Hearthstone/Heritage Soap Stone Models - 1,000 Sq Foot, Zone 6 Climate

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nemohoes

New Member
Dec 29, 2022
8
CDA Idaho
I have a 1,000 square foot house house, with a basement (2,000 square foot total). The house was built in the mid 70s, insulation is alright.

Attached is a floor plan of the house. There was a L-shaped basalt/brick wall in the kitchen (gotta love the 1970s interior design) that I tore down to open up the area and floor space.
  • I want soapstone, and will be putting the stove into a stone alcove in a wall between the garage and the living room on the surface level.
  • This stove would ideally be my main source of heating.
  • Probably be burning a mix of yellow pine (Ponderosa) and tamarack/douglas-fir. Intermittent hardwoods if I can find some.


My main questions are:
  • what models would not cook me out of the house? The square footage of the house is in a weird quagmire between the smaller and medium sized stoves where I don't feel comfortable and worried I will get a stove that is too small for my needs and leaves me with more to be desired in terms of being able to heat my home effectively or that would heat my home too much and force me to open windows.
    • I work for a land-management agency and my work days leave me out of the house for 10+ hours and would like the stove to keep my house warm when I return to add more wood thru the night.

  • Is it easier to get by with getting a larger stove than what brochures recommend (models that are recommended past say, 1200 sq. feet) and just run the stove on low perpetually, or would the catalyst not be working effectively since I have the stove running on low for a majority of the time? A younger, local salesman who sells Hearthstone stoves, recommended the Castleton ("Heats up to 1,500 sq feet") and recommended to run the stove with the catalyst latch not engaged which seemed counter intuitive to the technology and aim of catalyst stoves.

I guess, aftertalking to sales associates in 2022, many just read off the brochures when i have questions and aren't exactly "experts." I don't entirely trust the brochures from companies and am looking for real world examples from you folks. Many of the sales people I talked to recently started. My confidence is low and I have come to this forum for wisdom of the crowds.
 

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I have the Castleton and live in Texas burning live oak and cedar. In your situation I would go with the Heritage for longer burn time and your type of wood. For high heat need the secondary burn tubes do most of the work. The catalytic hybrid system is nice for longer burn time. They are both great looking stoves and it sounds like you have a good dealer nearby.
 
I have the Castleton and live in Texas burning live oak and cedar. In your situation I would go with the Heritage for longer burn time and your type of wood. For high heat need the secondary burn tubes do most of the work. The catalytic hybrid system is nice for longer burn time. They are both great looking stoves and it sounds like you have a good dealer nearby.
How many square feet are you heating up with the Castleton? How many months are you using your stove for? Can't imagine for much more than a fourth of the year?
 
How many square feet are you heating up with the Castleton? How many months are you using your stove for? Can't imagine for much more than a fourth of the year?
3-4 months 2200 sqft Using dry, good quality wood makes a big difference. All is fine until the temps get below 30 degrees or so.
 
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Heritage will likely be more than you need but when in doubt, go bigger. Castleton may be more the right size as Spokane does not get that cold.
 
Heritage will likely be more than you need but when in doubt, go bigger. Castleton may be more the right size as Spokane does not get that cold.
You may be thinking of Seattle. Spokane does not have the marine influence and gets cold. At times it can be very cold. Like -10º right before Christmas this year. I would definitely go larger, especially if the primary fuel will be lodgepole pine.
 
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I realize I made a typo. I am not dead set on Hearthstone, as I like the Woodstock soap stone stoves as well.

Yeah, we can get cold snaps that go into the negatives, but generally winters hover between mid 20's down to low teens, single digits at night.

Would a 3 ft firebox, be TOO big, or could I just load the stove up and run it on low for longer times? What do you think the minimum would be?

Soapstone Cats can't cook anyone out of a room like a non-cat, cast-iron/steel would?
 
I realize I made a typo. I am not dead set on Hearthstone, as I like the Woodstock soap stone stoves as well.

Yeah, we can get cold snaps that go into the negatives, but generally winters hover between mid 20's down to low teens, single digits at night.

Would a 3 ft firebox, be TOO big, or could I just load the stove up and run it on low for longer times? What do you think the minimum would be?

Soapstone Cats can't cook anyone out of a room like a non-cat, cast-iron/steel would?
Are you dead set on soapstone? There are many other options available if you go to steel or iron
 
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Are you dead set on soapstone? There are many other options available if you go to steel or iron
Somewhat dead set. I can be swayed away; however, the consistent, radiant heat output is what drew me towards soapstone. I like the look of them more than blazeking, non-soapstone.
 
Somewhat dead set. I can be swayed away; however, the consistent, radiant heat output is what drew me towards soapstone. I like the look of them more than blazeking, non-soapstone.
Honestly the claimed advantages of soapstone are greatly exaggerated. Nothing wrong with many of the soapstone options available at all if you like the look and function great. But not get it just because of the claimed benifits of soapstone. If I had to choose a soapstone stoves it would be the progress hybrid.
 
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I realize I made a typo. I am not dead set on Hearthstone, as I like the Woodstock soap stone stoves as well.

Yeah, we can get cold snaps that go into the negatives, but generally winters hover between mid 20's down to low teens, single digits at night.

Would a 3 ft firebox, be TOO big, or could I just load the stove up and run it on low for longer times? What do you think the minimum would be?

Soapstone Cats can't cook anyone out of a room like a non-cat, cast-iron/steel would?
I would consider the Woodstocks. They make good cat stoves and their soapstone is less prone to cracking. I would also consider cast-iron jacketed stoves. They provide soapstone-like heat too and offer more choices. In cat, the BK Ashford is worth a look. In non-cats, the Jotul F45 and PE Alderlea T6 are worth consideration.
 
Honestly the claimed advantages of soapstone are greatly exaggerated. Nothing wrong with many of the soapstone options available at all if you like the look and function great. But not get it just because of the claimed benifits of soapstone. If I had to choose a soapstone stoves it would be the progress hybrid.
Interesting, so the soapstone benefits are really not that beneficial? I like the softness of the heat it could provide. So that benefit is overstated?
 
Interesting, so the soapstone benefits are really not that beneficial? I like the softness of the heat it could provide. So that benefit is overstated?
Cast iron jacketed stoves provide a very soft heat and release warmth for a long time after the fire has died down.
 
I would consider the Woodstocks. They make good cat stoves and their soapstone is less prone to cracking. I would also consider cast-iron jacketed stoves. They provide soapstone-like heat too and offer more choices. In cat, the BK Ashford is worth a look. In non-cats, the Jotul F45 and PE Alderlea T6 are worth consideration.
I think I’m kind of dead set on cat stoves. Cast-iron over steel?

For 1000 square foot, can you get too large of stove? I grew up with a quadra fire that was way too large for the room of parents home. Is it possible to get the same result with a cat stove/hybrid stove? I’d like to get the right size stove for my house, but not sure if getting to large would just mean the burn time would be longer for my use case and not be too hot if I went cat stove.
 
I think I’m kind of dead set on cat stoves. Cast-iron over steel?

For 1000 square foot, can you get too large of stove? I grew up with a quadra fire that was way too large for the room of parents home. Is it possible to get the same result with a cat stove/hybrid stove? I’d like to get the right size stove for my house, but not sure if getting to large would just mean the burn time would be longer for my use case and not be too hot if I went cat stove.
I think that you and I have similar wants for a stove and somewhat similar conditions/heating needs. The most important being correct output for the space 24/7. Mine are:
1. ability to lower output very low
2. enough output to be the sole heat source
3. long burn times (enough to sleep!)
4. reliability/quality
5. ease of maintenance/use
6. 2023- 30% tax credit eligible
7. affordable
8. match decor/aesthetics

My post is 'Help size my future BK' in the BK forum, since the BK's seem to have the most models of widest range of output, especially the low end. I was initially attracted to some non-cat stoves (Pleasant Hearth, Quad) that met the tax credit, but realized (with the help of the forum contributors here-thanks!) that they would not meet my long, low output needs.
 
Interesting, so the soapstone benefits are really not that beneficial? I like the softness of the heat it could provide. So that benefit is overstated?
Bingo! I owned a hearthstone heritage for several years after falling for the marketing ploy and heck it looked good. Soapstone is actually a pretty poor stove material. I moved to a plate steel cat stove with long burn times to provide the steady low heat with the catalyst.
 
The characteristics of a wood burning appliances come from a combination of design, technology, and materials working together to produce a particular result. A material, in and of itself, doesn't make a better or worse stove. If you took a steel stove design, and replaced the steel with soapstone, the stove would almost certainly be worse for it as the rest of the stove was designed around the characteristics of the steel.

I'm not sure what the specifics are surrounding "HighBeams" experience with a soapstone stove is, but it sounds to me like he went from a manual operated non-cat burning experience to a catalytic burning experience with automatic feedback air control and is conflating the difference in experience between these stoves to be almost entirely due to the material they were made from, rather than the significant differences in burning technology employed. I would not read too much into that. The marketing wank from hearthstone can be misleading like the marketing wank from any product. Blaze King could certainly deploy their catalytic burning strategy to a soapstone stove and produce very good results as well.

Soapstone is less thermally conductive, but in many applications, the soapstone, is both the firebrick and the stove jacket at the same time, so the thermal conduction to the surface of the stove is more spread out and starts lower in the box. This has ups and downs. Lower peak surface temps combined with less radiation properties means that the heat from the soapstone stove is indeed "softer" feeling. It's not the kind of heat you feel radiating across the room or through walls, and the top of a hearthstone soapstone stove generally runs a bit too cool for cooking/simmering, but the stove is still going to put about the same thermal energy into the house but in a different way.

Many materials can be leveraged to produce a thermally efficient stove, but some materials are better suited to achieving higher peak thermal output for a given size stove. I would venture to say that in general, an "oversized" hearthstone soapstone stove, is apt to be more forgiving with regard to the "chase you out of the room" effect than a traditional steel stove. A steel stove with enough thermal mass could achieve a similar result, but in practice, most steel stoves weigh about half of what a similar size soapstone stove weighs, so they will heat up fast and hit a higher peak-thermal output, and then cool down more rapidly. With that said, a very well designed catalytic steel stove can just burn the wood slower and spread out the heat from a burn cycle in a manner that is functionally similar to the behavior of a soapstone stove but achieved through different means. These modern Hearthstone Hybrid stoves can lean into the advantages of catalytic stoves for extended burn cycles a bit, while also spreading out the thermal shock of a burn cycle over time with big thermal mass. The cat on these hybrid hearthstone stoves is less "potent" than the cats found on catalyst optimized stoves like those from Blaze King, so these stoves aren't intended to be used as wood-gasifiers the way a BK can.

There's a long list of EPA tested stoves achieving high efficiency made from all sorts of material combinations. Proving that material choice in and of itself is not a make-it-or-break-it issue. A fair number of stoves in the top 20 most efficient stoves tested are made from soapstone+cast-iron. Many are also made from steel...

Note that nearly ALL steel stoves have a fire-brick lined burning box. The firebrick is there to INSULATE the fire from the excessive thermal conductivity of bare steel. Trying to burn a fire in a bare-steel box is actually difficult because the steel will try to pull too much heat off the coals, requiring much higher burn rates to keep the fire from collapsing. If steel were the perfect stove material, we wouldn't be using in conjunction with firebrick to "fix" it. The complete working system is what matters.

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If you like the look of soapstone, and understand what behaviors to expect from a soapstone stove I see no reason it couldn't serve you well, especially a modern design with a catalyst. I'm perfectly happy with ours.

Is the basement of your home heated? Finished? Does the house have a traditional forced air HVAC unit with a central blower that can be used to help move heat around the home, and potentially, the basement as well? A warm basement has some advantages... keeps moisture levels under control, keeps pipes from freezing, and makes your floors warmer (more comfortable for feet!).

If we're talking about heating 1000sq foot, single level, with modern/new windows and 2x6 or thicker exterior walls with good sheeting/wrap/insulation in zone 6, then the Castleton or similar or smaller sized cat/hybrid stove should work very well, to the point of being a bit overkill on many days.
Alternates:
Hearthstone Green Mountain 60 / Hipster 20
Lopi Rockport Hybrid-Fyre
BK Ashford AF20.2/ Chinook CK20.2 / Sirocco SC20.2
Kuma Aspen LE / Tamarack LE/ Aberdeen LE
Vermont Castings Dauntless Flexburn Catalytic Model

If we're talking about heating 1000sq foot, + partially heating a basement, older windows, drafty doors, 2x4 construction, with mediocre insulation/wrap in zone 6, then I would go for the Mansfield or something in that 2.5-3 cubic foot range. I burn ponderosa in my Mansfield. If I put a few large diameter splits/rounds in there, let it get up to temp, then choke it way down to the lowest recommended burn rates, it will extend that burn cycle out to at least 10-12 hours or so, with a still-warm stove and coals ready to be stirred up for another fuel load.

You may be able to estimate your heating demands based on current furnace utilization. If you have or can install a logging thermostat, then you can generate some data that tells you your BTU per day utilization, then figure out a BTU/hr requirement to replicate the functionality with wood. Keep in mind that a wood burner set up to run low and slow over many hours may only put off about 10K BTU/hr on average.

For an alcove install I would skip the Heritage as it comes with a side-load-door that won't be very usable in the alcove, and more importantly, is just more moving parts and seals to fail.

Regardless of the model selected I recommend against the ash-pan option for any stove if there is an option to opt out. It's yet another source of potential air-leaks, and another point of maintenance/failures for the stove. I prefer a dedicated ash-vac for dealing with ash. It sucks it all into a metal can through a metal hose, and filters the ash through first a very fine can filter then an even finer pleated hepa filter. I wait for a warm spell in the weather and try to skip a couple nights of burning before vacuuming.
 
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Another benefit from soapstone that I enjoy is being able to sit in the room with a stove that is not radiating so much that it dries out my eyes.
 
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Interesting, so the soapstone benefits are really not that beneficial? I like the softness of the heat it could provide. So that benefit is overstated?
Soft warm heat means the heat you want in the room is going up the chimney, so your stove does not feel hot. Soapstone is an insulator, not a conductor. It will be the prettiest stove around and will burn a lot of wood, putting a lot of heat up the chimney and little into the room.

My hearthstone is older, but similar. If it is above 30 degrees outside and I push wood hard and fast into the stove, I can get my stove room to the upper sixties. If the house has cooled down, it will take me from when I get home from work till bedtime to raise the room temp 5 degrees. I have an older house that is about halfway insulated. My old Blaze King Princess slammer insert would easily raise the room temp and burned a lot less wood.
 
Soft warm heat means the heat you want in the room is going up the chimney, so your stove does not feel hot. Soapstone is an insulator, not a conductor. It will be the prettiest stove around and will burn a lot of wood, putting a lot of heat up the chimney and little into the room.

My hearthstone is older, but similar. If it is above 30 degrees outside and I push wood hard and fast into the stove, I can get my stove room to the upper sixties. If the house has cooled down, it will take me from when I get home from work till bedtime to raise the room temp 5 degrees. I have an older house that is about halfway insulated. My old Blaze King Princess slammer insert would easily raise the room temp and burned a lot less wood.
Sounds like there are more issues than the stove as my experience with Hearthstone soapstone stoves is that you can drive people out of the room. In our last place, the main part of the house where the stove was (located centrally) was always in the mid-70’s when it was anywhere from 22-10f outside. That part of the house I don’t believe ever go into the 60’s except maybe early morning once the fire had died down. When it was between 25-35f outside I had to be careful not to over-stock the stove as otherwise it got too hot in the house.

The stove was purchased new in 2014 so perhaps yours is a lot older but it sounds like your house may be more the issue (lack of insulation).
 
I'm not sure what the specifics are surrounding "HighBeams" experience with a soapstone stove is, but it sounds to me like he went from a manual operated non-cat burning experience to a catalytic burning experience with automatic feedback air control and is conflating the difference in experience between these stoves to be almost entirely due to the material they were made from, rather than the significant differences in burning technology employed. I would not read too much into that. The marketing wank from hearthstone can be misleading like the marketing wank from any product. Blaze King could certainly deploy their catalytic burning strategy to a soapstone stove and produce very good results as well.
Read back to when and why he switched. The prime motivators were high flue temps resulting in too much heat going up the flue (this probably is better with the addition of the cat), wood consumption, and a failure of parts like the hinges and latch after burning 30 cords of wood. The hinge fix was to replace the frame and rebuild the stove. That I think was the final straw.

The other fairly common complaint with these stoves is stones cracking. Woodstock stoves fair better in this regard because they have a double layer of soapstone rather than the single layer of stone.
 
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Soft warm heat means the heat you want in the room is going up the chimney, so your stove does not feel hot. Soapstone is an insulator, not a conductor. It will be the prettiest stove around and will burn a lot of wood, putting a lot of heat up the chimney and little into the room.

My hearthstone is older, but similar. If it is above 30 degrees outside and I push wood hard and fast into the stove, I can get my stove room to the upper sixties. If the house has cooled down, it will take me from when I get home from work till bedtime to raise the room temp 5 degrees. I have an older house that is about halfway insulated. My old Blaze King Princess slammer insert would easily raise the room temp and burned a lot less wood.
Did you take the firebrick out of your old BK? You can't call out soapstone as an "insulator that sends heat up the chimney" whilst simultaneously calling out the superiority of another stove that combines materials with both more and less thermal conductivity than soapstone to achieve a functional thermal impedance for the finished system.

My experience comparing a firebrick lined steel wood stove to the soapstone/.cast-iron wood stove, both having about the same size firebox, and both being EPA 2020 certified, both relatively efficient and clean burning, is that the steel stove got hot faster and ran higher surface temps and had more radiated and conducted heat output over a shorter period of time. This particular steel stove was non-cat so could not be operated at very low output levels. The lowest setting was still a pretty hot/fast burn. Cats open up a much wider range of clean burning potential for a given stove size, regardless of material selection.

A lightweight steel stove will raise the temperature of a cold room faster, so is well suited to folks who build fires in room that are already cold. If you work the late-shift, a steel stove would be a nice thing to come home to as it will warm you up fast. A soapstone stove is better suited to maintain the temperature of a room without overheating the room, but the fire needs to be lit before the room gets cold, because the stove takes about an hour to come up to temp, has a much lower peak in heat output, and then cools off more slowly. I would let the house cool down a few degrees in the evening before firing up the steel stove later in the evening. With the soapstone stove I fire up the stove sooner (around or just after sundown on most evenings). Both heat the home and burn through similar wood to do so, but the steel stove generated noticeably wider temperature swings.

Stoves made of any appropriate combination of materials can achieve similar efficiency if they are technologically similar in the combustion management department, but they can't be used the same way and expected to produce the same heating behaviors. Blaze King stoves have the advantage of being able to operate like a high-output steel stove when high heat demand is called for, while also being choked down to a wood gasifier output level where almost all combustion takes place in the cat. This makes the Blaze King designs incredibly versatile. There's a reason they are considered by many to be the golden standard for an ideal wood stove. A modern hybrid soapstone stove from Hearthstone can actually achieve similar combustion efficiency as a BK but its usable operating range is narrower. It can't go quite as low and slow as a BK, and it can't go as high either, but when compared across the usable range it's a perfectly good heating appliance.

Sharing our experiences is great, but lets make sure we understand the context. An old soapstone design with likely a relatively poor combustion efficiency, compared to a EPA 2020 certified stove (or an older one that would meet the requirements, of which, many old BK stoves do) may be academically interesting but is not representative of some ones current stove buying decision, which is in a world of options where all material types can be mated to a good combustion process.
 
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Did you take the firebrick out of your old BK? You can't call out soapstone as an "insulator that sends heat up the chimney" whilst simultaneously calling out the superiority of another stove that combines materials with both more and less thermal conductivity than soapstone to achieve a functional thermal impedance for the finished system.

My experience comparing a firebrick lined steel wood stove to the soapstone/.cast-iron wood stove, both having about the same size firebox, and both being EPA 2020 certified, both relatively efficient and clean burning, is that the steel stove got hot faster and ran higher surface temps and had more radiated and conducted heat output over a shorter period of time. This particular steel stove was non-cat so could not be operated at very low output levels. The lowest setting was still a pretty hot/fast burn. Cats open up a much wider range of clean burning potential for a given stove size, regardless of material selection.

A lightweight steel stove will raise the temperature of a cold room faster, so is well suited to folks who build fires in room that are already cold. If you work the late-shift, a steel stove would be a nice thing to come home to as it will warm you up fast. A soapstone stove is better suited to maintain the temperature of a room without overheating the room, but the fire needs to be lit before the room gets cold, because the stove takes about an hour to come up to temp, has a much lower peak in heat output, and then cools off more slowly. I would let the house cool down a few degrees in the evening before firing up the steel stove later in the evening. With the soapstone stove I fire up the stove sooner (around or just after sundown on most evenings). Both heat the home and burn through similar wood to do so, but the steel stove generated noticeably wider temperature swings.

Stoves made of any appropriate combination of materials can achieve similar efficiency if they are technologically similar in the combustion management department, but they can't be used the same way and expected to produce the same heating behaviors. Blaze King stoves have the advantage of being able to operate like a high-output steel stove when high heat demand is called for, while also being choked down to a wood gasifier output level where almost all combustion takes place in the cat. This makes the Blaze King designs incredibly versatile. There's a reason they are considered by many to be the golden standard for an ideal wood stove. A modern hybrid soapstone stove from Hearthstone can actually achieve similar combustion efficiency as a BK but its usable operating range is narrower. It can't go quite as low and slow as a BK, and it can't go as high either, but when compared across the usable range it's a perfectly good heating appliance.

Sharing our experiences is great, but lets make sure we understand the context. An old soapstone design with likely a relatively poor combustion efficiency, compared to a EPA 2020 certified stove (or an older one that would meet the requirements, of which, many old BK stoves do) may be academically interesting but is not representative of some ones current stove buying decision, which is in a world of options where all material types can be mated to a good combustion process.
Meh, you sound like you're trying to push soapstone because you own one so I would not read to much into what you say. That's not a nice thing to say is it? I owned a stone stove as well. It took forever to heat up, wasted wood while doing so, and was not durable but it heated my home fine once up to temperature. Only a couple of brands still use soapstone and even those brands have begun offering steel/iron stoves.

Stone is a relatively poor performance stove material and I would stay away from it unless you just love the looks. At best, it is not a hindrance when kept warm but you can choose a superior stove material along with superior burning technology to keep your stove warm as well. There is no "burn your eyeballs" heat from a steel stove unless you choose to run it at those high temperatures.

Soapstone looks really neat and has a caveman type masonry appeal. Nostalgic, yes. High performance, no. Woodstock makes a high performance combustion package and if you insist on soapstone, I would recommend their stoves if they are big enough for your needs.

Yes, there is some firebrick in almost all stoves that acts as a weak insulator. But those firebricks are only on the bottom and sides. The top is where temperatures are high and where the stone really hurts performance.

Rather than be crippled by soapstone, I chose my next house stove for the largest range of outputs I could find with welded steel for fast warmups. The long burn time ability from a good cat stove at low output is a game changer for me. If the stove can burn at a temperature that is "soft heat" without soapstone then the utility of soapstone is zero or actually a liability.

The stone does look great though.
 
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