I'm glad there's a growing "green" trend! Energy, food, do it you'll save the world!

[Dune]

Quite simple really. As most anything decomposes it releases methane (the major component of natural gas). Since methane burns well in internal combustion engines, gas or diesel, one with a sufficient supply of organic matter can readily generate enough electricity and an excess of heat to meet their needs, possibly even commercial needs, depending upon the volume of organic matter available for gasification, or digesting as the process is commonly known. The equipment can be as simple as a pair of old oil drums and a truck innertube or as complex as you desire. Google methane digester.

 

[VCBurner]

Quite simple really. As most anything decomposes it releases methane (the major component of natural gas). Since methane burns well in internal combustion engines, gas or diesel, one with a sufficient supply of organic matter can readily generate enough electricity and an excess of heat to meet their needs, possibly even commercial needs, depending upon the volume of organic matter available for gasification, or digesting as the process is commonly known. The equipment can be as simple as a pair of old oil drums and a truck innertube or as complex as you desire. Google methane digester.

Thanks Dune,
I'll have to google your lead. It sounds simple the way you put it. It didn't sound as simple when applied to large scales such as the farm on Dirty Jobs. Hence, the suggestion of government incentives for "real" use of such technology to help aleviate the energy cost of large farms. This would not only benefit the farmers and the environment but would allow more of the money to be focused on the true quality of their products. Maybe then, the farmer would be able to grass feed their steer instead of stuffing them with bacteria producing corn feed. Again, nothing against the farmers, this is not something they are proud of I hope. As I stated before, the amount of ecoli in beef would be lowered by 80% if steer were grass fed as opposed to corn fed.

On an unrelated note... Where abouts on the Cape are you? I grew up in Hyannis. The wife and I met there and had our first two kids on the Cape before moving to central Mass. I went to Dennis Yarmouth High School and lived in Sandwich for a few years also.
The Mrs and I both miss the smell of the ocean so we end up going to some sort of beach every other weekend between Memorial Day and Labor Day.

 

[Dune]

Born in Hyannis, raised in Chatham, lived in Harwich, Eastham, Wellfleet, Dennis, and finaly settled in Yarmouth.
Always loved Sandwich for it's physical beauty and still spend a lot of time there.

 

[Bobbin]

My aunt and uncle lived in Chatham for years. A recently deceased cousin of mine lived in that area, too. He was a fisherman. It's a lovely area, though I haven't visited it in many, many years. (I live in the land of really deep, really cold water!).

 

[Dune]

Hey Bobbin. I am a retired Chatham fisherman. I likely knew your cousin.

 

[VCBurner]

Hey Dune and Bobbin,
My wife says she misses coming out of the grocery store and breathing in the ocean smell! I never realized how lucky I was to be there until we moved away. On the flip side, since crossing the canal I've seen many other beaches I never knew existed. I do miss the Cape and feel like I'm back home when I return. Someday maybe we'll be able to afford a little Summer cottage somewhere! Take care.

 

[daveswoodhauler]

Little late to the game on this thread....but my wife and I watched this on PBS last night....there were some portions of the movie that I didbn't want to see, but know have a better understanding of the whole process.
I tripled the size of our garden this year, and I think in 2 years my entire backyard will be a garden if my wife gets here way

 

[Flatbedford]

My wife and I watched it last night. I think what bothers me most is that through the whole movie, most of the stories come down to exploitation of people. whether its undocumented workers bussed into the country, farmers forced into debt, poor people eating crap food, and the health consequences, etc. Everybody is so scared about Obama and his "socialism" when its really the large multi-national corporations and their influence on government that is the biggest threat.
We try to buy good, local food whenever possible, and we will try even harder now.

 

[4acrefarm]

Add these to your reading list.


In Defense Of Food, Omnivores Delema, By Micheal Poland

Everything I Want To Do Is Ilegal by joel Salatin

Anything these guyus have written is usefull, Salatin is a meat farmer with an amazing operation. He proves it casn be done if the government will stay out of the way.

Living in the country I have raised chickens and beef, It is a lot of work. I will buy from myneihbors from now on. Buy a whole cow and pay for the butchering and sell off portions to others and it is very afordable.

 

[semipro]

Everybody is so scared about Obama and his "socialism" when its really the large multi-national corporations and their influence on government that is the biggest threat.

You hit that nail on the head...with a sledgehammer!

 

[VCBurner]

My wife and I watched it last night. I think what bothers me most is that through the whole movie, most of the stories come down to exploitation of people. whether its undocumented workers bussed into the country, farmers forced into debt, poor people eating crap food, and the health consequences, etc. Everybody is so scared about Obama and his "socialism" when its really the large multi-national corporations and their influence on government that is the biggest threat.
We try to buy good, local food whenever possible, and we will try even harder now.

Glad to see this thread is still relevant. I think about the subject just about every day. Totally agree with the comment of exploitation of people and the Obama socialism comment. It is a shame what money can buy! It is also a shame that our country is going down this road where the big companies control everything with their power. Even what we eat. We need to change if we want our kids and grand kids to live healthy lives. Some studies show that this generation of children are the first generation expected to live shorter lives than their parents. All due to the choices we've made as a population. Our kids need to know how to eat and what to eat in order to live healthy lives. Has anyone watched Jamie Oliver's Food Revolution?

 

[VCBurner]

Watch the movie Food Inc. for free today from this link:
(broken link removed to http://couponpro.blogspot.com/2010/04/food-inc-stream-movie-online-for-free.html)
It is a special today only!

 

[kenny chaos]

Everything I Want To Do Is Ilegal by joel Salatin

Salatin is a meat farmer with an amazing operation. He proves it casn be done if the government will stay out of the way.
.

Watch out for that character. He's a half azz farmer at best but a darn good con man.
Makes his money selling books, lectures, and old ideas.
Read enough of his stuff and you'll see the double talk.
I broke bread once with the man and wouldn't again.

 

[Cluttermagnet]

There's something I didn't see touched on very much in this thread. There is a lot of talk about finding small, natural farms for meat and poultry. I eat these too, and I strongly support finding healthier sources for them. Americans are very meat- oriented, however. Overly so, many would say. Most families could cut way back on the percentage of meat in meals and yet still eat very well indeed. It takes some relearning, but it definitely can be done. I personally have learned to cook with more vegetables, over the years, and to use fresh only- and especially, not commercially canned! Frozen are 'OK', especially if you are growing your own. I do some pretty delicious spicing and saucing, and can make relatively few ounces of meat or poultry 'multiply' into fairly large and filling dishes. I've become the designated chef, most of the time. She can cook but she much prefers mine, which generally resembles Asian or Indian fare.

While I make sure we eat plenty of fresh fruit and vegetables, I still need to work a lot on improving my sources. Need to get to some farmer's markets. Too much of our stuff is coming from the supermarket. I live in woods under pretty much full shade, so gardening is not an option for me. Otherwise I'd be gardening for sure. This has been a good reminder thread. I've been researching farmer's markets and 'clean' meat sources lately. Found some good local ones.

 

[kenny chaos]

There's something I didn't see touched on very much in this thread. There is a lot of talk about finding small, natural farms for meat and poultry. I eat these too, and I strongly support finding healthier sources for them. Americans are very meat- oriented, however. Overly so, many would say. Most families could cut way back on the percentage of meat in meals and yet still eat very well indeed. It takes some relearning, but it definitely can be done. I personally have learned to cook with more vegetables, over the years, and to use fresh only- and especially, not commercially canned! Frozen are 'OK', especially if you are growing your own. I do some pretty delicious spicing and saucing, and can make relatively few ounces of meat or poultry 'multiply' into fairly large and filling dishes. I've become the designated chef, most of the time. She can cook but she much prefers mine, which generally resembles Asian or Indian fare.

While I make sure we eat plenty of fresh fruit and vegetables, I still need to work a lot on improving my sources. Need to get to some farmer's markets. Too much of our stuff is coming from the supermarket. I live in woods under pretty much full shade, so gardening is not an option for me. Otherwise I'd be gardening for sure. This has been a good reminder thread. I've been researching farmer's markets and 'clean' meat sources lately. Found some good local ones.

You'll never find someone at a farmers market who is selling something of someone else's, which may even have come from another country, but they are there. I always recommend buy right from a farm vs. farmers market. You can see what you're buying into then.
A real man grows at least some of his own food.
Living in the woods in no excuse. There are many shade loving veggies, some tolerant ones, and some only needing half a day of sun. I don't know any meat animals that mind the woods either.
Some of the world's healthiest and best medicinal foods grow in the woods.

 

[Cluttermagnet]

A real man grows at least some of his own food.
Living in the woods in no excuse.

Among the relatively few times I've ever had my manhood called into question, this is definitely the first time for the reason you state. I choose to be amused rather than offended. That is a bit harsh, though. (Or was that not a personal attack and just awkwardly worded?)

There are many shade loving veggies, some tolerant ones, and some only needing half a day of sun.

I'm sure that must be true, but please, could you cite a few examples of these? I sincerely believe that a lot in full shade is pretty much a non starter for any really practical/ productive vegetable gardening. At best, perhaps a few radishes and salad greens in early spring prior to full leafout.

I don't know any meat animals that mind the woods either.

Erm- I live in the suburbs, OK? I'd have the neighbors pissed and the county after me in a heartbeat if I tried raising livestock.

Some of the world's healthiest and best medicinal foods grow in the woods.

True, but see my comment about the suburbs, above. This is a pretty developed area. I have less than an acre. Most land is privately owned around here, i.e. not available for me or others to forage.

 

[kenny chaos]

A real man grows at least some of his own food.
Living in the woods in no excuse.

Among the relatively few times I've ever had my manhood called into question, this is definitely the first time for the reason you state. I choose to be amused rather than offended. That is a bit harsh, though. (Or was that not a personal attack and just awkwardly worded?)

There are many shade loving veggies, some tolerant ones, and some only needing half a day of sun.

I'm sure that must be true, but please, could you cite a few examples of these? I sincerely believe that a lot in full shade is pretty much a non starter for any really practical/ productive vegetable gardening. At best, perhaps a few radishes and salad greens in early spring prior to full leafout.

I don't know any meat animals that mind the woods either.

Erm- I live in the suburbs, OK? I'd have the neighbors pissed and the county after me in a heartbeat if I tried raising livestock.

Some of the world's healthiest and best medicinal foods grow in the woods.

True, but see my comment about the suburbs, above. This is a pretty developed area. I have less than an acre. Most land is privately owned around here, i.e. not available for me or others to forage.

I don't even know you. Why take it personal.
Leafy vegetables do good in full shade.
Beans, beets, broccoli, cabbage, kohlrabi, peas, potatoes, rhubarb and turnips work in partial shade.
Medicinals can be developed from nearly all parts of trees and shrubs including wood, bark, buds, leaves, roots, fruit, flowers, nuts, sap and pollen. Maybe a fun and healthy hobby to pursue.
Let's not forget the very health giving and money making ginseng, golden seal, mushroom, etc..
How about a small grove of paw paw trees in your woods?
It is easy enough to keep prying eyes away from a rabbit hutch, small aviary full of quail, pigeon, etc..
Send me a layout of your place and I'll lay you out a right nice little food factory and your neighbors won't even know.
Yes, even on one acre in the woods. How about a small tank for raising tilapia, shrimp, or crayfish?
You'll eat things most people can't afford to buy in a restaurant.
I have just under an acre in front of a barn I'm transforming as we speak. I'm doing a trial this year and if things work out, there will be 2000 strawberry plants, about 1000 asparagus roots, several hundred raspberry plants, and some assorted vegetables producing next year, on less than an acre. There was a bush maple growing in the center of the area and I just finished cutting about three cords of firewood.
We just grow shrooms in our woods.
I knew a gal in the burbs who befriended a pig and kept it in a little gambrel roof garden shed.
It died at about 2,000 pounds and her neighbors were shocked when the back-hoe came and dragged it out of that little shed.
I wanted it for sausage. She started to cry. But it really was funny.

 

[timfromohio]

Cluttermagnet, the solution to the problem of shade vs. sun and your property being wooded is very simple ... firewood!

 

[Cluttermagnet]

Cluttermagnet, the solution to the problem of shade vs. sun and your property being wooded is very simple ... firewood!

See this thread for my answer. Post #8. I'd never willingly cut down my beautiful trees.

I'm having no trouble getting access to free wood elsewhere. Also, pretty much all the wood I get is deadwood, which I prefer. It seasons much faster. If I don't have to cut live trees, I'd prefer not to.

 

[Cluttermagnet]

Leafy vegetables do good in full shade.

Yep, this is what I've heard.

Beans, beets, broccoli, cabbage, kohlrabi, peas, potatoes, rhubarb and turnips work in partial shade.

Full shade is mostly what I have. I'm researching this on the net. Found several sites with lists that do overlap with some of the varieties you mention. I do have a corner that gets a little sun, especially in early spring prior to full canopy leafout. I'll start there. My time is very limited. May not get very much in this year.

 

[SolarAndWood]

I'm doing a trial this year and if things work out, there will be 2000 strawberry plants, about 1000 asparagus roots, several hundred raspberry plants, and some assorted vegetables producing next year, on less than an acre.

Its amazing how much food can be produced in a relatively small area. One of the case studies on Cornell's gardening site is a couple in VT that grossed $63K on an acre. We put in 100 strawberries, 20 raspberries/blackberries, 13 blueberries and 300 sq ft of herb garden last year. 50 asparagus went in last night. While I don't have any interest in raising animals, our diet has improved every year since putting in the garden four years ago on our acre and a half four miles from downtown.

 

[timfromohio]

cluttermagnet - how about tapping some of those maple trees?

kenny - how about posting some pics or a plan of your layout?

 

[kenny chaos]

kenny - how about posting some pics or a plan of your layout?

I can do pics.