country never sustain that low of outside humidity % ..
So again if I could find it the point was most of us with our best wood outside will never get below ~18%
Unless we store indoors or a controlled environment..
Hopefully batten will chime in or someone will remember it...
For the record I try to get my wood in at least a day before and it burns great

I fear he is burning 5 % MC pellets and "can't come to the phone" :cheese:

ROTFL, Lmao! Omg... LOL

 

[gyrfalcon]

Mine was simpler but far less informative. :lol:

i kinda miss BK.

We gotta go yank that dang pellet stove out of his new place. The thing is ruining him.

+ 1

It's a sad thing when you lose a guy to the dark side.

 

[gyrfalcon]

I too can get wood ready to burn over the summer. However, I also find that it burns much better if left in the stack longer. Yes, I can tell a difference between 1 year, 2 year and 3 year wood.

You are correct that it is nice to have all that wood. Just think what might happen or could happen. I think of fire_chief Steve and how he got laid up. Should an injury put me down for a while or a sickness, we won't worry much about the wood supply for sure.

+1
I didn't think there would be much difference.
Birch, it's said, will be dry & ready to burn after one year. I've done that & yes it burns ok.
After getting that 1 year of burning I had several cords left. the next season, the wood burned so much better it was very noticeable.
Now 3 year old birch, I notice the bark starts to get loose, it burns great too.Is a better burn than the 2 year, seems to be drier, but not sure it's more heat. Birch bark lights off fast so I have to hurry even faster to load the stove with the 3 yr old stuff..

Well, that's the question, isn't it. What does "burns better" mean? As above, terlit paper "burns better" than even well-seasoned rock maple, but I wouldn't want to try to heat my house with it. My firewood is around 20 MC. Except for the red oak which seems to want a hot fire before it will condescend to ignite, which is also 20 MC, it all lights off easily and burns well. As Oldspark says, it couldn't burn any more easily unless it loaded itself into the stove. I burn primarily rock maple, beech, some ash and some red oak.

When I super-dried some small beech splits next to the stove for several weeks last winter, I got *less* heat from it than I did from the same load of beech that hadn't sat near the stove for so long. Don't know what the MC was of those super-dry splits, but they were very light, ignited if you so much as looked at them, burned rapidly and gave much less heat than I'm used to getting from beech.

I voted for 20 in the poll, as I couldn't help notice most people did, though the "lower than 20" folks seem to be dominating the comments here.

 

[wetwood]

Contrary to my username I want wood as dry as possible with 2-3 years drying time. Right now I'm burning Ash, Oak, and Osage Orange splits that read 11% on my cheap moisture meter. I have never had a moisture reading below 10% on any splits with the meter. Sure helps keep the creosote down in the pre-catalytic stove and pipe. From experience, if the wood is hissing I'm cleaning the pipe a lot more often.

 

[roddy]

Intellectually, the lower the better.

Just for sake of argument - wood CAN be too dry. There is a reason that your owners manual states what it does for MC%. Will wood sitting outside get to this point? Doubt it.

Too dry of wood will actually cause a DIRTY burn, believe it or not. The problem is that it outgasses at a rate that the tubes/cat can't keep up with burning it all up. Then out the stack it goes. That is where people run into problems with using too much kiln dried lumber in their stoves. Overfires and smokey stacks can result.

Again - this is just for arguments sake and in no way am I confusing this with air dried cord wood.

well,ive read that too,but i burn all most all kiln dried maple at two different locations,and ive not seen over fires or excess smoke or what not,we dry everything to 6-8 % moisture,but after a month or so in the sheds,it creeps up to 9-10 % moisture,(yes wood re-absorbs moisture) so maybe thats why there is no problem for me burning kd wood,it about the same as three yr old wood somewhere else

 

[LLigetfa]

I didnt vote because I don't have a moisture meter, which means I don't know what the moisture content of my firewood is. I do know that I haven't ever found any of my wood to be too dry. I store it uncovered outside and it burns just fine, but it burns even better after some time inside.

+1
By inside, I mean in my woodshed that has no walls. I don't store wood in the house.

 

[Jags]

it creeps up to 9-10 % moisture,(yes wood re-absorbs moisture) so maybe thats why there is no problem for me burning kd wood,it about the same as three yr old wood somewhere else

Your probably on to something there. That is why my original post stated that I doubt anybody could get cord wood outside to be "too dry".

 

[blades]

The key is getting the center down to 10-15% , the outside 1-2" is going to vary with the surrounding conditions.

 

[StihlHead]

Intellectually, the lower the better.

Just for sake of argument - wood CAN be too dry. There is a reason that your owners manual states what it does for MC%. Will wood sitting outside get to this point? Doubt it.

Too dry of wood will actually cause a DIRTY burn, believe it or not. The problem is that it outgasses at a rate that the tubes/cat can't keep up with burning it all up. Then out the stack it goes. That is where people run into problems with using too much kiln dried lumber in their stoves. Overfires and smokey stacks can result.

Again - this is just for arguments sake and in no way am I confusing this with air dried cord wood.

I voted popcorn dry before reading the thread. I have to say that you are likely onto something here, and hence it will depend on the wood burning appliance that you have. With a newer NC30 or the like with an open feed air intake to secondary burners, you are likely going to combust the wood gasses really fast. Too dry and the wood will basically vaporize. With an older smoke dragon you can dial down the air intake and control the flame, but with an open feed you cannot do that. Likely in an EPA stove it will overfire on you, or as you say the wood gasses will exit unburned up the flue and the efficiency will drop.

One must burn within the intended design of any stove.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Intellectually, the lower the better.

Just for sake of argument - wood CAN be too dry. There is a reason that your owners manual states what it does for MC%. Will wood sitting outside get to this point? Doubt it.

Too dry of wood will actually cause a DIRTY burn,[/b] believe it or not. The problem is that it outgasses at a rate that the tubes/cat can't keep up with burning it all up. Then out the stack it goes. That is where people run into problems with using too much kiln dried lumber in their stoves. Overfires and smokey stacks can result.

Again - this is just for arguments sake and in no way am I confusing this with air dried cord wood.

Whoa Jags. I missed this post by you and with all due respect, I have to disagree. Too dry? I've not see that yet. Dirty burn????? Whoa! I'm sure you've read about our wood and even that wood we took to the Open House last fall. That was cut, split and stacked in December 2002 and burned in October 2011. Was it too dry?

Dirty burn? Well, with our old stove we used to clean our chimney several times every winter. With the Fireview we have cleaned it once and this is on our 5th burning year. Today our chimney was checked by a professional (my wife) and she said it is sparkling clean. Just nothing there to brush. Yes, there as a little bit of soot and fly ash as she removed the cap on the tee but there was very little. We still have got no creosote from our chimney and the majority of the wood we've burned since getting this stove was 6-8 years in the stack. Dirty burn? I would say not.

 

[amateur cutter]

Best results. 10% .
Good results 15%
OK results 20%
Less moisture, better burn.

What he said. Although I don't own a MM, I just let her dry for a couple 3 years. It either burns good or it doesn't. A C

 

[Lumber-Jack]

Intellectually, the lower the better.

Just for sake of argument - wood CAN be too dry. There is a reason that your owners manual states what it does for MC%. Will wood sitting outside get to this point? Doubt it.

Too dry of wood will actually cause a DIRTY burn,[/b] believe it or not. The problem is that it outgasses at a rate that the tubes/cat can't keep up with burning it all up. Then out the stack it goes. That is where people run into problems with using too much kiln dried lumber in their stoves. Overfires and smokey stacks can result.

Again - this is just for arguments sake and in no way am I confusing this with air dried cord wood.

Whoa Jags. I missed this post by you and with all due respect, I have to disagree. Too dry? I've not see that yet. Dirty burn????? Whoa! I'm sure you've read about our wood and even that wood we took to the Open House last fall. That was cut, split and stacked in December 2002 and burned in October 2011. Was it too dry?

Dirty burn? Well, with our old stove we used to clean our chimney several times every winter. With the Fireview we have cleaned it once and this is on our 5th burning year. Today our chimney was checked by a professional (my wife) and she said it is sparkling clean. Just nothing there to brush. Yes, there as a little bit of soot and fly ash as she removed the cap on the tee but there was very little. We still have got no creosote from our chimney and the majority of the wood we've burned since getting this stove was 6-8 years in the stack. Dirty burn? I would say not.

Dennis the wood I burn is very dry, and I have had the exact problem Jags is describing, but I’ve found a solution.

Normally if I throw a big load of my very dry (12% MC or less lodgepole pine) wood on top of a hot bed of coals the wood will begin to off gas very rapidly, the secondaries will light off and if I don't turn down the draft right away the stove temps will quickly climb into the danger zone. If I do turn down the draft, to restrict the amount of oxygen entering the stove, it will slow the secondary burn rate and keep the temps from climbing too high, but at the expense of a clean burn. The heat from the coals is still heating the wood and it still continues to off gas. It's only because it not getting enough oxygen that fire doesn't get too hot. In effect what ends up happening is the stove is running too rich. Too much fuel, not enough oxygen. I get a lot of smoke coming out the chimney, I end up wasting potential BTUs as unburned fuel goes up the chimney, and the wood burns up faster than it should.
If I load the same type of wood that is closer to 20% MC on top of a hot bed of coals the extra MC seems to slow the off gassing and I can leave the draft open a little more and allow more oxygen in and I get a cleaner (less smoke) longer burn.


So under the conditions above one might conclude that I'm better off with my wood being 20% MC rather than <12%.
But maybe not. The problem isn't the dry wood, but rather how I'm burning it.
In the nearly 4 years I have been using this particular stove and burning the same wood, I have managed to figure out several ways to burn my dry wood more efficiently.
One trick (if it can be called that) that I use for large loads and long burns, is to not throw the wood on a hot bed of coals. As I mentioned earlier, when I load the fresh load of wood on top of the coals the heat from underneath gets the wood off gassing fast. Then once the secondaries get going it starts cooking the wood from two sides, top and bottom, and the excess gassing problem begins.
The way I avoid burning from two sides is to rake ALL the coals to the front of the stove and load the fresh wood to the back. Doing this I get a fire that burns from the front to the back. It usually takes a while longer for the secondaries to get going, but once they do I can close my draft and I only have a fire on one side (not two sides) and I get more controlled off gassing and a cleaner burn.

The other way I’m able to burn this very dry wood cleanly is to burn small amounts at a time. In this case I can just throw one or two smaller splits right on top the coals and turn the draft down. The wood off gasses just as much as before, but because there is less wood, there is less gas and the mix isn’t as rich. With smaller loads like that I can even leave the draft open a little for a real clean burn and not worry about over heating the stove because with less fuel there is going to be less overall heat generated. The downside with this method is less wood loads means shorter burns.

I don’t think hardwoods like oak suffer from this problem because they off gas slower.

 

[woodsmaster]

I voted 20% I havn't had any luck getting wood under 17% around here.

 

[SolarAndWood]

I voted 20% I havn't had any luck getting wood under 17% around here.

I think that is about right for anyone in the northeast that is drying wood outside even under a roof? Three years ahead seems to get everything I bring home there no matter how ugly it is, how big I split it or that it does most of its drying in the heap. If I was super organized, I would separate it, stack it in single rows and take advantage of the stuff I know dries faster to reduce the storage space. To me, its not worth the hassle.

 

[Jags]

Whoa Jags.

Dennis - gotta read the whole post for it to be in context.

"Will wood sitting outside get to this point? Doubt it."

 

[Lumber-Jack]

Whoa Jags.

Dennis - gotta read the whole post for it to be in context.

"Will wood sitting outside get to this point? Doubt it."

Maybe you should have read my whole post Jags.
No problem getting wood here that dry. But I live in a different climate than you, are you taking that into account?

 

[Jags]

Whoa Jags.

Dennis - gotta read the whole post for it to be in context.

"Will wood sitting outside get to this point? Doubt it."

Maybe you should have read my whole post Jags.
No problem getting wood here that dry. But I live in a different climate than you, are you taking that into account?

I did, and yep. Dennis is in an area that is pretty close to the same climate as me. Just a bit cooler/snowier.

I understand the plight that you are having with your burn characteristics, and this doesn't hold 100% true, but for MOST people, it will be next to impossible to have "too" dry of wood, if it is seasoned in the elements.

Blanket statements concerning wood burning rarely hold true.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Intellectually, the lower the better.

Just for sake of argument - wood CAN be too dry. There is a reason that your owners manual states what it does for MC%. Will wood sitting outside get to this point? Doubt it.

Too dry of wood will actually cause a DIRTY burn,[/b] believe it or not. The problem is that it outgasses at a rate that the tubes/cat can't keep up with burning it all up. Then out the stack it goes. That is where people run into problems with using too much kiln dried lumber in their stoves. Overfires and smokey stacks can result.

Again - this is just for arguments sake and in no way am I confusing this with air dried cord wood.

Whoa Jags. I missed this post by you and with all due respect, I have to disagree. Too dry? I've not see that yet. Dirty burn????? Whoa! I'm sure you've read about our wood and even that wood we took to the Open House last fall. That was cut, split and stacked in December 2002 and burned in October 2011. Was it too dry?

Dirty burn? Well, with our old stove we used to clean our chimney several times every winter. With the Fireview we have cleaned it once and this is on our 5th burning year. Today our chimney was checked by a professional (my wife) and she said it is sparkling clean. Just nothing there to brush. Yes, there as a little bit of soot and fly ash as she removed the cap on the tee but there was very little. We still have got no creosote from our chimney and the majority of the wood we've burned since getting this stove was 6-8 years in the stack. Dirty burn? I would say not.

Dennis the wood I burn is very dry, and I have had the exact problem Jags is describing, but I’ve found a solution.

Normally if I throw a big load of my very dry (12% MC or less lodgepole pine) wood on top of a hot bed of coals the wood will begin to off gas very rapidly, the secondaries will light off and if I don't turn down the draft right away the stove temps will quickly climb into the danger zone. If I do turn down the draft, to restrict the amount of oxygen entering the stove, it will slow the secondary burn rate and keep the temps from climbing too high, but at the expense of a clean burn. The heat from the coals is still heating the wood and it still continues to off gas. It's only because it not getting enough oxygen that fire doesn't get too hot. In effect what ends up happening is the stove is running too rich. Too much fuel, not enough oxygen. I get a lot of smoke coming out the chimney, I end up wasting potential BTUs as unburned fuel goes up the chimney, and the wood burns up faster than it should.
If I load the same type of wood that is closer to 20% MC on top of a hot bed of coals the extra MC seems to slow the off gassing and I can leave the draft open a little more and allow more oxygen in and I get a cleaner (less smoke) longer burn.


So under the conditions above one might conclude that I'm better off with my wood being 20% MC rather than <12%.
But maybe not. The problem isn't the dry wood, but rather how I'm burning it.
In the nearly 4 years I have been using this particular stove and burning the same wood, I have managed to figure out several ways to burn my dry wood more efficiently.
One trick (if it can be called that) that I use for large loads and long burns, is to not throw the wood on a hot bed of coals. As I mentioned earlier, when I load the fresh load of wood on top of the coals the heat from underneath gets the wood off gassing fast. Then once the secondaries get going it starts cooking the wood from two sides, top and bottom, and the excess gassing problem begins.
The way I avoid burning from two sides is to rake ALL the coals to the front of the stove and load the fresh wood to the back. Doing this I get a fire that burns from the front to the back. It usually takes a while longer for the secondaries to get going, but once they do I can close my draft and I only have a fire on one side (not two sides) and I get more controlled off gassing and a cleaner burn.

The other way I’m able to burn this very dry wood cleanly is to burn small amounts at a time. In this case I can just throw one or two smaller splits right on top the coals and turn the draft down. The wood off gasses just as much as before, but because there is less wood, there is less gas and the mix isn’t as rich. With smaller loads like that I can even leave the draft open a little for a real clean burn and not worry about over heating the stove because with less fuel there is going to be less overall heat generated. The downside with this method is less wood loads means shorter burns.

I don’t think hardwoods like oak suffer from this problem because they off gas slower.

Carbon it does not sound like you are burning much different that we are. One of the biggest keys is how much you have in there for coals. Large coal bed and the fire takes off pretty darned fast. Also for night burns, I too will push the coals forward and put a large split or a round in bottom rear. It does work to hold the fire longer.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Whoa Jags.

Dennis - gotta read the whole post for it to be in context.

"Will wood sitting outside get to this point? Doubt it."

I did Jags. Just wanted to point out something else. Did you check the "Denniswood" that was used at Woodstock?