Just brought home my new Progress Hybrid

[rideau]

Most of us read the stovetop temp on the cast near the to flue exit. It seems to be a much better gauge for closing the bypass with the present cooktop.

If your flue temps went down or stayed level and your stovetop temps went up, then, yes, I would say the cat engaged. With the temp climb you note, either the cat engaged or you had really good secondaries, and if you had secondaries you'd know. If the temp stayed up after secondaries slowed down, if secondaries did bring the stove top temp up, then you also can be assured your cat is working. I liked that one could see the cat in the Fireview while h stove was operational. Not so with the PH. But, very soon you'll have a good feel for when the cat engages.

After the stoves had been in operation for a while, it was decided to add a gasket around (over the top and sides of the cat) to prevent air flow around the cat. A rope gasket. If none came with the stove, Woodstock will send you some. Give them a call. I ordered a long length of fairly thick (I think 3/8 inch, but am not sure...they will remember) gasket, because the narrow one they originally sent just disintegrated from the heat of the cat. I had to replace it every time I brushed the cat. The larger gasket I have used all this season and part of last without replacement, and it fits in very snuggly. I keep a thin bladed and handled stainless kitchen knife
(flatware, but cheap) with my stove gear, lay the gasket on top of the cat, and push the gasket in with the knife. When it is new it takes a bit of pushing, but goes in quite easily thereafter.

I agree, the stove does put tremendous heat out the glass. People who have not experienced the stove don't comprehend the amazing heat. This stove is a great and rapid heater. Heats a cold room much more quickly than the Fireview.

Again, enjoy the stove.

 

[Wolf]

Perfect. Thanks for clearing this up for me rideau. I have some of that thicker gasket lying around so I will switch that in there. It just seemed weird and out of place for that small piece of gasket material, but it makes sense now. I know I have some learning to do with this stove, but it seems very responsive and easy to adjust. I am loving it so far. I'll go round two with her tonight and see how she does

 

[Brick (ware)House]

Here is a question for other PH owners. How can you tell if the cat is lighting off? My top center stone never went above 350 but the cast iron near the top flue exit (I have a top exit flue) was 515. I checked the cat this morning and it seems to just be resting freely in the slot, but it doesn't rest flush with the gasket behind it so I think the exhaust may be going around it a little bit. Then they stuck an extra piece of gasket in the gap between the top of the cat and the slot so the cat couldn't rattle. Does anybody else have this?

Since I don't have a cat probe thermo, I have a couple clues I look for to determine what's going on. The most obvious is smoke out the stack. If the cat bypass is closed and the cat is doing its job there should be no smoke out the stack. I can actually walk up to my chimney cap (flat roof) and put my nose right up to the screen when the stove is running properly. There is a slight burnt wood smell but not any smoke. Another clue is the sound made by the stainless steel heat shield above the cat on the underside of the cast cook top. When performing a cold start or bringing the stove back up from a low temperature (<300) you will likely hear that heat shield making noise as the cat takes off. In my experience, the PH is very vocal but the sound of that thin SS heat shield warming from the cat engagement is easy to distinguish.

Having an IR to use on the stack can help you fine tune when to flip the bypass. On cold starts the stove top thermo will dramatically lag exhaust gas temps. Once in cruising range I find that my stack temps (outside single wall) run very consistently at 200 less that the stove top temp. I don't ever worry about cat engagement above about 350 on the cast stove top as I am usually getting some secondaries in the box at that point. On a black box with a decent amount of fuel it will be obvious that cat is working if the temps stay up in the 400-550 range. Please note that when the cat is doing all the work you should monitor the stove closely until you learn its tendencies. The stove seems to have a hard time dissipating all the heat if you feed that cat too much smoke, too fast. With my strong draft, I sometimes have to induce some secondary action to push the heat out the front window and lower firebox instead of sending everything up through the cat in order to keep a large load in check.

No second cat gasket on mine. It seems to sit pretty nice and snug in the channel. If you are seeing smoke out the stack with the cat engaged, temp up and air all the way down there may not be a good seal under the cat.

 

[Tenn Dave]

Since I don't have a cat probe thermo, I have a couple clues I look for to determine what's going on. The most obvious is smoke out the stack. If the cat bypass is closed and the cat is doing its job there should be no smoke out the stack. I can actually walk up to my chimney cap (flat roof) and put my nose right up to the screen when the stove is running properly. There is a slight burnt wood smell but not any smoke. Another clue is the sound made by the stainless steel heat shield above the cat on the underside of the cast cook top. When performing a cold start or bringing the stove back up from a low temperature (<300) you will likely hear that heat shield making noise as the cat takes off. In my experience, the PH is very vocal but the sound of that thin SS heat shield warming from the cat engagement is easy to distinguish.

Having an IR to use on the stack can help you fine tune when to flip the bypass. On cold starts the stove top thermo will dramatically lag exhaust gas temps. Once in cruising range I find that my stack temps (outside single wall) run very consistently at 200 less that the stove top temp. I don't ever worry about cat engagement above about 350 on the cast stove top as I am usually getting some secondaries in the box at that point. On a black box with a decent amount of fuel it will be obvious that cat is working if the temps stay up in the 400-550 range. Please note that when the cat is doing all the work you should monitor the stove closely until you learn its tendencies. The stove seems to have a hard time dissipating all the heat if you feed that cat too much smoke, too fast. With my strong draft, I sometimes have to induce some secondary action to push the heat out the front window and lower firebox instead of sending everything up through the cat in order to keep a large load in check.

No second cat gasket on mine. It seems to sit pretty nice and snug in the channel. If you are seeing smoke out the stack with the cat engaged, temp up and air all the way down there may not be a good seal under the cat.

Brick, are you still having a smoke issue with your PH?

 

[Brick (ware)House]

Brick, are you still having a smoke issue with your PH?

Yes. I have talked to Woodstock and they said they are aware of problems on some stoves and are working on a solution. It seems to be a similar issue on a number of stoves and not unique to mine. I first thought it was coming from along the right side of the cook top but after talking with them I concur that it is somewhere on the loading door/door hinge. My stove is in a huge room which is poorly insulated so it hasn't bothered us too much. I can see how in a smaller room with lower ceiling height that the build up could be quite a problem. I am going to keep running this season but fully intend to have it fixed by next fall.

Did you get your problem worked out?

 

[weatherguy]

I understand it was a risky move, but I knew something needed to change. I tried using everything I could to get the Mansfield up to temp (Damper, biobricks, checked gasket), but it only happened a couple times and it was very finicky and I wasn't getting the burn times either. I was reloading about every 5-6 hours. My draft may have still been too strong even with the damper and I didn't want to run two dampers.

I started that thread because I wasn't sure if getting the new stove would be worth it. You guys said to give my Mansfield a chance and so I gave an honest try to get it to meet my heating needs, but it just couldn't keep up with my 2600sq/ft house. I finally went and saw a PH in action at another PH owners house and that is what pushed me over the edge to purchase a new stove.

I think you got yourself a better stove, I hear it over and over with people that have seen the PH in action and says it blows this stove or that stove out of the water and they come home with one. I think I'll just bite the bullet and switch over myself. I'm going up to Woodstock in two weeks with my wife so we'll see how that goes. I still have an interest in the IS but I have time to think about it.
Keep us updated once the cold weather comes back on how that baby's heating your house.

 

[fire_man]

What did you do , hire a moving company? I think I'm going to have to do something like that with my bad back and hip implant and my brothers back aint what it used to be, no use getting crippled moving a stove to save a few bucks.

Yes I did hire a moving company. I can make a penny squeak, but when it comes to my bad back, my wallet gets opened quickly. I feel your pain.

 

[Tenn Dave]

Yes. I have talked to Woodstock and they said they are aware of problems on some stoves and are working on a solution. It seems to be a similar issue on a number of stoves and not unique to mine. I first thought it was coming from along the right side of the cook top but after talking with them I concur that it is somewhere on the loading door/door hinge. My stove is in a huge room which is poorly insulated so it hasn't bothered us too much. I can see how in a smaller room with lower ceiling height that the build up could be quite a problem. I am going to keep running this season but fully intend to have it fixed by next fall.

Did you get your problem worked out?

No, I still have the smoke smell problem. My stove is a 2012 model. but was just installed this fall. I have spoken with Lorin, and she said a solution is not far away. I have to head back up to NJ to take care of some family issues, so my stove is now shut down for the season. Hopefully, next fall will be a much better burning season for my PH. I'm confident Woodstock will make this right.

 

[toddnic]

Here is a question for other PH owners. How can you tell if the cat is lighting off? My top center stone never went above 350 but the cast iron near the top flue exit (I have a top exit flue) was 515. I checked the cat this morning and it seems to just be resting freely in the slot, but it doesn't rest flush with the gasket behind it so I think the exhaust may be going around it a little bit. Then they stuck an extra piece of gasket in the gap between the top of the cat and the slot so the cat couldn't rattle. Does anybody else have this?

Sounds like your cat is fitted exactly where it should be. With the top gasket in place, the cat should be snug. A good way to tell if the cat is fired, is to take a look at the chimney. If there is nothing coming out, the cat is working. Mine normally fires at around 350 on my temp gauge which is located on top of the stove right next to the flue. You are going to love the PH. It sips wood and really puts out the heat!

 

[Wolf]

I think you got yourself a better stove, I hear it over and over with people that have seen the PH in action and says it blows this stove or that stove out of the water and they come home with one. I think I'll just bite the bullet and switch over myself. I'm going up to Woodstock in two weeks with my wife so we'll see how that goes. I still have an interest in the IS but I have time to think about it.
Keep us updated once the cold weather comes back on how that baby's heating your house.

Sounds like a tough decision, but you will probably be happy with either stove.

Last night was 28 degrees here so it wasn't terribly cold and I wanted to try my first small overnight burn (It has to earn my trust slowly). At 10pm I had a good bed of coals about 2" deep and added 2 medium splits and 1 larger split. Came downstairs at 6:30am to a stove top of 250 and about an inch of coals leftover to easily start it back up. It was a beautiful site

 

[Wolf]

Sounds like your cat is fitted exactly where it should be. With the top gasket in place, the cat should be snug. A good way to tell if the cat is fired, is to take a look at the chimney. If there is nothing coming out, the cat is working. Mine normally fires at around 350 on my temp gauge which is located on top of the stove right next to the flue. You are going to love the PH. It sips wood and really puts out the heat!

Thanks toddnic. I have been running inside and outside the house just to keep making sure and you can't even tell there is a fire. I am loving this

 

[Wolf]

Since I don't have a cat probe thermo, I have a couple clues I look for to determine what's going on. The most obvious is smoke out the stack. If the cat bypass is closed and the cat is doing its job there should be no smoke out the stack. I can actually walk up to my chimney cap (flat roof) and put my nose right up to the screen when the stove is running properly. There is a slight burnt wood smell but not any smoke. Another clue is the sound made by the stainless steel heat shield above the cat on the underside of the cast cook top. When performing a cold start or bringing the stove back up from a low temperature (<300) you will likely hear that heat shield making noise as the cat takes off. In my experience, the PH is very vocal but the sound of that thin SS heat shield warming from the cat engagement is easy to distinguish.

Having an IR to use on the stack can help you fine tune when to flip the bypass. On cold starts the stove top thermo will dramatically lag exhaust gas temps. Once in cruising range I find that my stack temps (outside single wall) run very consistently at 200 less that the stove top temp. I don't ever worry about cat engagement above about 350 on the cast stove top as I am usually getting some secondaries in the box at that point. On a black box with a decent amount of fuel it will be obvious that cat is working if the temps stay up in the 400-550 range. Please note that when the cat is doing all the work you should monitor the stove closely until you learn its tendencies. The stove seems to have a hard time dissipating all the heat if you feed that cat too much smoke, too fast. With my strong draft, I sometimes have to induce some secondary action to push the heat out the front window and lower firebox instead of sending everything up through the cat in order to keep a large load in check.

No second cat gasket on mine. It seems to sit pretty nice and snug in the channel. If you are seeing smoke out the stack with the cat engaged, temp up and air all the way down there may not be a good seal under the cat.

Thanks Brickhouse, I have heard some chatter from the stove and I still have to learn what she is saying, but I heard of a lot of ppl not being able to dampen the fire all the way down or else it has small explosions. Makes me a little worried so I am nervous to try it, but what if I want to do a really slow burn during shoulder season? Do you still leave it cracked open?

 

[gregbesia]

I think you got yourself a better stove, I hear it over and over with people that have seen the PH in action and says it blows this stove or that stove out of the water and they come home with one. I think I'll just bite the bullet and switch over myself. I'm going up to Woodstock in two weeks with my wife so we'll see how that goes. I still have an interest in the IS but I have time to think about it.
Keep us updated once the cold weather comes back on how that baby's heating your house.

Weatherguy, why the interest in woodstock? What's wrong with the Princess?

 

[Brick (ware)House]

Thanks Brickhouse, I have heard some chatter from the stove and I still have to learn what she is saying, but I heard of a lot of ppl not being able to dampen the fire all the way down or else it has small explosions. Makes me a little worried so I am nervous to try it, but what if I want to do a really slow burn during shoulder season? Do you still leave it cracked open?

Your air settings will be unique to your setup and draft and wood (moisture content). With such a strong draft my stove runs fully closed nearly all the time without any fear of back puffing. Even at fully closed the stove is allowing a small amount of combustion air into the box. As long as the small intake hole in the lower center of the front wall of the stove isn't sealed with ash I get plenty of flow. I wouldn't be nervous to experiment with different air settings as long as you are paying attention to the stove. With the big window you can see what's going on and will be able to tell if the fire is suffocating to the point of pulling air back down the chimney or building up gas in the box and flashing over. Unless you have an extremely poor draft, I would suspect that just the slightest notch open of the damper control will smooth things out. If I need to perk things up the adjustment is only enough to break the butterfly off of full closed as the damper control is really sensitive at the low end.

 

[rideau]

In the first short period that I had the stove I experienced a couple of back puffs. You don't want them. They are not fun.

A significant point" Woodstock has changed the air exit from the firebox since the first iteration of the stove...it is one of their updates. I don't know whether the current design would ever backpuff.

At any rate, I now close the air all the way, then just slightly crack it open...just very slightly. Have never had a backpuff since doing that. And, not unusually, if the stove is running with flame at that setting, I will go ahead and close it all the way, but keep an eye on it for a few minutes. If the coals stay red, I leave it like that. If it gets completely black, I open the air a crack. Also, if I see sudden shooting secondaries with a sort of puff feeling to them (don't know how else to describe that), I crack the air open, Either of those two things will happen within 5 to 10 minutes if not sooner of closing the air completely, if either is going to happen,

In summary, cracking the air just slightly will prevent any backpuffs. If you get more flame than you want in that scenario, then close all the way and watch. You'll get a good slow burn one way or the other.

 

[alforit]

I think you got yourself a better stove, I hear it over and over with people that have seen the PH in action and says it blows this stove or that stove out of the water and they come home with one. I think I'll just bite the bullet and switch over myself. I'm going up to Woodstock in two weeks with my wife so we'll see how that goes. I still have an interest in the IS but I have time to think about it.
Keep us updated once the cold weather comes back on how that baby's heating your house.

Not to be a counterpoint here , but to give you another viewpoint. I had the PH and now the BK Ashford. And honestly ? , The Ashford blows the PH out of the water in almost every way and then some.

 

[fire_man]

alforit


Ok I'll bite.

The climate in Western Washington tends to be quite a bit milder than the climate in Central MA.
If I were in your climate I probably would prefer the BK with the amazing burn times and alien technology.

I know you say you can get down to single digits occasionally, but out here it can hit -10F and stay below 15F for days and days. The PH is a heat pump monster.

All I'm saying is I don't think you can claim the Ashford "blows the PH out of the water" when you're frame of reference is very different climate wise.

 

[Coog]

Not to be a counterpoint here , but to give you another viewpoint. I had the PH and now the BK Ashford. And honestly ? , The Ashford blows the PH out of the water in almost every way and then some.

Ohhhh, snap.

Just stirrin'' the pot.

 

[rideau]

I recently conversed with an owner in California. Very happy with the PH there, except for the andirons not being removable or hinged, making cleaning the glass difficult. More heat than needed in the climate, but none of the issues with the stove experienced in Washington. They just open the windows to get a bit of fresh air in the winter, when the stove room temp hits 80, which it does...but only the stove room. And they like being able to get fresh air in the house in the middle of the winter.

I don't know why "alforit" had such a time with the stove, but he did. He, I believe, had previously had a BK, and may have been expecting BK type of burning, which the PH does not do. I know he seriously tried to get the PH to work for him, and was unhappy in the end. If you try to make the stove burn extremely low and slow, smouldering, for 24 hours plus, you are just going to be unhappy. (Not saying that is what "Alforit" did) The stove is designed to put out heat, albeit sometimes at a low level, and to always have at least a glow in the firebox. Specifically, Woodstock tells you not to smoulder any of their stoves. You should always have a red glow. So, to heat in shoulder season, or a shoulder season climate, one burns a small fire once a day, and lets it go out. That may not be for everyone. A BK lets you light a fire and let it burn slowly for 30 hours or so, producing so little heat per hour that the overall heat introduced into the home is very moderate and the home remains comfortable. So, 3 fires a weeks with a BK, 1--7 with a PH depending on daily temps and sunshine, during shoulder season. Larger loads with a BK, smaller with a PH. PH has the advantage of being able to have no fire if the weather turns nice or sunny, perhaps saving on firewood, and possible requiring no more lights than the BK. BK has the advantage that one can set it and forget it for long periods of time. In the rainy NW, that may be a great advantage, as there are not over many sunny days that negate the need for any heat in shoulder season.

I believe it is Browning Bear who consistently states that no stove is perfect for everyone, and this is a good case in point.

 

[alforit]

alforit


Ok I'll bite.

The climate in Western Washington tends to be quite a bit milder than the climate in Central MA.
If I were in your climate I probably would prefer the BK with the amazing burn times and alien technology.

I know you say you can get down to single digits occasionally, but out here it can hit -10F and stay below 15F for days and days. The PH is a heat pump monster.

All I'm saying is I don't think you can claim the Ashford "blows the PH out of the water" when you're frame of reference is very different climate wise.

Tis true I don't have as cold of climate as some others....But we do have our cold spells , believe me......But if you doubt the heating capability of the stove you can talk to member Webby 3650 whom I believe has similar temperatures to what you're speaking of and is heating his 2200 square foot drafty home just perfectly with the Ashford. Or you can speak to my neighbors above me in Alaska whom I've spoken to some myself, and ask them how its heating for them in temperatures far colder than what you're telling me.....And you can also wonder why so many people in Alaska own a BK......Hmmmm

My BK gets hotter and in quicker time than the pH ever did for me......Especially when I take the cast iron top off my stove ....I could roast marshmallows over the top of that.....haha.

The one thing about the pH that beats the BK on is the soapstone effect.

I'm sure the pH is a great stove for others....but it wasn't for me and I'm not going to blow smoke about it.

I am one of the only people that have experience with both stoves on the same flu system in the same house .....
So I can tell you the BK in my opinion blows the pH out of the water .

And I'm not going to list all of the reasons why because I have already derailed this thread for the OP......Sorry


​

 

[fire_man]

I am one of the only people that have experience with both stoves on the same flu system in the same house ....
​

Exactly. your comparison only applies to your climate. Houses in Alaska have tighter building codes for insulation, some boast they can heat their houses with a candle.

 

[alforit]

Exactly. your comparison only applies to your climate. Houses in Alaska have tighter building codes for insulation, some boast they can heat their houses with a candle.

You've been watching too many TV shows my friend.........Not all houses are tight in Alaska........I have friends in Alaska and my parents lived in Alaska.

And what about Webby 3650's drafty house ?.......haha....sorry Webby

 

[rideau]

Wolf,

How has the PH been treating you? Are you getting confident enough to leave nice fire in the stove nights? Is your home comfortable? Any problems?

 

[weatherguy]

Weatherguy, why the interest in woodstock? What's wrong with the Princess?

Nothing wrong, I love the princess, I want a bigger stove and a free stander

 

[fire_man]

Here is a question for other PH owners. How can you tell if the cat is lighting off? My top center stone never went above 350 but the cast iron near the top flue exit (I have a top exit flue) was 515.

I'm surprised your exit temp is so much higher than your center stone temp - at least if that is after the cat has been engaged for a while. Mine works the other way around. The cat is burning the smoke, causing the cat to heat up and makes the stone temp higher. Burned smoke means there is less energy in the exhaust, so there are lower temps on the exhaust side of the cat.

A good indication that the cat lit off is the exhaust temps near the cast iron flue exit are lower than the center stovetop temp. My temperature is an extremely consistent 80 - 100 degree difference between the two. If the flue exit is 300, I can be pretty sure the stovetop center will eventually reach about 380-400F.

The exit temp is higher on mine while I am firing up the stove before engaging the cat, but not once things settle down.

The other way to tell is right after engaging the cat, you should see the center stone temp start to increase, even if there is no flame in the firebox. It might take 5 to 10 minutes after engaging, but you should see a steady increase in temp. I should have realized my cat was no longer very active, because center temp got stuck around 350 F, never higher. After recently cleaning w/ vinegar, it now shoots well above 400 within the first hour.

I'm not sure why your exhaust temp is so much higher than mine, and also higher than your stone temp - I wonder if you have a better draft. My cast iron flue exit never has gone much above about 400F. My 6" SS liner is only 15 feet tall but its insulated. I have a rear vent setup.