Fire Cause

[Ludlow]

I saw a show many years ago where they put an insert in a masonry fireplace and ran only a few feet of pipe up into the chimney. Is that a slammer?

 

[Corey]

Nope. Article ends with the Chief saying it was an unusual cause . . .

The link I follow has that comment, 2 more pictures and then a heading and more text where he explains what he found. Maybe the entire page isn't loading for you

I, too, see the article ending with "...an unusual origin, Lake explained." If I go in to my adblocker and allow scripts from 'advance.net', then I get several more paragraphs of text and 10 more photos.

Guess the days are gone when text was just text... now text is a tracking script!

 

[bholler]

I saw a show many years ago where they put an insert in a masonry fireplace and ran only a few feet of pipe up into the chimney. Is that a slammer?

No that is a direct connect. Slammers involve no pipe.

 

[Ludlow]

No that is a direct connect. Slammers involve no pipe.

But it was just stuck up there loose. Just enough to get past the old damper.

 

[bholler]

But it was just stuck up there loose. Just enough to get past the old damper.

That is a direct connect just a very poorly done one. A slammer is just slammed into the firebox with no connection.

 

[jetsam]

It may be a definition but it isn't a correct one

Because it's not pushed forward a couple feet? Same effect, same problems.

 

[bholler]

Because it's not pushed forward a couple feet? Same effect, same problems.

Similar problems but not the same. A slammer allows allot of dilution air around the surround making the problems worse. Doing it this way it can be sealed well so no dilution air. It is still bad but not quite as bad.

 

[VirginiaIron]

It is not a slammer. Many installation manuals permit a section of pipe into and above the smoke chamber, stopping inside a clay lined chimney. The creosote DEFINITELY can drop down onto a block off plate, if installed.
BUT..... The cause of the fire was the "ENCLOSING" of an "EXTERIOR FIREPLACE" during the addition 100 years ago. Presumably, the fireplace was modified (bricked off), and the chimney was improperly modified via the vent pipe with no debris catch/stop and/or presumably, no way to properly and effectively remove the creosote below. And, apparently, safe clearances to combustables were not maintained 100 years ago. What I don't understand is when was the fireplace blocked off, and why. Did they install a gas furnace 100 years ago? Or, did someone have the bright idea to block it off and install a stove 10 years ago?
"...Nearly a century ago, an extension was put on the home and the fireplace*** was closed in***, but remained connected to the chimney, he said.

Some time later, a wood stove was added to the original part of the home and the metal pipe tapped into the chimney, loading it up with creosote over the years, ..."

 

[weatherguy]

It is not a slammer. Many installation manuals permit a section of pipe into and above the smoke chamber, stopping inside a clay lined chimney. The creosote DEFINITELY can drop down onto a block off plate, if installed.
BUT..... The cause of the fire was the "ENCLOSING" of an "EXTERIOR FIREPLACE" during the addition 100 years ago. Presumably, the fireplace was modified (bricked off), and the chimney was improperly modified via the vent pipe with no debris catch/stop and/or presumably, no way to properly and effectively remove the creosote below. And, apparently, safe clearances to combustables were not maintained 100 years ago. What I don't understand is when was the fireplace blocked off, and why. Did they install a gas furnace 100 years ago? Or, did someone have the bright idea to block it off and install a stove 10 years ago?
"...Nearly a century ago, an extension was put on the home and the fireplace*** was closed in***, but remained connected to the chimney, he said.

Some time later, a wood stove was added to the original part of the home and the metal pipe tapped into the chimney, loading it up with creosote over the years, ..."

I've seen quite a few old houses where the fireplace or fireplaces were walled, one house had 4 in the middle of the house all walled off. Why? Who knows why people do what they do.

 

[bholler]

I've seen quite a few old houses where the fireplace or fireplaces were walled, one house had 4 in the middle of the house all walled off. Why? Who knows why people do what they do.

Because they suck heat out of the house.

 

[Ryan723]

What I don't understand is when was the fireplace blocked off, and why. Did they install a gas furnace 100 years ago? Or, did someone have the bright idea to block it off and install a stove 10 years ago?

Not really an answer to your question, but maybe a little insight. I'm a bit further north, but also in NW NJ.

I had always wondered why some of the very old houses (150-200 years old) around this area had fireplaces and chimneys and many built in the last 40 years also did....but those from the mid-1800s thru the ~1960s mostly did not.

When you look at old photos of the landscape from the turn on the century through the ~1920s, its is amazing how much open land there is and how few trees...even in areas that are heavily wooded today. Between widespread logging in the early to mid 1800s and the clearing of land for farming, I just don't think there was nearly the surplus of available cordwood for burning for affordable heat. Plus during that same period, relatively cheap coal was available from nearby PA and fell into favor for heating homes.

So, if I had to bet, the fireplace was probably blocked off and a coal furnace or stove was probably used for a while. Maybe later replaced by fuel oil fired furnace (rural areas here rarely have town gas), and then a wood stove added sometime between the 1970s and today. Jumps in oil prices in the '70s had people going back to wood and away from fuel oil.

I've never really seen a history of wood heat, but I'd bet there are some very interesting patterns across the US. Neat stuff to think about though!

 

[VirginiaIron]

I've seen quite a few old houses where the fireplace or fireplaces were walled, one house had 4 in the middle of the house all walled off. Why? Who knows why people do what they do.

This is one good reason why a fireplace should be tagged in some way, to notify owner/ potential users that a modification has occurred.

 

[weatherguy]

Because they suck heat out of the house.

That makes sense. Probably did it once they had central heat.

 

[VirginiaIron]

Because they suck heat out of the house.

Yes, but what alternative heat source, 100 years ago, was available, as RYAN723 pointed out.

 

[bholler]

That makes sense. Probably did it once they had central heat.

Yes and quite often the furnace is run up through one of them

 

[bholler]

Yes, but what alternative heat source, 100 years ago, was available, as RYAN723 pointed out.

Coal furnaces and coal stoves

 

[VirginiaIron]

Obviously, they never consulted anyone on this site before they made the mods and installed the stove.

 

[HomeinPA]

It is not a slammer. Many installation manuals permit a section of pipe into and above the smoke chamber, stopping inside a clay lined chimney. "

The part missing from that statement is that there must be an airtight seal between the pipe and the clay liner. Everybody, virtually everybody, seems to ignore that little comment.

 

[bholler]

The part missing from that statement is that there must be an airtight seal between the pipe and the clay liner. Everybody, virtually everybody, seems to ignore that little comment.

Yes I have never seen a direct connect done properly. I don't even know how one would go about doing it properly.

 

[Ludlow]

Sprayfoam!

OK, ok.......KIDDING!