harman p68

[grh372]

The P68 does throw out some serious heat. It is better than a damn good stove IMO. I am easily heating 2 levels and 2,350 SQ FT but I have a fairly open plan. That said, I also have tons of big windows and glass doors throughout both levels and high vaulted ceilings. I am only heating with the P68 now and have been. I have experienced numerous cold snaps in the single digits and now it's less than that. The P68 is holding the house at 73* where I have it set pretty easily. It's using a little more pellets to do so but that is not a concern to me. Warmth is. It also averages out the bag a day or less in the shoulder season or beginning of the heating needs. The P68 will out perform your current stove by far. Fact! Question is how is that stove doing? What temps can it maintain in your 3,000 SQ FT?

OK, You are probably sold now on a P68 but hold on one minute.

Here is where reality comes into play. I will also emphasize that each set up and home varies greatly. I also think you need to do your homework because 3,000 SQ FT is a large space to heat. To be perfectly honest I bought my P68 mainly for the shoulder seasons and ease of use for the wife thinking it would not be able to heat the 2,350 SQ FT two level core that I am in the cold, cold. It does heat it and does it well. No complaints here at all other than I hate cold weather. I am pretty sure the P68 could handle another 650 SQ FT depending on where it was located in regards to the stove. I will elaborate on this in a few.

How is your current stove heating all and all even though it is not cutting it? We need some variables to work with here in order to offer recommendations and suggestions. I am all about having another P68 owner around here, but I also refuse to fluff it up and sell you on a bag of tricks and happy unicorns. Please keep in mind that all pellet stoves are "space heaters" and really are not designed to heat entire homes per se. Many here are heating large homes with them alone also and have basically turn that "space heater" into their primary and only heat source.

All we know is that it's 3,000 SQ FT on one level. We need to know some temps such as the temp where your stove is located and the far reaches where obviously your current stove is not getting the job done to your satisfaction. Take a few minutes to research and cover your bases to be sure it will work before you plunk down another chunk of cash. What some here are suggesting and I agree is they simply do not want you to get your hopes up, plunk down some more cash and be disappointed. Give us some facts and variables to work with. For example, if your current stove is keeping your place at X degrees and you would like to raise that to Y degrees.

Lastly, I will point out that the temps I am experiencing inside are between 6-8 degrees cooler in the far reaches of what I am heating with the single P68. That is perfectly acceptable here. I would also like you to consider that I have also bought another stove too. A used PC45. Once I install the 2nd stove I'm going to heat another area of my home which is currently closed off by doors and not used much now. I am also going to supplement the far reaches of the P68 in doing so and I will likely keep very consistent temps throughout then. I am pretty certain I will. What are your expectations? Realize that you will also experience lower temps the farther you get from any stove. Question is will the P68 (68K BTUs) and its distribution blower be able to get those temps up where you would like? Good possibility, but we would like to see you happy with your investment.

Another point I'd like to make is that IF I had tried to do what I am surprisingly doing with my P68 with the PC45 I know it would be struggling and likely not giving me the great results I have but then again it is 45-50K BTUs and a 135 CFM blower. It would heat what I am doing but in the cold, cold I think it would have troubles.

ok ill do my best with drawing a picture of the first floor and main level of the house. the pellet stove is in the corner of the living room blowing into the center of the house. There is a second floor to the house thats not being used as we speak so its blocked off while remodeling. The current stove uses 2.5 bags a day and is always on high heat and blower is on high. with a really good pellet like cubex it'll keep the main living room at 68 degrees and the kitchen at 64 degrees. bedroom to the left is 60 degrees. bedroom accross is the same as living room and the office is same as kitchen. kitchen wall to the living room has a large cutout about 5 feet wide. im mainly looking to keep a temp of 68 degrees in most of the house. if the living room goes to 75 and the bedrooms are 68 ill be estatic and jumping for joy. the englander always struggles to keep 68 degrees in the living room. if using a medium grade pellet im lucky to pull 64 degrees in the living room.

 

[LuvMyPellets]

Ok I am not the sharpest tool in the box but 40x60 is 2400 ft on the first floor and if it is the P68 will work fine especially the way you have it located. Might be cold in that one big bedroom but the rest should be spiffy!

 

[woodmakesheat]

So that's a solid 2500 sq feet you're attempting to heat with a stove "rated" to 2200 sq ft (most take those ratings with a grain of salt.)

But your layout doesn't look all that bad, you may indeed benefit from a larger stove. Not sure about heating the 2nd floor once it's complete though.

 

[bags]

So what you are really wanting to heat is 60' x 40' space which is 2,400 SQ FT. If that is the case the P68 should do it pretty well if you are keeping 64-68* with smaller BTU stove. Looks like you can move air fairly easily and have the stove somewhat central in the overall plan. Bigger stove = more heat. How many BTU's is your current stove? The P68 = 68K BTU's. That is quite a few for a pellet stove. The Harman P Series stoves also radiate a bunch of heat much like a free standing wood stove. Many pellet stoves do not radiate heat but produce heat from a distribution blower. The P Series have distribution blowers AND throw a lot of radiant heat which is a big help. What are you thinking about with the closed off 2nd floor once it's remodeled? You really need to do some searches here also on how people are doing 2,400 or so SQ FT.

What I see and your stated temps with the smaller stove makes me think heating what you are showing is a very good possibility. How's your insulation and what age is your home? Better insulation and a tight home envelope equates to better heating results no matter what size space. Many of these stove ratings are generally based figures at best IMO concerning SQ FT coverage.

That said, in my situation any stove rated for 2,400 SQ FT would not really get the job done when it is colder. IF it never dropped lower than 28-30* outside here I MIGHT have a shot at keeping things heated with a smaller stove. Might is the key word. Still wouldn't do a great job in my home with temps in the upper 30's. You have to figure in more BTU's for heat loss and everything else working against you.

The P68 is rated up to 3,900 SQ FT or close. Not sure of the exact number but it is up there. In my experience for it to adequately heat that many SQ FT is s figment of the imagination. It does a great job here in my two story 2,350 SQ FT core. My home altogether is 4,000 plus SQ FT. That's why I am in the process of adding another stove to do another area and then it will supplement the far reaches of the P68. When you finish your upper level I would seriously consider another stove for best results but if you close it off and it's not really used then that is another factor.

 

[Lake Girl]

Where is the stairway to the second floor? That will have a determining factor on air flow to the second floor.

Even though the second level is closed off, you will have heat mitigation - may be losing a fair bit of heat to that second level even though it is "closed off"

 

[grh372]

So what you are really wanting to heat is 60' x 40' space which is 2,400 SQ FT. If that is the case the P68 should do it pretty well if you are keeping 64-68* with smaller BTU stove. Looks like you can move air fairly easily and have the stove somewhat central in the overall plan. Bigger stove = more heat. How many BTU's is your current stove? The P68 = 68K BTU's. That is quite a few for a pellet stove. The Harman P Series stoves also radiate a bunch of heat much like a free standing wood stove. Many pellet stoves do not radiate heat but produce heat from a distribution blower. The P Series have distribution blowers AND throw a lot of radiant heat which is a big help. What are you thinking about with the closed off 2nd floor once it's remodeled? You really need to do some searches here also on how people are doing 2,400 or so SQ FT.

What I see and your stated temps with the smaller stove makes me think heating what you are showing is a very good possibility. How's your insulation and what age is your home? Better insulation and a tight home envelope equates to better heating results no matter what size space. Many of these stove ratings are generally based figures at best IMO concerning SQ FT coverage.

That said, in my situation any stove rated for 2,400 SQ FT would not really get the job done when it is colder. IF it never dropped lower than 28-30* outside here I MIGHT have a shot at keeping things heated with a smaller stove. Might is the key word. Still wouldn't do a great job in my home with temps in the upper 30's. You have to figure in more BTU's for heat loss and everything else working against you.

The P68 is rated up to 3,900 SQ FT or close. Not sure of the exact number but it is up there. In my experience for it to adequately heat that many SQ FT is s figment of the imagination. It does a great job here in my two story 2,350 SQ FT core. My home altogether is 4,000 plus SQ FT. That's why I am in the process of adding another stove to do another area and then it will supplement the far reaches of the P68. When you finish your upper level I would seriously consider another stove for best results but if you close it off and it's not really used then that is another factor.

the upstairs will take a few years to finish. the insulation is average with the exception of the crawlspace under the house. theres no insulation under the majority of the house. In the next week or two the insulation will go in the crawlspace and warm the floors up a bit.

House is about 50 years old for the main section. Theres an addition on the left and right sides. Both of those additions were added in 1999.

 

[grh372]

Where is the stairway to the second floor? That will have a determining factor on air flow to the second floor.

Even though the second level is closed off, you will have heat mitigation - may be losing a fair bit of heat to that second level even though it is "closed off"

its right between the two bedrooms in the top left of the picture. i installed a ceiling fan to blow the air back down and also blocked the area off with a tarp for now.

 

[bags]

I think everyone will agree here that you really need to get everything insulated. With that and a good seal for the second floor might be a game changer with the stove you have although I think it's still small for your space but it might give you that 4* bump you'd like to have. Lake Girl has an excellent point on you still losing warm air going upstairs and a tarp will only do so much for keeping air where you want it. It also has zero R-Value. Could you install a cheap interior door and frame at the top of the stairs? At the bottom would be better.

Just a semi-permanent / temporary deal you could seal much better and remove when you are finished to keep you from losing all that air. The pre-hung Luan or 6-panel doors are cheap and easy to set. Or get a door which you could re-use upstairs once it's finished for a closet or room.

A major point is that throwing more BTU's at an uninsulated and warm air leaking house is not really the right answer. I would get that crawl space insulate and run plastic first and really tighten that tarp up. Maybe hang a blanket over it for starters. If you insulate and seal that big BTU sucking hole up covered with a tarp I think that alone would help tremendously. Maybe hang another blanket and tarp at the base of the stairs? Looking hill-billy and staying warm are two different animals.

With what you have stated and if corrections are made you can definitely heat that space with the 68. You are almost getting there with a smaller stove and some issues as is. From my experience 75* in your living room is no problem.

 

[Lake Girl]

Get busy insulating that crawl space! Spray foam for those critical areas. I reinsulated some areas of our crawl space and it makes a huge difference. Didn't get our foundation work done this year so not much chance of improvement until that happens. We learned the hard way (read redo the right way). Our house sits on a "crown" of Canadian Shield and created a re-think of the current foundation.

As to "hillbilly" - for now to help prevent more heat loss, we bank the snow around the foundation. You'd be surprised how much that cold natural insulation helps

Bags is right on the tarp at the top of the stairs ... You will have some heat loss from the ceilings of the first floor too.

You might open that tarp, turn that fan off at the top of the stairs and use incense (smoke pen, etc) to determine the natural air flow in the house. I would suggest waiting until it gets a bit warmer first That may give you a better idea of whether one stove will work when you finally open up the second floor.

Good luck with the rehab!

 

[grh372]

thanks for all the replys, ill let you know how the insulation goes. you guys and gal were quick and provided all the answers a guy would need.