Earth Stove Insert not very hot

[Snowy Rivers]

Earthstove was pretty basic across the lineup.

Look up into the area of the heat tubes, you want to force the hot gasses to travel the full length of the heat tube rows from side to side, before it goes up and out.

This should be with the plate to one side or the other.

Get that plate set in there so the hot gasses have to travel the farthest distance with contact on the heats tubes.

The stoves I had had the flow from left to right, then up the right side of the stove and above the upper most baffle plate (not removable) then either down and out or up to a top chimney.

You should get more than just warm air. It may not be HOTTTTTTTT on the lowest setting but it should be more than just barely warm.

Let us know.

Snowy

 

[jgcable]

Earthstove was pretty basic across the lineup.

Look up into the area of the heat tubes, you want to force the hot gasses to travel the full length of the heat tube rows from side to side, before it goes up and out.

This should be with the plate to one side or the other.

Get that plate set in there so the hot gasses have to travel the farthest distance with contact on the heats tubes.

The stoves I had had the flow from left to right, then up the right side of the stove and above the upper most baffle plate (not removable) then either down and out or up to a top chimney.

You should get more than just warm air. It may not be HOTTTTTTTT on the lowest setting but it should be more than just barely warm.

Let us know.

Snowy

I moved the plate. It was centered. I moved it to the extreme right as per the heat flow chart in the owners manual. I am getting alot more heat now. Here are the readings with the meat thermometer stuck in one of the heat vent slots.
LOW 110 DEGREES
LOW 1 135 DEGREES
MEDIUM 140 DEGREES
MEDIUM 1 160 DEGREES
HIGH 190+ DEGREES (MY THERMOMETER ONLY GOES TO 190)

How does that look????

 

[Snowy Rivers]

Hmmmmm
Thats sounds about right.

Where is that angled corner you spoke of located ???

Get that to the LH side of the stove, either front or back if you can.

If that cut is at the RH rear or front, it can allow a lot of hot gasses to pass by without goin g through the heat exchanger tubes.


Sounds like we have got this gremlin figured out fairly well now. Keep us posted.

Snowy

 

[jgcable]

Hmmmmm
Thats sounds about right.

Where is that angled corner you spoke of located ???

Get that to the LH side of the stove, either front or back if you can.

If that cut is at the RH rear or front, it can allow a lot of hot gasses to pass by without goin g through the heat exchanger tubes.


Sounds like we have got this gremlin figured out fairly well now. Keep us posted.

Snowy

When you say LH side, that is when I am facing the stove right?
Where is the best place for the angled corner to be? Front or rear?
I am pretty sure the angled corner on mine is on the right side and it might not be correct because it might have fallen out when the stove was transported and put in incorrectly. My owners manual doesn't show how it goes in. The manual just states to remove it to clean the tubes and reinstall it. They make no mention of the corner angle or what side it should go on.
Please let me know. I think I am making probress on this. Movint the baffle plate definately had an impact but I am thinking it can even be better.

 

[imacman]

When you say LH side, that is when I am facing the stove right? Where is the best place for the angled corner to be? Front or rear?

Yes....the cut-out should be either in the front or rear, and to the left as you face the stove.

What Snowy was try to say is that if you have the cut-off corner to the right, it will leave a little triangular "hole" on the right side of the stove and some of the hot gases will be able to slip through....that would lower the heat level a bit.

 

[relxn88]

I can't help you with your stove, but when you get it to where your happier with it, I'd be curious to see what kind of heat you'd get if you were burning Okanagan or Barefoot or some other high temp pellet, instead of Freedom Fuel. I use this for a reference
https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php?ACT=24&fid=22&aid=30075_Stokmj1AsShUGnQ35WNa&board_id=1

 

[jgcable]

When you say LH side, that is when I am facing the stove right? Where is the best place for the angled corner to be? Front or rear?

Yes....the cut-out should be either in the front or rear, and to the left as you face the stove.

What Snowy was try to say is that if you have the cut-off corner to the right, it will leave a little triangular "hole" on the right side of the stove and some of the hot gases will be able to slip through....that would lower the heat level a bit.

There is no way to get the cut off corner on the left. The top of the stove has an angle on the front right side made to fit the plate. The only way this plate will fit is with the angle on the front right side of the stove. I looked up there with the plate off and the passage that leads up into the flue is on the left side of the stove. The right side is completely sealed.
With the plate pushed all the way to the left it completely seals the passage from the firebox forcing the hot air up the right side of the stove, across the tubes and then up the passage. Per my owners manual, that is exactly the way the air flow chart looks.
Am I crazy??

 

[jgcable]

Tonight I had a hard time starting it. It is a manual start so what I do is turn the start button on and also throw an handful or 2 of pellets in the firepot. When it stops feeding I break out the propane torch and I fire up the pellets for a minute or 2. Usually, I shut the door and even though the lazy flame goes out the fire pops into life as soon as the door is secured.
Tonight, I did the same procedure except I got a misfire due to insufficient heat . I opened the door and fired up the pellets again with the torch. I closed the door and hit the start button. This time it went through half of the start procedure and went into vacuum mode which tells me it knew I opened the door at the wrong time. Finally, I opened the door again and fired up the pellets one more time and hit the start button. It went through the start procedure again and eventually started.
It was very hard to see if it started because after only 1 bag of pellets, my glass is so dirty I can't even see through it.
By the time the stove started and was hot everybody was already upstairs to bed with blankets on. It took me almost 45 minutes to get it going.

 

[Snowy Rivers]

This is good. You are as good as you can get then. The plate is in correctly.

OK to start with, the Earth stove is a Positive pressure stove. they do not use an exhaust fan. Only a draft inducer blower.

To get this beast lit, make sure the fire tray is clean, add a couple handfulls of pellets to the tray.

Leave the power off, use your torch and get a little heat in the firebox to start some draft.
Torch the pellets in the tray back and forth with the torch to get them going good.

Once the pellets are burning, shut the door and turn the stove on to get the draft fan running.

Once the fire is brisk, hit the start button and allow it to feed.

These stoves have a fairly short startup timer and can drop out an allow the fire to fail.

Careful and diligent fire building techniques are needed to get an Earth stove up and going.

My Old WP50 used to take me about 20 minutes before I could actually walk away and leave it to do its thing.

The fire Lighter Jello is good with this stove. Add some to the pile of pellets and light it, close the door and allow the natural draft to get the fire going, then hit the go button.

Either way you choose, these stoves take patience. Too many pellets in the pot and you will have a tough time getting it going.

You need a good fire before punching it into the go cycle.



Keep the faith Bro.

Snowy

 

[jgcable]

This is good. You are as good as you can get then. The plate is in correctly.

OK to start with, the Earth stove is a Positive pressure stove. they do not use an exhaust fan. Only a draft inducer blower.

To get this beast lit, make sure the fire tray is clean, add a couple handfulls of pellets to the tray.

Leave the power off, use your torch and get a little heat in the firebox to start some draft.
Torch the pellets in the tray back and forth with the torch to get them going good.

Once the pellets are burning, shut the door and turn the stove on to get the draft fan running.

Once the fire is brisk, hit the start button and allow it to feed.

These stoves have a fairly short startup timer and can drop out an allow the fire to fail.

Careful and diligent fire building techniques are needed to get an Earth stove up and going.

My Old WP50 used to take me about 20 minutes before I could actually walk away and leave it to do its thing.

The fire Lighter Jello is good with this stove. Add some to the pile of pellets and light it, close the door and allow the natural draft to get the fire going, then hit the go button.

Either way you choose, these stoves take patience. Too many pellets in the pot and you will have a tough time getting it going.

You need a good fire before punching it into the go cycle.



Keep the faith Bro.

Snowy

Thanks for all your help. Last night I put in a full bag of Freedom Fuel and I did exactly what you described. The only thing I have to do different is I can't leave the stove off when I initially light it because the smoke from the burning pellets wafts directly into my living room setting off all the smoke alarms! I needed to turn it on so the fan draws the smoke into the unit and up the flue. Anyway.. it lit right up no problem.
One thing I did do was remove the fake log before I lit it. It appeared to me that the log was stifling the flame because it covers a main part of the stove and the firepot. What a difference! I set the temp on medium and the stove was absolutely blazing. I would say double the width of the flame and very active. The heat was easily 190+ coming out of the vents. Temp in my house went from 68 to 74 in about 4 hours.
I really think I have this sorted out with all the help from this forum. I shut it down this morning and when I get home I need to clean it out and clean the glass door which is just about completely covered with ash from the last few burns.

 

[Snowy Rivers]

Good to hear that all is well now.

If you want, you may try and adjust the draft fan air inlet damper to allow more air into the firebox.

A little more air may help reduce the crap on the glass.

Take care and enjoy.

Snowy

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Well Snowy, I think that jgcable should reduce the draft a smidge more.

Then see how things go after having cleaned the stove and without having those useless ash trap logs in the way of everything.

Those puppies were the very first thing I removed from my stove.

 

[Snowy Rivers]

yesss the logs are a real PITA.

With the WP 50 we had, the logs would collect enough ash (burning the shells) in one day to cause trouble.
Actually I removed the small log pieces and used just the two long pieces that lay in front of and behind the fire area of the burn tray.

These stoves need a lot of fresh air coming in as they are a Positive pressure stove.

I had mine set with the air shutter set full open and it was a happy camper.

The size and type of stack would certainly make a difference.

With a tall free flowing stack that thing should draft really well.

My Wp50 would skunk up the window in a day or two of low burn settings.


Snowy

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Yep, every install is different when it comes to draft settings, which is why I gave a range by specifying that it should be just enough to keep a good flame, at that point the stove is happy and the heat flows best as far as flame adjustments are concerned.

Mark it and vary it. That way jgcable you'll find the proper point to get the most you can out of the stove.

 

[Snowy Rivers]

A tad too much air can actually hurt the heat output. But too little makes a nasty smokey lazy fire that soots up the glass in a hurry.


Snowy

 

[jgcable]

So... at first the intake damper door was fully open. Its only about a 3" x 3" square door with a wing nut on it and a slot in the middle of it for adjustment. I adjusted it so that its half open and I have a ton more heat than I had but I think the heat output increased more because I had the top plate centered instead of slid all the way to one side so the heat now is forced to travel accross all the runner tubes.
I burned a 3/4 a bag on medium and I had blast furnace heat. I shut it down and opened the door and I noticed a fair amount of tan soot as usual but I also had some black soot and a little bit of what looked like pellets that had not completely burnt up. Also, the glass was so bad that I had to scrape it with a razor blade and then use the wet newspaper/soot trick to clean it.
You guys are VERY knowledgable on this and I greatly appreceate all the tips. Since there are 2 guys here giving me excellent advise and one is saying to open the intake door a little more and the other is saying to close it a little what should I do?
My gut feeling is to open it up a little more rather than close it but my gut feelings have been wrong 100% of the time when it comes to this stove. let me know. Thanks! John G

 

[jgcable]

yesss the logs are a real PITA.

With the WP 50 we had, the logs would collect enough ash (burning the shells) in one day to cause trouble.
Actually I removed the small log pieces and used just the two long pieces that lay in front of and behind the fire area of the burn tray.

These stoves need a lot of fresh air coming in as they are a Positive pressure stove.

I had mine set with the air shutter set full open and it was a happy camper.

The size and type of stack would certainly make a difference.

With a tall free flowing stack that thing should draft really well.

My Wp50 would skunk up the window in a day or two of low burn settings.


Snowy

My chimney is 27' long and straight and its inside my house. I installed 4" stainless flexpipe and used a 4" to 3" adapter to fasten it to the insert.
The chimney top plate and rain cap is just the normal ones that you get in the kit. My owners manual stated 3" pipe for up to 26' long. Because my chimney is 27' I figured 4" was the way to go. If I had to guess I would say it drafts really well. I am just not sure about that little intake door. Its so small I am surprised it makes so much of a difference!

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

You try both and see what it does in your situation.

Most of these stoves need a very small opening for an intake, as long as they can satisfy the volume of air to provide a good fire that is all that is needed.

Frequently the intake pipe has a damper inside of it and that damper needs to be open about 0.5 inches to do the job.

A 3 by 3 plate is much bigger than most.

There are stoves that don't have a damper. I know because mine doesn't, the draft is completely controlled by the combustion blower.