F500 V3 Oslo Issues

[Rusnakes]

Greetings,

My father has a Jotul F500 V3 Oslo stove and is having substantial issues entering year 5 of burning.

Background: He started complaining last spring of a bit of smoke leaking out when he would open the stove up, even with a solid ongoing burn. We chalked it up to shoulder season at the time, as he lives in Kentucky and there is more shoulder season than not there. We sweep his stove 2-3 times per year and vacuum/lightly brush off the cat filter/combustor at least each time (he cleans occasionally between those sweeps). He has a rear exit stove pipe and a double wall chimney liner through a brick chimney. It has been a very good stove until recently.

When we visited in the middle of the summer, we swept the stove once more and got everything set up and ready to go for fall. He started burning about a month ago. In just that time, the stove's performance has plummeted. We came to visit for the holidays, arriving last night, and when we entered the house we saw there were some coals in the stove. We tried to restart the fire, but the stove simply wouldn't burn...it was belching out smoke with the slightest crack of either door and the outdoor temps were trending to the high 30s (so cool enough to draw). We tried to get the stove started back up for a couple of hours and eventually just removed the kindling and piece of wood placed initially in the stove by us. The house was a horrible smoky mess.

This a.m. we inspected the stove, stove pipe, etc. The stove had abundant creosote build up, with the glass sooted over. The stove pipe was caked in creosote (having been sparkling clean from the last summertime cleaning).

We tried to remove the top of the stove, only to find that the 10 mm hex bolts weren't exactly 10 mm (more like 13/32"). Still can't remove them, but will give it a try with a universal socket tomorrow.

I am shocked and dismayed by this stove's performance, especially since it has been generally babied since install at the end of 2020. I suspect that the combustor is toast, but given high quality wood has been used the entire time, I'm really surprised by this. At $700 a pop, I'm not sure what to tell my dad to do going forward (I convinced him a Jotul was a solid purchase since we've loved our F55 for years).

Thoughts about what to do? Can he just run the stove without the catalytic combustor? Given that he got upgraded against his will by the guy who sold him the stove (he purchased a V2 and the stove company accidentally gave his V2 to someone who purchased a V3...so he got the V3 as an "oops" fix), I feel terribly this may be an ongoing issue.

Thanks for any suggestions or ideas to help problem solve this situation.

 

[bigealta]

"$700 a pop" for what? the cat?
Aren't they warranted for 10 years or 20 years?

Combustor Warranty | Jotul

Jotul - Combustor Warranty

www.jotul.com

 

[bigealta]

Yes get those bolts out and see what's clogged up in there.

 

[bigealta]

I'd bet some "not seasoned enough" wood got into your High quality wood pile and also probably running the stove at to low temps too often.

Sweeping 2-3 times a year seems excessive to me. It should not need that many sweeps.

 

[Rusnakes]

I'd bet some "not seasoned enough" wood got into your High quality wood pile and also probably running the stove at to low temps too often.

Sweeping 2-3 times a year seems excessive to me. It should not need that many sweeps.

Thanks so much for your replies. It is wood that is completely under cover (in a quonset hut with adequate ventilation) that has seasoned for 3 years. He uses wood based on its length of seasoning and regularly tests samples of the wood throughout in the pile as well to make sure it is under 14-15%. It's prime.

We do a routine sweep when we visit (which is 2 times in the burning season and once in the summer), just to help maintain everything from afar (we have a very nice Wohler brush and a borescope to inspect the pipe). It's good insurance from a distance for us to make sure everything looks good.

And that is good news about the combustor's warranty...completely forgot about that. Dad is nothing if not habitual and I'm pretty certain it is a failed cat vs. some error in his burn process...he burns the exact same way every day (and has for 25 years). He's fastidious about removing ash and keeping the stove clean. This stove is at his farm (not primary residence) and he follows the same morning routine, which we've watched many times over the years (gets a nice hot fire going to keep things clean and turns it down 2/3rds before leaving about 3 hours later; he does one major burn per day only).

 

[Todd]

Even with a bad cat the stove shouldn’t clog up with creosote that bad since the stove also has a secondary air baffle. I suspect some bad wood got in the mix? I would try running the stove without the cat a few times and see how it goes. Also maybe do a 50/50 distilled water/vinegar bath on the cat. It may have died or masked over from creosote. Also lock into the warranty.

 

[Rusnakes]

Even with a bad cat the stove shouldn’t clog up with creosote that bad since the stove also has a secondary air baffle. I suspect some bad wood got in the mix? I would try running the stove without the cat a few times and see how it goes. Also maybe do a 50/50 distilled water/vinegar bath on the cat. It may have died or masked over from creosote. Also lock into the warranty.

Tell me more about the distilled water/vinegar bath process. And will that void the warranty?

 

[Todd]

Sounds like your wood is good. I remember the early V3 had some cat issues this could be one of them. I would just take the cat to the dealer and get a new one under warranty. Not sure if the bath would effect the warranty or not but basically you soak the cat it the bath for a few hours then rinse with distilled water, let it dry and install. It should loosen any deposits in the cells and expose the substrate again.

 

[stoveliker]

The life of a cat is about 10,000-12,,000 hrs of burning.
I think it's dead now.

Put a new one in, clean the flue, and see if that solves it.

 

[Rusnakes]

Sounds like your wood is good. I remember the early V3 had some cat issues this could be one of them. I would just take the cat to the dealer and get a new one under warranty. Not sure if the bath would effect the warranty or not but basically you soak the cat it the bath for a few hours then rinse with distilled water, let it dry and install. It should loosen any deposits in the cells and expose the substrate again.

Yes, as far as I recall, this was literally one of the first v3s manufactured. I think he picked it up in June or July of 2020. Thanks for the bath info, too.

 

[stoveliker]

Also, if the warranty doesn't work out, $700 is not reasonable.
Did you check Midwest hearth?

 

[Rusnakes]

Also, if the warranty doesn't work out, $700 is not reasonable.
Did you check Midwest hearth?

WAY better price there. Thanks for that tip!

 

[begreen]

The first F500v3 stoves had an issue with the cat warping. It should be inspected carefully for other issues. There are some early threads on this stove posted by @webby3650 .

The creosote build up is likely due to the cat being plugged or failing. It happens when the flue gases are below 250º and start condensing on the flue and liner.

Is it possible that the stove is too large for the space being heated? Is it run all the time at the lowest possible setting?

 

[Rusnakes]

It's interesting about the warping. When I inspected the cat yesterday, it was slightly bulging out on the right side. I touched it and it moved backwards.

I figured that was the case with the creosote and flue gases. I am shocked my dad could actually get a fire going in it, tbh! We could never get kindling to catch, even on a healthy bed of coals...simply no draft.

Oversized...I don't think so, but is an interesting consideration. The farm house is about 2400 sqft, but is well insulated with Roxul/mineral wool throughout. He runs one load per day and let's it run out on its own in the afternoon/evening.

The first F500v3 stoves had an issue with the cat warping. It should be inspected carefully for other issues. There are some early threads on this stove posted by @webby3650 .

The creosote build up is likely due to the cat being plugged or failing. It happens when the flue gases are below 250º and start condensing on the flue and liner.

Is it possible that the stove is too large for the space being heated and run all the time at the lowest possible setting?

 

[begreen]

Is the stove room open to the rest of the house via an open floorplan or is the stove room separated with doorways?

Bummer about the V2 swap out. What was in there previously?

 

[Rusnakes]

It's a traditional 1920s bungalow-style home. It has a central corridor that streams heat upstairs to all rooms. There are doorways, but the doors are never closed.

And I totally agree re: V2 swap out. Previously--it was the original stove that was purchased in the 1960s or early 1970s. Can't recall the brand, but it was a workhorse. The problem with that stove was the liner--it was poorly installed previously, so we upgraded to a double wall liner (6 in. Hybrid Flex 304L Pre-Insulated Chimney Liner from Woodland Direct, with the rest of the cap and connection parts from Rockland Chimney) when we decided to upgrade the stove to the Oslo V2. Still have the original stove stored in one of the barns...a real beast.

 

[begreen]

I shy away from recommending any new stove until it's had at least a year of real world usage. Lab testing can only cover so much. Based on how dad is running the stove an F45 would be simpler, but now they have discontinued that one. There are a few left at dealers but going quickly.

Hopefully blowing air through the old cat will fix things. If not, a new cat should get the stove back in order. Note that you can leave the top lid bolts off. They are primarily for shipping. The lid is gasketed and meant to be removed for servicing.

 

[stoveliker]

I would buy a new cat regardless. Given their expected lifetime of 10-12,000 hours burning either it's dead or it will be soon. Better to have one ready to swap out than to be stick without heat when you need it.

 

[begreen]

Didn't Highbeam note that the lifespan also appears to be affected by the amount of wood gas volatiles it scrubs? If so, could 18,000 or even 20,000 hrs. be possible with hybrids with secondaries cleaning up the majority of the smoke first?

 

[Rusnakes]

I shy away from recommending any new stove until it's had at least a year of real world usage. Lab testing can only cover so much. Based on how dad is running the stove an F45 would be simpler, but now they have discontinued that one. There are a few left at dealers but going quickly.

Hopefully blowing air through the old cat will fix things. If not, a new cat should get the stove back in order. Note that you can leave the top lid bolts off. They are primarily for shipping. The lid is gasketed and meant to be removed for servicing.

Yes, I was not pleased to hear he got stuck with a V3 vs. the V2 we had chosen. He did get it at the V2 price (which was a good concession), but we always try stay away from new releases.

Good suggestion on the bolts. We are having a terrible time getting them loose...what is supposed to be 10 mm nuts is more like 13/32". Have to get a deep socket 13/32" to try to get the front side loose. The 3 mm set screws loosed up easily.

 

[begreen]

Maybe try a different socket in case the 10mm is worn?

 

[Rusnakes]

Maybe try a different socket in case the 10mm is worn?

We used 3 different socket sets, one of them brand new. We are all perplexed. I'm guessing there was an issue with machining of the nuts...none of us have ever run across something like this before.

 

[stoveliker]

Didn't Highbeam note that the lifespan also appears to be affected by the amount of wood gas volatiles it scrubs? If so, could 18,000 or even 20,000 hrs. be possible with hybrids with secondaries cleaning up the majority of the smoke first?

He said that. But it doesn't seem to be consistent with bkvp claiming that he can do many more years (I remember a decade) with a cat in his King (that seems to run low a lot, and runs on similar wood as highbeam I think).
I.e. there low and lots of volatiles doesn't decrease the life (which would be consistent with the hybrid argument you voiced).

Too many variables. Point is they don't last forever, they don't go bad on the shelf, so if it is a possibility that the cat is going (or gone), it's prudent to get a new. Imo.

 

[Goattman]

Free advice, so take it for what it is worth. I had a V2 and loved it. Sold the house and replaced with a V3. At some point during the burning season, it starts behaving like what you’re describing with your dad’s. I have figured out it is the catalyst blocked by fly ash.

I have only found one way to effectively clean. I run a hose from my compressor in the shop and gently blow out the ash. I open the front door to the stove and can see the front of the catalyst. I blow the ash from the front to the chimney.

If this works for you, then the bolts can wait.

Free advice…

 

[UplandMann]

Greetings,

My father has a Jotul F500 V3 Oslo stove and is having substantial issues entering year 5 of burning.

Background: He started complaining last spring of a bit of smoke leaking out when he would open the stove up, even with a solid ongoing burn. We chalked it up to shoulder season at the time, as he lives in Kentucky and there is more shoulder season than not there. We sweep his stove 2-3 times per year and vacuum/lightly brush off the cat filter/combustor at least each time (he cleans occasionally between those sweeps). He has a rear exit stove pipe and a double wall chimney liner through a brick chimney. It has been a very good stove until recently.

When we visited in the middle of the summer, we swept the stove once more and got everything set up and ready to go for fall. He started burning about a month ago. In just that time, the stove's performance has plummeted. We came to visit for the holidays, arriving last night, and when we entered the house we saw there were some coals in the stove. We tried to restart the fire, but the stove simply wouldn't burn...it was belching out smoke with the slightest crack of either door and the outdoor temps were trending to the high 30s (so cool enough to draw). We tried to get the stove started back up for a couple of hours and eventually just removed the kindling and piece of wood placed initially in the stove by us. The house was a horrible smoky mess.

This a.m. we inspected the stove, stove pipe, etc. The stove had abundant creosote build up, with the glass sooted over. The stove pipe was caked in creosote (having been sparkling clean from the last summertime cleaning).

We tried to remove the top of the stove, only to find that the 10 mm hex bolts weren't exactly 10 mm (more like 13/32"). Still can't remove them, but will give it a try with a universal socket tomorrow.

I am shocked and dismayed by this stove's performance, especially since it has been generally babied since install at the end of 2020. I suspect that the combustor is toast, but given high quality wood has been used the entire time, I'm really surprised by this. At $700 a pop, I'm not sure what to tell my dad to do going forward (I convinced him a Jotul was a solid purchase since we've loved our F55 for years).

Thoughts about what to do? Can he just run the stove without the catalytic combustor? Given that he got upgraded against his will by the guy who sold him the stove (he purchased a V2 and the stove company accidentally gave his V2 to someone who purchased a V3...so he got the V3 as an "oops" fix), I feel terribly this may be an ongoing issue.

Thanks for any suggestions or ideas to help problem solve this situation.

Jotul has had issues with the cats failing prematurely on the F500 V3 series and causing breathing issues as you have experienced.

Jotul has a 20 year warranty on the cats so you should either contact Jotul directly or the dealer to get a replacement.

Install is pretty simple but replace the gasket on the stove top before bolting it together.

Good luck!