EFEL, AWKWARD INSTALL IN OLD COTTAGE + BIRD NEST DILEMMA !

[begreen]

You are right, of course .....
Unfortunately,desperation can make fools of us all ........

This is definitely not a job for well intentioned friends. It could be a challenging install. We can't say or see all options from the internet. You need a certified professional sweep or stove installer to assess options and advise a safe course of action.

 

[Fire sprite]

Perhaps tomorrow during the day light hours you can take outdoor pics of the existing chimney and also pics of the original area you wanted the stove installed, plus outdoor pics showing the tree problem.

~~~~~~~~~

Sure. I will take a few snapshots tomorrow ........ still trying to get through to the guy on the phone... but there's no answer
.....he will be turning up early morning otherwise..takes him an hour or so to drive down from where he lives ....and the job has to be aborted now .......I have no idea what to expect ....

 

[bholler]

I have to agree with everyone else. I dont know the regulations in your country but i am positive there are tons of violations there. It honestly is one of the most dangerous installs i have seen.

 

[Fire sprite]

This is definitely not a job for well intentioned friends. It could be a challenging install. We can't say or see all options from the internet. You need a certified professional sweep or stove installer to assess options and advise a safe course of action.

~~~~~~~~~

He is not a friend..... never met him until he turned up for the interview.... he ~IS, a Professional, Trained, Certified Hetas, stove installer ....
I believed him to be one of the best......until all your comments .....

 

[kennyp2339]

Take it in stride, I know in the US, most stove manuals have a section for chimney hook ups
This link is for newer Harmony stoves available in the US, but this is what we are talking about, read through this and look at the clearances (yours may require more due to being an older unit) look at the different chimney hook ups.

http://www.efel-usa.com/Documents/OwnersManuals/EFEL_Harmony_Stanford_Owners_Manual.pdf

 

[Fire sprite]

Take it in stride, I know in the US, most stove manuals have a section for chimney hook ups
This link is for newer Harmony stoves available in the US, but this is what we are talking about, read through this and look at the clearances (yours may require more due to being an older unit) look at the different chimney hook ups.

http://www.efel-usa.com/Documents/OwnersManuals/EFEL_Harmony_Stanford_Owners_Manual.pdf

~~~~~~~

Thank you for the manual.......I really think it best that the installer study all this .... Funny thing is when I offered to
send him an email with a PDF attachment of the Harmony 5 fitting manual he wasn't particularly interested...
He said all woodburners are different, he'd never heard off Efel before, said he knew nothing about it ....
Even when I was looking at the manual on my computer.... he didn't want to look....so I doubt he will be any different tomorrow ..

 

[Fire sprite]

I have to agree with everyone else. I dont know the regulations in your country but i am positive there are tons of violations there. It honestly is one of the most dangerous installs i have seen.

~~~~~~~~~
I am ~ Totally,~ Aghast at the amount of warnings I am receiving from all you folk...... I mean This is ~ Seriously ~Scary !
How could this happen ??? Why would an, obviously, respected and knowledgeable installer, ( been installing stoves for many years, I believe)
not only endanger my life.... but risk his own reputation...... ??? Doesn't make sense ... I just ~ Dont, Get it !

 

[bholler]

How could this happen ??? Why would an, obviously, respected and knowledgeable installer, ( been installing stoves for many years, I believe)
not only endanger my life.... but risk his own reputation...... ??? Doesn't make sense ... I just ~ Dont, Get it !

I cant answer that it makes no sense to me either. I have been doing this a long time and i would never risk your safety or my reputation just to get something done. I will tell you i cant do it and walk away possibly loosing money before i do something dangerous like that.

 

[Fire sprite]

Oh well..... Im going to hit the sack now ...... need to wind down ...... tomorrow morning ain't gonna be fun .....

 

[bholler]

Oh well..... Im going to hit the sack now ...... need to wind down ...... tomorrow morning ain't gonna be fun .....

situations like this never are. good luck to you

 

[begreen]

He said all woodburners are different, he'd never heard off Efel before, said he knew nothing about it

That is a warning sign. Efel is an old and well known company. I think your best bet is to cut your losses here and don't invite him back.

 

[Fire sprite]

Installer turned up yesterday, I was unable to stop his arrival as his phone was out of signal ....Soon as he arrived I offered him a cup of tea, asked him to sit down.... and I introduced him to the forum ... He was astonished, alarmed and hurt that I had uploaded photos of his unfinished work ....
However, It had never even crossed my mind that he would be deemed as having done anything untoward ....I did not, by any means, post the thread with malicious intent ...

He ~Swore, to me that the finished product would be safe....that he would not endanger my life ....

Naturally, he wants to be paid..... and,of course, it is going to cost me thousands ...Yet, if I pay him,
I will not only be parting with a lot of money that I can ill afford ... but I might also be dicing with my life on a dubious install
...... I am in a terrible predicament, which is neither, really his nor my fault...... he was not aware of the complexity of the chimney... until it was too late.... and he had, already, committed himself, invested a lot of time and effort in the work....

He, also, knew, that I did not have a lot of money to play with .... so did not want to let me down ...

Early this morning I awoke to the most frightening pain I have ~Ever, experienced in the back of my leg like it was going to explode ..... ( a kind of "Charlie horse "perhaps ... ) I have had the very rare occasional twinge in the past, but ~ Nothing like that, I was almost howling ..... Also, perhaps, even more ominously, just before I awoke..... between sleep and the awakened state....... before I had opened my eyelids ... just for a few split seconds, I saw, quite vividly, nothing but bright orange flames ......
Somewhere along the line looks like someone's got to be the loser ... If I must die in flames then,at least, it will be an honourable death ..... I, for one, am not about to descend to the"dog eat dog " mentality, it is not my way .....

 

[begreen]

This is going to be a difficult install. Removing the old chimney is probably what I would do. Then there is a clear shot for a proper metal chimney. Nothing should be done without first presenting a written proposal that you can digest and consult on. Do this for multiple installers. Contact local stove shops and ask who is the best. Maybe also ask the local fire dept. and insurance companies who they recommend.

I feel for your dilemma but you are right to not compromise safety. I'm pretty sure that the current installation proposed has to be against local fire and building code. If there is a local fire marshal that does local inspections that is the authority to ask.

PS: On the leg cramps, do you take a statin like Lipitor? High dosages of statins can cause severe muscle cramps. I've had some real doozies until the dosage was backed off.

 

[jatoxico]

which is neither, really his nor my fault...... he was not aware of the complexity of the chimney... until it was too late.... and he had, already, committed himself, invested a lot of time and effort in the work....

I, for one, am not about to descend to the"dog eat dog " mentality, it is not my way .....

If he was unable to accurately estimate the job and was surprised by what he found as he opened up the ceiling and walls, well...he should have had the experience to at worst, say that up front. It's understandable that this sometimes happens. Even the most seasoned pro gets surprised now and then but what he finds once the demo starts but you can't let the install be unsafe because he underbid.

You clearly don't want to hurt this guy financially or otherwise so if you still have a working relationship just tell him you don't like the direction this is going and want to re-start. He should stop now before he puts any more time into what looks like a failed plan. Then either use him to go with your original idea of running proper pipe outside or possibly better, go with BG's idea of taking out the old chimney which may go much easier than you imagine.

In any case good luck and please keep us posted. Would like to know how this turns out.

 

[turn_n_burn]

Wow, this reads like a good cliffhanger. Sprite, I know all of this info was probably very painful to hear, but always keep in mind those on this forum are looking out for your best interests. It sounds to me like your installer was not only ignorant of some very important fundamental standards and building codes, but the part that really got me was when you mentioned offering to show him the stove and specification manuals, and he refused to look at them. That was a huge red flag. If I was changing out the engine on a Vauxhall or Peugeot, I would want to see the shop manual, because I'm really only familiar with Ford and General Motors. Definitely keep us posted on this, we're all rootin' for you.
Oh, and a bit to add to what begreen (thank you for bringing that up by the way, green) mentioned about the leg cramps/statin drug thing....If that's a major issue, please get that checked out, and also stay away from grapefruit juice while taking these. Rhabdomiolysis is a very serious condition, and the juice multiplies the level of the drug in your system. I was a pharmacy tech for years and this was ALWAYS something the pharmacist warned people about.

Pob lwc!