Enerzone Wood Insert Performance

[ritzry2]

Finally got around to insulating my fireplace

Been able to run for a few days straight with the cold temps, I really do not see that much difference in everyday operating, where I see the difference is in how much longer the fan stays on because the insert stays warm longer and I now have large coals in the morning after an overnight burn...

www.hearth.com

This looks good. Would putting insulation in without the cement board be worth it? I don't want to deal with taking my insert out, which I would need to do to get the cement board in the back. I could also probably stack fire bricks in the back. The space between the insert and firebox would hold the bricks on place. I could get 2" insulation back there. What do you think?

 

[ritzry2]

Sorry I was away for a minute, bringing in a face meant bringing a face cord or a third of a cord into my basement to warm up. My firebox is 1.2 cu ft so at six hours I am putting out very little heat but still have good coals for a re start. This works fine after burning all day because I am just maintaining my preferred heat range. If I need to warm the house up by a large margin I am refilling every four hours to keep the heat pumpin. As far as doubling my burn time with dryer wood I would say the coaling is much better and Im getting better heat for longer because partly the stove had to run much longer open before I could close down the air intake this would shorten the length of each burn stage. Excess moisture is going to consume btu to cook the water out and that btu goes up the chimney with the steam.

Got it, thanks so much!

 

[ritzry2]

You will likely benefit from a block-off plate and some insulation behind the insert if there's room.

I already have the block off plate, but I could try the insulation in the back.

 

[mellow]

This looks good. Would putting insulation in without the cement board be worth it? I don't want to deal with taking my insert out, which I would need to do to get the cement board in the back. I could also probably stack fire bricks in the back. The space between the insert and firebox would hold the bricks on place. I could get 2" insulation back there. What do you think?

Something is better than nothing, it is a good thread to read the whole thing and see exactly what you are asking.

 

[ritzry2]

Something is better than nothing, it is a good thread to read the whole thing and see exactly what you are asking.

I am going to try a sheet metal and kaowool insulation behind the insert and see how that performs. I will report back my findings.

 

[ritzry2]

Thank you to all who contributed to this thread. I have learned a lot and I received excellent ideas to try. Thank you! I was very impressed by all the thoughtful, helpful responses from this community. I hope I can return the favor and be as helpful to someone else in the future. Have a wonderful weekend!

 

[ritzry2]

I added 1" Kaowool behind my insert and I put sheet metal on the sides. I was unable to get sheet metal in the back of the insert (without removing the insert). Is there any health concerns with k-wool in the back of my insert, or is this OK? Here is a picture:

 

[mellow]

If you have read the threads you have seen the talk about the fibers being airborne from rockwool which is what you are alluding to, the general consensus is to seal up the rockwool behind something solid like concrete board so it is not pulled through the fresh air intake and "possibly" blown into the home.

 

[ritzry2]

Yes, that is my concern.

If you have read the threads you have seen the talk about the fibers being airborne from rockwool which is what you are alluding to, the general consensus is to seal up the rockwool behind something solid like concrete board so it is not pulled through the fresh air intake and "possibly" blown into the home.

Yes, I have read some threads on this topic. I really like your approach with the concrete board and insulation. I was planning on using sheet metal in place of the concrete board b/c I thought I would be able to get the sheet metal around the back of the insert without having to remove the insert, but there was not enough room to do it. I ended up just placing the insulation behind the insert. One of the applications for insulation product I am using is for insulating wood inserts, so I will check with the manufacture too. Ideally, I would like to do what you did, but since my insert is over 400 lbs I would have to hire someone to move the insert for me.

I have not tried a fire since my original post until last night, and I had some good results. My changes are: (a) insulation in the back of the insert and sheet metal on the sides and (b) closing the air vent all the way (instead of just to the halfway point). The firewood was the same as what I used before. The results...I put in my last load around 10:15pm and at 4:30am, to my surprise, the fan was still going and there was a good bed of hot coals. This is about TWICE as long as what I was getting before. Since I made two changes (insulation in back and chaning the air venting), I am not sure if one had more impact over the other. I could try another fire where I control the air vents as in the past. That would show me the impact of the insulation.

 

[mellow]

One way to measure the change would have been to do an IR reading on the outside of the chimney before adding the insulation and then repeat same with the insulation. You WILL see a drop in temps if it is done correctly.

Its just like upgrading from one of those cheap red coolers to an insulated cooler like yeti, you will see a difference.

 

[ritzry2]

One way to measure the change would have been to do an IR reading on the outside of the chimney before adding the insulation and then repeat same with the insulation. You WILL see a drop in temps if it is done correctly.

Its just like upgrading from one of those cheap red coolers to an insulated cooler like yeti, you will see a difference.

I saw that you did that so I did purchase an IR temp gauge, but I was too motivated to install the insulation to wait so I could do a reading before and after. I do plan on checking the temp on the outside of the chimney and comparing that to other brick areas of the house to see what the difference is.

 

[ritzry2]

Last night I installed sheet metal over the insulation in the back, from the top of the insert to the block off plate. It is not sealed but the insulation is covered to the point I feel it is in good shape. The blower on my insert pulls air from the bottom front of the insert, circulates it through the firebox, and then blows it out the top front of the insert. There is not air circulation from the blower behind the insert where the insulation is and the insulation is blocked-off by sheet metal and there is a face plate on the front of the insert.

My last wood load last night was around 10:15pm and the blower was still going at 6:15am. There were hot coals at 7:15am, when I loaded the next load of wood. I also measured the exterior of my chimney last night. It was fairly mild last night, around mid 40's. The brick on my house measured around 40 degrees. On the chimney it was 40 degrees behind where the insert is, and it was about 45 degrees in the area that would be above the insert.

 

[mellow]

If you insulate the sides just make sure you are not blocking the air intake for the secondary burn, not sure if the installers punched out one of the plates on the side or not but that would let you know where its pulling that air from. Wouldn't hurt to take a lit incense stick while the stove is running to see where the stove is pulling that air from the most so you can make sure to not block it.

 

[ritzry2]

If you insulate the sides just make sure you are not blocking the air intake for the secondary burn, not sure if the installers punched out one of the plates on the side or not but that would let you know where its pulling that air from. Wouldn't hurt to take a lit incense stick while the stove is running to see where the stove is pulling that air from the most so you can make sure to not block it.

Got it, thanks. I just have sheet metal on the sides for now.

I have a couple questions for you: (1) Would it make sense to place firebrick on the top of the insert? (2) The block-off plate I made was fairly rough, especially where the circle cut-out is around the flue pipe. The user manual says to place stove cement where the block-off plate and the flue, but in some areas my gap is likely too big for that. I will probably eventually redo the block-off plate to get it more precise. Is there anything you would recommend to fill larger gaps (more than 1/2")?

 

[mellow]

1. Nope, leave that space open
2. Stuff rockwool in the gaps

 

[ritzry2]

1. Nope, leave that space open
2. Stuff rockwool in the gaps

Thank you!

 

[ritzry2]

For anyone who may be interested, I reached out to the manufacture of the Kaowool insulation to inquire about its safety for my application. Here was their response:

Ceramic fiber poses no risk just ‘being around’ in your house. It’s a very common material, and the components within ceramic fiber that are hazardous, are not dangerous in concentrations you as a homeowner would come in contact with. You would want to take the same level of precautions you would if you were to create sawdust from cutting wood, or concrete/brick dust from cutting masonry. Both wood dust and masonry dust have a more severe warning than ceramic fiber products.

For your installation, there is no concern.