Liner expansion and seams

[rmcfall]

I posted this in another thread, but thought it might deserve its own thread title. I was wondering how liner with butt welded seams (e.g., Olympic's Rhino Rigid) expands compared to liner with the double seam roll lock (e.g., Elmer's). Since there is no joint to allow expansion with the seamless liner pipe like Rhino Rigid, how does the expansion occur?

 

[GVA]

I posted this in another thread, but thought it might deserve its own thread title. I was wondering how liner with butt welded seams (e.g., Olympic's Rhino Rigid) expands compared to liner with the double seam roll lock (e.g., Elmer's). Since there is no joint to allow expansion with the seamless liner pipe like Rhino Rigid, how does the expansion occur?

Well let's see all metal expands with heat and if it's rigid and solid welded at each joint the whole pipe would expand somewhat uniformly whereas a roll lock or slip connector being seperate pieces of metal may have an air gap (although minimal) will slow the transfer of energy and therefore the expansion from one piece to the other.

 

[rmcfall]

So pipe with a roll lock will expand LESS than seamless pipe because of the air gap? Seems like less expansion would be better? Then, would a roll lock be preferable?

I posted this in another thread, but thought it might deserve its own thread title. I was wondering how liner with butt welded seams (e.g., Olympic's Rhino Rigid) expands compared to liner with the double seam roll lock (e.g., Elmer's). Since there is no joint to allow expansion with the seamless liner pipe like Rhino Rigid, how does the expansion occur?

Well let's see all metal expands with heat and if it's rigid and solid welded at each joint the whole pipe would expand somewhat uniformly whereas a roll lock or slip connector being seperate pieces of metal may have an air gap (although minimal) will slow the transfer of energy and therefore the expansion from one piece to the other.

 

[GVA]

So pipe with a roll lock will expand LESS than seamless pipe because of the air gap? Seems like less expansion would be better? Then, would a roll lock be preferable?

I posted this in another thread, but thought it might deserve its own thread title. I was wondering how liner with butt welded seams (e.g., Olympic's Rhino Rigid) expands compared to liner with the double seam roll lock (e.g., Elmer's). Since there is no joint to allow expansion with the seamless liner pipe like Rhino Rigid, how does the expansion occur?

Well let's see all metal expands with heat and if it's rigid and solid welded at each joint the whole pipe would expand somewhat uniformly whereas a roll lock or slip connector being seperate pieces of metal may have an air gap (although minimal) will slow the transfer of energy and therefore the expansion from one piece to the other.

It's not that it will expand less but each section will expand at different rates. Welded pipe joints won't need to be sealed with cement of hi-temp RTV (depending on application). Lock joints are to be sealed mainly for this reason

 

[rmcfall]

you mean the lock joint running along the length of the liner section? So the cement wouldn't loosen during the expansion of the lock joint?

 

[GVA]

you mean the lock joint running along the length of the liner section? So the cement wouldn't loosen during the expansion of the lock joint?

If done properly no it shouldn't
and as far as butt welded pipes it can depend on the person welding these pipes together as to the integrity also.

 

[BrotherBart]

The bottom line is that given a choice of welded pipes or snap connected seams, take the welded every day of the week.

 

[rmcfall]

Thanks for the information everyone. Sounds like the welded pipe is superior. Does anyone know where to find a slip connector with welded seams?

 

[elkimmeg]

If you can go this way, One can imploy a slip connector setup using your connector pipe. I would take two sections of connector pipe and overlap them compressing them then pulling them out to make the final connection. What I do is slide the two pieces together find my length and make the cuts plus 1.5" required for proper over lap. Before I slide the pieces together I coat the two sliding surfaces with WD40, which will burn off when the stove is fired up.

 

[rmcfall]

I believe I follow what you are saying, except for where do I find two pieces that will slide together? So far I have received 2 slip connectors from Olympic, and neither of them will fit into the 1-foot piece of Rigid pipe that I also received from Olympic.

Please explain more about what you are referring to. I am definitely open to your idea.

If you can go this One can imploy a slip connector setup using your connector pipe. I would take two sections of connector pipe and overlap them compressing them then pulling them out to make the final connection. What I do is slide the two pieces together find my length and make the cuts plus 1.5" required for proper over lap. Before I slide the pieces together I coat the two sliding surfaces with WD40, which will burn off when the stove is fired up.

 

[elkimmeg]

say you had to sectionss of single wall pipe, one has to cut off the corrugated end including the rib, just above the corrugations, then with crimpers I re crimp the freshly cut edge
I wd40 that pipe and the pipe it will fit into. I pish the two pipes together creating a large overlapping I will fit then to your liner and then to your stoves using adjustiable elbows and pull
the overlapped pipes out to make the final fit. then screw the final overlap joint for it final position. You just custom made your own slip joint
Remember all pipes under the damper plate can be single wall connector pipe. There are times when one must compromise and improvise to make things work.
Naturally 22 ga welded seam pipe would be better but flexibility of adjustiable elbows can make the final connection so much easier

 

[rmcfall]

I think I see what you are saying. I guess the part I am getting stuck on is how two pieces of pipe the same size will slide together? I realize the crimp you put in the end will get it started, but I didn't think a pipe would fit into another pipe of equal diameter. Guess I will have to try it. WD-40 must really make a lot of difference.

When you connect your slip connector to the TEE, do you put the end of the connector INSIDE the TEE?
Thanks!

say you had to sectionss of single wall pipe, one has to cut off the corrugated end including the rib, just above the corrugations, then with crimpers I re crimp the freshly cut edge
I wd40 that pipe and the pipe it will fit into. I pish the two pipes together creating a large overlapping I will fit then to your liner and then to your stoves using adjustiable elbows and pull
the overlapped pipes out to make the final fit. then screw the final overlap joint for it final position. You just custom made your own slip joint
Remember all pipes under the damper plate can be single wall connector pipe. There are times when one must compromise and improvise to make things work.
Naturally 22 ga welded seam pipe would be better but flexibility of adjustiable elbows can make the final connection so much easier

 

[BrotherBart]

I put the crimped end of my slip joint into the tee and the slip end into the six inch pipe. Then drilled and put screws into both.