Eko Project Installation

[stee6043]

Am I missing a pump in my proposed diagram? I have a boiler circulation within the thermostatic vale, but should I have one for the storage loop without going through the boiler?

I use a second pump to run my HX loop from storage in addition to the primary circ controlled by the boiler. You will need two pumps to run storage with a cold boiler since your primary circ pump will be on the wrong side of your mixing valve when it starts to close.

 

[Jayf19]

I think I misinterpreted maple's comment from last week... Would this updated version work with a single circ. pump?

Edit: Deleted picture as it is misleading for anyone who would read it in the future

 

[maple1]

You will need two pumps for your system.

One to just move heat from the boiler, and the other to move heat to your loads.

I was thinking you had a load pump that was off the diagram/picture.

EDIT: Typed too slow. Don't move your boiler pump to there. It won't be able to mix bypass water like that. You could put your load pump on your load return, just outside where the load retrun enters the tank. And i think then that just before that might be a better place for your expansion tie-in. Some guys though put their load pump in the house with the rest of their load controls.

 

[Jayf19]

You will need two pumps for your system.

One to just move heat from the boiler, and the other to move heat to your loads.

I was thinking you had a load pump that was off the diagram/picture.

EDIT: Typed too slow. Don't move your boiler pump to there. It won't be able to mix bypass water like that. You could put your load pump on your load return, just outside where the load retrun enters the tank. And i think then that just before that might be a better place for your expansion tie-in. Some guys though put their load pump in the house with the rest of their load controls.

There will be a load pump (I'm guessing inside the house but I don't know yet...)

I'm pretty lost as to where my circulation pump needs to be now, lol! Stee6043 mentionned that I was on the wrong side of the mixing valve, and you are telling me that on the other side, it won't be able to mix bypass water...

 

[maple1]

I don't think Stee was implying to move your boiler pump, but rather saying that using just one pump (load pump) won't work because it will be on the wrong side of the mixing valve.

I could be wrong on that....

 

[Jayf19]

I see it now, again misinterpreted... Thanks for the clarifications!

 

[Jayf19]

Plumber will be coming by the end of the week to plumb according to my diagram.

I will be keeping the circulator pump in the mixing valve loop, and will be keeping the Expansion tank where presented on my graph; the only thing different is that I will add the load pump where I initially changed the circulator pump (return side of expansion)

 

[DaveBP]

And while we're piling on advice;as long as those 2 storage tanks are empty I would put a thermowell for a temperature probe into each near the middle in one of those pipe fittings. You will have a lot more information about how much heat you have in the tanks for the price of a couple probe wells.

 

[maple1]

My temp probes are just stuck to the side of my tanks, taped there with Tuk Tape, with some insulation over top. Seem to work fine. The Johnson A419 also relies on a surface mount probe, although I guess it could be stuck inside a well. I guess my input from what I went through in my install with some leaky welds & dripping fittings is I would limit my chances for a leak by limiting my welds & fittings. Although in that respect I guess there shouldn't be any more leak potential from a well than a plug.

 

[Jayf19]

And while we're piling on advice;as long as those 2 storage tanks are empty I would put a thermowell for a temperature probe into each near the middle in one of those pipe fittings. You will have a lot more information about how much heat you have in the tanks for the price of a couple probe wells.

Is there a reason why you would recommend having the well near the middle instead of having one at the top and one at the bottom as I have planned?

 

[DaveBP]

I meant a probe in the middle in addition to those at top and bottom that you already planned.

If you only have top and bottom you will know only that there is hot water (or not) in the tank when it is completely full (if the bottom probe shows hot) or that it is about to run out of stored heat (when the top shows the temp dropping). When the tank is 80% full of hot water and when it is 20% full of hot water it will look the same to only two temperature probes at top and bottom.

With a probe in the middle you will have a much better idea how much hot water you have. This is very handy when you want to know how much wood to fire to top up the tank without overloading the boiler and having it go into idle mode (think smoke and creosote) while it waits for you to use some heat so it can start firing and charging the storage tanks again. If the top and middle probes show hot water and the bottom shows cold you'll know you have at least a half tank of heated water to cruise on. Make planning your firing schedule easier.

I have 5 thermometers on my 1000 gallon tank. That divides the tank into 6 segments. 5 is probably more than anyone needs. I just happened onto a box of 5 high quality units at an industrial surplus auction at 10% of their price in the Grainger's catalog. But more probes gives you more information to play with.

And the more you read about some of the systems people have on this forum, you'll know I do mean 'play with'.

 

[Jayf19]

I have 5 thermometers on my 1000 gallon tank. That divides the tank into 6 segments. 5 is probably more than anyone needs. I just happened onto a box of 5 high quality units at an industrial surplus auction at 10% of their price in the Grainger's catalog. But more probes gives you more information to play with.

Makes sense, and I have 2 extra probes that I wasn't sure what to do with. Thanks for the tip!

 

[Jayf19]

Plumber finally came to start this morning... So far, the circ pump has been changed on the return side (first 3 pictures) and ports were welded to the tanks to match my reverse parallel design.

 

[Jayf19]

Chimney added, air vents added, piping started (although I'm not convinced the return is in reverse parallel piping, but simply in parallel )

 

[Jayf19]

Parallel piping has been completed, although I don't understand why the load pump has been installed in the middle...

Can anyone tell me if this will affect the overall pressure in the system?

 

[NateB]

I have a question. Is that a really bad idea to put a valve as the first thing on your supply and return? I am no expert but I am in the process of doing the same thing you are. From my studies I came to the conclusion that the first thing on the supply should be a pressure relief valve and the second should be the expansion tank/ air separator and the over heat loop. On the return should be the return from the over heat loop and a drain. To me it looks like it could become a very dangerous situation if someone closes those valves, and there is wood in the boiler.