floor registers, illegal or not?

[leff13]

guess i will have to see what works best, who knows maybe enough heat will rise to keep the rooms a comfortable 60-65, after all im only in my bedroom to sleep, or apparently to make babies but you catch my drift, lol..im hoping no drastic measures are needed, only time will tell. thanks for all the input

 

[leff13]

http://www.amazon.com/Suncourt-TW10...cp_2_YRV6?ie=UTF8&refRID=042NZQ3M6PP7G87A6ZGC

has anyone ever heard or used this, one of the reviews said they used it like i plan on using it by cutting a hole in the wall that will lead up my staircase that's in the same room as my stove will be, little pricey but beats what i had in mind

 

[St_Earl]

a focused fan like a vornado or honeywell helps keep the cool air down low from interfering with the returning warm air up high.
you just have to factor in all your variables for your own unique solution.
eventually you'll get it dialed in.

 

[St_Earl]

http://www.amazon.com/Suncourt-TW10...cp_2_YRV6?ie=UTF8&refRID=042NZQ3M6PP7G87A6ZGC

has anyone ever heard or used this, one of the reviews said they used it like i plan on using it by cutting a hole in the wall that will lead up my staircase that's in the same room as my stove will be, little pricey but beats what i had in mind

i like the flexibility of using my vornados.
even though they now stay in the same places all winter.
i didn't have to cut any holes. and in summer i use them elsewhere.

i'd hate to cut a hole and then be unhappy with either the noise or performance of the fan. or just unhappy with it in that fixed position.

 

[DBCOOPER]

I've tried all kinds of fan types and placements and nothing works nearly a good as natural convection. The trick is to run the stove on the lowest setting that matches the heat loss of the house. Time is your friend when doing this and the longer the stove runs the better it works. I'm sort of limited on changing feed rates and fan speeds on my Quadrafire CB1200i But I have learned how to anticipate based on outside conditions.

And no, no one has ever been able to provide a reference that says it is a code violation to cut holes for heat registers between floors.

 

[St_Earl]

I've tried all kinds of fan types and placements and nothing works nearly a good as natural convection. The trick is to run the stove on the lowest setting that matches the heat loss of the house. Time is your friend when doing this and the longer the stove runs the better it works. I'm sort of limited on changing feed rates and fan speeds on my Quadrafire CB1200i But I have learned how to anticipate based on outside conditions.

And no, no one has ever been able to provide a reference that says it is a code violation to cut holes for heat registers between floors.

i'd love it if my house worked that way.
but the fact is, that if i do nothing, the back bedroom will absolutely be far too cold.
everyone's layout is different.

i just help the "natural" convection along a bit.

 

[hoverfly]

900 sqft house? I would start with some celling fans if possible.

 

[leff13]

900 sqft house? I would start with some celling fans if possible.

i have one where the stove will be and in the kitchen where the blower will blow the hot air

 

[chken]

http://www.amazon.com/Suncourt-TW10...cp_2_YRV6?ie=UTF8&refRID=042NZQ3M6PP7G87A6ZGC

has anyone ever heard or used this, one of the reviews said they used it like i plan on using it by cutting a hole in the wall that will lead up my staircase that's in the same room as my stove will be, little pricey but beats what i had in mind

Just be aware that the faster these little fans are, the more wattage and the louder they are. Also, I would do a little experiment. Turn off the upstairs heat, and see how much colder it gets compared to downstairs. Many houses, if there are no drafts, the differential is only 10 degrees or so. If that's the case, then a 70 downstairs might result in a 60 upstairs. How much warmer do you need your bedrooms? Most people prefer them to be cooler to help sleeping. Using a little oil to raise that 60 to a comfortable level like 65 at night might not be too bad. Also, for that bathroom, you might be better off with an electric spot heater that you turn on when you are actually in it. A little electricity and a little oil might not be such a bad tradeoff over having to cut holes in walls and floors. Just something to consider. As a few have noted, install your stove and see how well it heats your space before doing anything drastic.

 

[DOLLARBILL]

In my Parents Home years ago we had floor registers no problem funny thing today everything is a fire hazard, not safe to eat ,guns should be banned, the list goes on and on, if my upstairs was not comfortable without them I would not give a second thought to installing a few but thats just me

 

[daffonce]

like a lot of people have said try it out first. I have 2500 sq ft, i have an xxv. downstairs 72 upstairs at the end of the hall is 69. I ave a small corner fan that blows heat from the stove room (in my eat in kitchen area) into my foyer. natural convection does the rest. let he stove run for a day or two before any canges are made. a day or two will allow things to equilibrate and everything to absorb the heat. i totally buy into the heat soak idea. in 2 days everythin warms up nicely. i leave my stove on 24/7 and my house if very comfortable and even.

 

[RKS130]

I plan on getting a harman p43 for my 900 square foot home. I know it will heat my first floor up great, i need a way to get the heat upstairs, from what i read i finally understand the process of cool air has to be pushed down for the heat to rise, i also read everywhere that cutting floor registers is highly illegal and not fire safe. i have 2 ceiling fans in the first floor where the stove will be, if i cut 2 vents in the ceiling will that allow enough cool air from upstairs to travel downstairs and will the heat naturally rise better or will you need another set of vents to allow the air back up, im wondering if the ceiling fans will help either push or pull the air to help, any input to clarify this topic please please

Our house is about 1800 sq. ft., including the garage which is not heated. Our stove is opposite the bottom of the stairs and heats both levels nicely, although one or two upstairs rooms are not as warm as the others. The point is, however, you can feel the cold air coming down the stairs at floor level and warm air going up closer to the ceiling. I too would hold off on vents until you see how it works and perhaps through the wall venting on the first floor to improve the airflow should be tried first.

 

[fordf150]

welcome to my storage/utility room...till we get working on it again.this is my setup...its ugly and it works.there was a thermostat on the duct fan.it broke

 

[ndmcsx]

Ive heard of people turning the furnace blower on to circulate the air if need be.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

If you even remotely think about ducting a pellet stove get one you can duct otherwise you have a non compliment install as soon as you add the ducting, then your insurance company can tell you to take a flying leap. Mortgage troubles can then quickly ensue.

If you are thinking of installing floor vents make certain that they conform to all codes in your jurisdiction otherwise not only are you placing yourself in potential danger but you will have an issue with the code enforcement folks and multiple day fines may ensue.

That cab above is a noncomplying installation, they are not listed to be operated with ducting. Not listed for also means not insurable in that configuration.

While everyone is having fun, code is a multilevel thing and you have to make certain that the installation complies with all codes.

Most codes came about because of folks doing things that weren't all that safe, these folks even included builders and yes some codes are overkill, but then some codes aren't really up to snuff.

 

[DBCOOPER]

If you are thinking of installing floor vents make certain that they conform to all codes in your jurisdiction otherwise not only are you placing yourself in potential danger but you will have an issue with the code enforcement folks and multiple day fines may ensue..

So what your saying its only dangerous if the code says so? If the code doesn't address it its fine?

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

So what your saying its only dangerous if the code says so? If the code doesn't address it its fine?

The question posed isn't about what is safe and a number of the responses aren't even close to what would be considered as safe.

The question was about what was legal.

Now most code is speaking to what would be considered by the "law" (civil legal system) to be safe, go against that and you run into issues with the local authorities and personal liability issues.

This is sort of like the fasteners deemed "safe" by the IBC (International Building Code) now if you want to perch a deck off the side of a building several floors off the ground using them go right ahead however they fail most local codes. Remember codes are minimum requirements.

 

[begreen]

welcome to my storage/utility room...till we get working on it again.this is my setup...its ugly and it works.there was a thermostat on the duct fan.it brokeView attachment 127654 View attachment 127655 View attachment 127656

Code does address this and that is definitely against code. Return air ducts need to be at least 10 ft away from the stove. Check with your local authority and be sure to bring them pictures.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

If you want safe, the exit temperature at all registers must be below the burning point of flesh at maximum firing rates.

The convection air handling system must be closed at or near the heating device (removes any possible chimney effects, and is usually pointed at by some local code requirements that the ducting contain a minimum of two 90 degree turns).

I would add that the combustion air path also be closed in the same area to prevent smoke infiltration.

At this point you have a modified unit operating in an unlisted mode, then you just have to fight the insurance companies.

Now it is still possible that local codes will say even that isn't safe.

You folks can fight all of the battles, personally I don't have an iron in this fire.

 

[DBCOOPER]

The question posed isn't about what is safe and a number of the responses aren't even close to what would be considered as safe.

The question was about what was legal.

Now most code is speaking to what would be considered by the "law" (civil legal system) to be safe, go against that and you run into issues with the local authorities and personal liability issues.

This is sort of like the fasteners deemed "safe" by the IBC (International Building Code) now if you want to perch a deck off the side of a building several floors off the ground using them go right ahead however they fail most local codes. Remember codes are minimum requirements.

So can you give me a reference to any code anywhere that says you can't cut registers between floors in a residential structure?

 

[begreen]

It depend on your local code. Some require fusible-link fire dampers to be installed. Check with your local inspecting authority.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

So can you give me a reference to any code anywhere that says you can't cut registers between floors in a residential structure?

All I'm doing is pointing out that you have to check with the local yokels or risk the consequences if such is not done properly.

Just cutting the holes is likely to only be a very small part of it.

 

[DBCOOPER]

So once again no one can provide a reference. Nothing in NFPA or any building code. Its another I read it on the internet so it must be true.

 

[begreen]

Not so, but it is exhausting to keep looking this chit up. You do it this time, K? Give ya a hint, check IBC. Note that Smokey is not saying don't do it, he is saying check with the local inspecting authority and maybe with your insurance company. Both are good suggestions.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

For Maine one can start by reading all of these:

MUBC (Maine Uniform Building Code) consists of:

2009 International Residential Code (IRC)

2009 International Building Code (IBC)

2009 International Existing Building Code (IEBC)

62.1 - 2007 (Ventilation for Acceptable Indoor Air Quality)

62.2 - 2007 (Ventilation and Acceptable Indoor Air Quality in Low-Rise Residential Buildings)

E-1465-2006, Standard Practice for Radon Control Options for the Design and Construction of New Low-Rise Residential Buildings



MUEC (Maine Uniform Energy Code) consists of:

2009 International Energy Conservation Code (IECC)

62.1 - 2007 (Ventilation for Acceptable Indoor Air Quality)

62.2 - 2007 (Ventilation and Acceptable Indoor Air Quality in Low-Rise Residential Buildings)

90.1 - 2007 (Energy Standard for Buildings except Low-Rise Residential Buildings) editions without addenda.

E-1465-2006, Standard Practice for Radon Control Options for the Design and Construction of New Low-Rise Residential Buildings.


All small towns that didn't have an existing code of their own were required by the Maine Legislature to adopt and enforce the above.

Now if you really want to have fun you will find references to other codes in those.

You also have to remember that not all towns have to adopt and enforce the above so there are still a lot of local variations out there, it is your duty to comply with your local requirements.

Please note that there is no reference to NFTA directly above. Your state can be completely different and in addition the state can add requirements above what is in the above by just writing a new law.



ETA: For sh**ts and giggles my son showed up with a copy of the 2009 IRC (he sort of works in the field) as it pertained to building a deck, we built one back in 2012 during the hot spell. It didn't apply and further I wouldn't build a deck attached to any structure using the so called minimum specification fasteners. They were available at Lowe’s and clearly marked as IRC code complaint. All I could see is my deck parting company from the house.