Is the brick eating my heat?!

[MagdalenaP]

Oye, so many issues. I think I should have re-searched a bit more. Recently had a regency f2400 installed in my front sunroom (addition to house). It's rated up to 2200sqft, and 8 hour burn times. My house is 1800, and I'm getting about 3.5- 5ish, if packed in good (fresh splits test around 18%).

Windows are double pane, newer. But...the brick. I thought it would be more like thermal mass, keeping the heat in. But now, I'm not too sure...

Shown is an older pic, from when I purchased the house. The stove is right where the clock is, on that brick wall. Single wall pipe.

Should I insulate the brick? And easiest way?

Thank you in advance!

 

[weatherguy]

Does the brick back up to a room in the house or outside?

 

[Ctwoodtick]

After the 3.5 -5 hr burn time, what is left in your stove and/or what is stove top temp? I ask because “burntime” can be a subjective term.

 

[MagdalenaP]

Does the brick back up to a room in the house or outside?

Yes, on the other side is my dining room:

 

[MagdalenaP]

After the 3.5 -5 hr burn time, what is left in your stove and/or what is stove top temp? I ask because “burntime” can be a subjective term.

I'll snap a pic tomorrow. As for stove top temp, not sure, I only have a flue temp gauge on my single wall (I'll note the temp tomorrow).

 

[bholler]

I believe you had a thread asking about this location before having it installed. And many of us had concerns about trying to heat from that space then.

 

[MagdalenaP]

I believe you had a thread asking about this location before having it installed. And many of us had concerns about trying to heat from that space then.

Of course, but I didn't listen! So here I am haha. Honestly, I didn't have an option of any other spot to put it. I did post asking about fan placement, didn't really realize how much heat loss this room has, or if it's more windows or brick that's my issue.

 

[weatherguy]

The dining room looks like a better spot.

 

[bholler]

Of course, but I didn't listen! So here I am haha. Honestly, I didn't have an option of any other spot to put it. I did post asking about fan placement, didn't really realize how much heat loss this room has, or if it's more windows or brick that's my issue.

The brick will suck up heat but most of it will end up back in the house eventually. In my opinion the windows are the problem.

 

[MagdalenaP]

The dining room looks like a better spot.

What's not shown is on the "bottom" side of the kitchen is a stairwell, that goes from our bedroom, into the dining room (which also has windows on that outer side of the house), and bathroom is at the "bottom" of our living room. So that's a path way. Above the kitchen/dining and living room, is a 2nd story with our bedrooms, and that presented issues as well (cost of pipe and windows in the way).

 

[jotul8e2]

The brick is not the problem. Heat absorbed there has nowhere else to go but back into the sunroom or, eventually, into the dining room.

Virtually all of your radiant heat is, um, radiating out into the cold, cold world. Double pane or not, radiant heat passes right through glass.

 

[Rockey]

As you know, that location is less than ideal. Bholler is right about the windows. If you get some insulated window shades it should help a lot. The second issue I see would be getting the heat our of the sunroom and distributed through the house. Can you relocate the stove somewhere different next year?

 

[MagdalenaP]

If I were to cover those windows with curtains, practically the whole house would be dark. Any idea of those thermal window films would help? What about if I tried harder to push the warm air out of the sunroom into the house? Reducing the chance of the heat going out the windows...

Right now, I've got a fan in the top of that little window (to the left of the clock, where the stove is) that's pulling warm air and pushing into the dining room.

 

[Rockey]

I just noticed those windows, that should definitely help. They make shades that are insulated and still allow decent amounts of light through. They do get pricey for custom sizes but may be cheaper than relocating the stove.

 

[jotul8e2]

Radiant heat goes in a straight line until stopped by something - a wall, furniture, the cat - where it is absorbed. You feel radiant heat off of a stove when you stand close to the stove. It is most noticeable when right in front of the glass in the stove door. It feels much warmer there because the radiant heat from combustion is reaching you almost unimpeded. Sadly, with those windows, it continues unimpeded right outside. The black stove box radiates heat as well, of course, but the air that comes in contact with the hot surface also picks up the heat and circulates about in a process known as "convection".

Curtains would help some, I suppose, but would scare me to death that close to a front loading stove. We have not even addressed the fact that more than 50% of your wall has an R value of about 2.

Radiant heat is almost entirely unaffected by fans.

How much radiant vs. convection heat comes off of your stove? I don't know. Rather a lot of radiant early in the burn cycle, for sure. Once in the coaling stage it may become almost entirely convective.

The Regency 2400 is a 2.3 cu. ft. stove. An eight hour burn time is at the outer edge even of normal manufacturer puffery. With good hardwood you should be able to operate on four to six hour cycles.

 

[zrock]

One thing about the brick u need to keep it somewhat constant temp. If u let it get cold it will take 1/2 day or more to climatize again.. now as for the fan in the window I would put a big box fan in their if u can.. then again this is just me I would wire a dimmer swith/ceiling fan speed control switch into a extension cord. Then turn the fan down do it's about 1/2 of the slowest speed setting on the fan. This will still push a good amount of air without being to noisy.. also don't want to suck so much air out that u start to cool the room the fire is in..

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[HomeinPA]

I'll go with the majority and say it's the windows. Plus the fact that you're in Canada and it's damn cold up there! Insulated curtains to the floor all the way along the exterior wall and leave 1 open for light (provided your not to close to the stove) or move the stove into the dining room. Or get lots of wood and you'll at least keep the frost off the windows.

 

[AlbergSteve]

Heat absorbed there has nowhere else to go but back into the sunroom or, eventually, into the dining room.

Probably back in to the sun room - if the sun room was an addition, the brick wall would have been an exterior wall and behind that a one inch air space THEN and insulated framed wall.

 

[ShawnLiNY]

It’s a shame us North Americans don’t use more stove /hydronic systems

 

[maple1]

It's not the brick - it's your windows. [EDIT: not just the windows but also the general layout/floorplan]

If the stove absolutely needs to stay there, you need some good (pricey) insulated blinds or shades for them. You can put them up when sunny out, down the rest of the time.

It's also not just the glass area itself, but all the spaces in between likely have little R value as well.

A second stove elsewhere?

 

[Bad LP]

Windows. They are acting the same as concrete walls in a cold basement. If you want to prove this just cover them with rigid insulation but that would look like crap.
I'd try that plastic sheet people use for single pane, after you install it you shrink it with a hair dryer.

 

[Dug8498]

It's not the brick - it's your windows. [EDIT: not just the windows but also the general layout/floorplan]

If the stove absolutely needs to stay there, you need some good (pricey) insulated blinds or shades for them. You can put them up when sunny out, down the rest of the time.

It's also not just the glass area itself, but all the spaces in between likely have little R value as well.

A second stove elsewhere?

This is spot on. We have insulated window curtains on all of the windows in our house. We keep them open during the day if it’s sunny which allows for some nice passive solar heat to come in, and then close them once the sun goes down. We looked into replacing ours because they have some stains and they came in anywhere between $500-$1000 per window depending on the size so we decided to keep the ones we have haha. They are extremely effective though. We would lose so much friggen heat out of the windows if we didn’t have those. I’ve included a link below to the company that made ours.

https://www.windowquilt.com


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[Todd67]

Do your windows in that room face to the south? That would allow the most passive solar heat into that room on sunny days. It looks like the sun is shining on that taller evergreen tree in the background, which tells me that your "sun room" doesn't face south. You already have blinds hanging above those windows... but how much sun does your sun room get on sunny days? I would only have those blinds open to allow sunlight in on sunny days. Otherwise I would leave those blinds closed, unless I wanted to enjoy the view out those windows.

On cloudy days we keep our insulated blinds closed. On sunny days we only open the blinds on the south-facing windows. Our house is poorly insulated in northern NY, and has old double pain windows. We can actually feel the cold air come in through our windows when we open the blinds on cloudy days.

 

[MagdalenaP]

Windows. They are acting the same as concrete walls in a cold basement. If you want to prove this just cover them with rigid insulation but that would look like crap.
I'd try that plastic sheet people use for single pane, after you install it you shrink it with a hair dryer.

I thought about that, but isn't the point of that plastic to keep leaks out, rather than radiant heat from escaping? I mean, I would think thick glass would do a better job than a sheet of plastic...

 

[maple1]

I thought about that, but isn't the point of that plastic to keep leaks out, rather than radiant heat from escaping? I mean, I would think thick glass would do a better job than a sheet of plastic...

It is to create a layer of insulating still air, between the hot & cold zones.

Are your windows cold to the touch? Should be all the indication needed. They are serving to radiate the cold of outside, directly to your indoors. The layout, and the stove being where it is, is really creating quite an 8 ball to be behind.