Burn times, firebox size, stove temps? How often do you reload?

[Woody Stover]

The stove might be just a tiny bit too big for my home and geographic location; if I give it room to breathe it will melt the house....80% with white oak and hickory.

That's the problem; Your wood is too good. You need to stock up on Tulip Poplar.

 

[Niko]

Great thread. So how are stove top temps being derived? FLIR? IR Gun? Magnetic thermometer?

These can be vastly different in accuracy.

Where are readings taken? By the flue collar? Over the cat (if equipped)? Near fan air exit or near the front? These can be vastly different one stove to the next.

Are the blowers on or off during the taking of temp readings?

If any credible comparisons are to be made (and there will be), set up a plan so those providing data provide a more apples to apples comparison.

Just my .02

BKVP

 

[Niko]

Not sure why the picture came before your quote but this is where i put my magnetic probe. Dont know if its the right spot or not but i have left it their taking readings every night so at least all my data is based on one meter and one spot.

 

[Niko]

I typically reload around 250 to 300 on the stove top. It usually cruises between 600 and 700

600-700 man your room must be like being in the caribean . My stove is in my man cave downstairs and i Dont let it go above 450-500 too long cause the room will start going above 83 when im in it. Just was watching the show on netflix THE OA pretty weird but even better when your near wood heat and relaxing.

 

[volunbeer]

Before I started figuring out how to dial this thing back it would be close to 80 in the stove room and I kept falling asleep. This thing makes for some killer naps....... when I am tired and I sit in my recliner the eyelids get very heavy.

I don't have a thermometer on the stove - not sure I will get one. The thermostat for the central heat and air is about 12 feet away on a wall behind a partial wall (in the hallway) and I have just been going off of that. If it is anywhere around 70-73 I assume I am in the zone. I just watch the cat probe and the thermostat. If it is hotter we have been using a small fan to pull air away from the stove and it seems pretty effective. Our master is behind the wall where the stove is and it stays about 5-6 degrees cooler and that is fine by me.

On another note.......... just got the whole house humidifier and have it running now. Says the humidity in the house is 21%. Set it for 50% and will see how it works. I can already feel it!

 

[bholler]

600-700 man your room must be like being in the caribean . My stove is in my man cave downstairs and i Dont let it go above 450-500 too long cause the room will start going above 83 when im in it. Just was watching the show on netflix THE OA pretty weird but even better when your near wood heat and relaxing.

I heat from the basement like I said before so yeah it is pretty warm down there but comfortable upstairs and I like doing it that way because it really tempers the temp swings of a non cat stove. Plus it keeps the mess out of the living area.

 

[St. Coemgen]

We have two stoves. Regarding the main stove, from the stove's manual available at:

https://www.lanordica-extraflame.com/en/products/wood-stoves/rossella-plus-forno-evo

"Firebox size" : 37.4cm x 37cm x 35cm

"Burn times" : The stove will burn 2.4 KG of wood an hour at nominal output. For max load, do the math (wood weight for available volume) to see how much wood can be added to the above burn box space.

"Stove temps" : This is a convection stove. Wrapped with a tile layer. External temps of the tile is hot to the touch only and internal firebox temps are not directly measured. This stove has a cooking oven, and that oven does show temps: usually between 200°C-300°C

"How often to you reload" : Personally, I typically load three logs at a time, every 2 hours or so. That keeps a nice even heat output during the day. Very useful as this stove is also a cooking oven and you can not bake cookies when the oven is 400°C. At night, I let the fire go out. House insulation keeps the house warm over night. New fire each morning.

 

[Niko]

We have two stoves. Regarding the main stove, from the stove's manual available at:

https://www.lanordica-extraflame.com/en/products/wood-stoves/rossella-plus-forno-evo

"Firebox size" : 37.4cm x 37cm x 35cm

"Burn times" : The stove will burn 2.4 KG of wood an hour at nominal output. For max load, do the math (wood weight for available volume) to see how much wood can be added to the above burn box space.

"Stove temps" : This is a convection stove. Wrapped with a tile layer. External temps of the tile is hot to the touch only and internal firebox temps are not directly measured. This stove has a cooking oven, and that oven does show temps: usually between 200°C-300°C

"How often to you reload" : Personally, I typically load three logs at a time, every 2 hours or so. That keeps a nice even heat output during the day. Very useful as this stove is also a cooking oven and you can not bake cookies when the oven is 400°C. At night, I let the fire go out. House insulation keeps the house warm over night. New fire each morning.

Thats pretty cool, ive seen something similar before but a long time ago. A cousin of mine in Greece has something like this and i remember the women loved using it in the winter, cause oil over their is really expensize!

 

[Dobish]

my firebox is 3.0 cu ft, and this is my schedule

7:30 am- Stove them 250º, flue 175ºish, room 63º
Fill firebox with a little bit of smaller stuff on the bottom, followed by bigger splits. Let flue temps get up to around 450/500 and griddle temp to be around 600º.

8:00 am- close bypass and shut down air a little. Room temp 68º

sometime between 3:30-5:30 pm- 1/2-3/4 full load (no idea of temp, someone else loads up the stove, but when I get home I have to cut the air)- Room temp 73º

10:30pm- room temp 68º - refresh and toss in a few splits. stove temp 450, cat 1000, flue 350º

12:00am- room temp 68º- cut air to almost nothing. stove temp 450, cat temp 1000º , flue 300º

 

[jetsam]

I'm so jealous

Those cat stoves and their 24 hour burns I've been thinking of a second stove in my basement and I would do a cat stove for sure.

But then again although I have to reload my quad 3100 insert every 6 to 7 hours I'm only burning on weekends when I'm home to feed the stove and run the central during the week. It's natural gas and with the help of my stove part time weekends I'll pay roughly $400 max in natural gas for the entire winter. And it's cold in these parts ( going to be single digits highs and lows of minus 20 all week)

So I'm happy but still jealous of those 24hr burns you cat stove folks get !!

With those temperatures I'd be getting 4 or 6 hour burns if I was lucky; when the stove is cranking, the playing field is a lot more level.

A week of -20 would have me buying an IR camera and plugging leaks in the house, too.

 

[begreen]

Search on Burn Time in the title only in this forum. It is discussed perennially.
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/burn-time-assessment.152350/

600-700 man your room must be like being in the caribean . My stove is in my man cave downstairs and i Dont let it go above 450-500 too long cause the room will start going above 83 when im in it. Just was watching the show on netflix THE OA pretty weird but even better when your near wood heat and relaxing.

This points out the great variability in stove sizing and perhaps the folly of this question. All our houses are different. Sometimes the difference is so great that a big stove is barely adequate in one and loafing in another. Houses vary in so many ways (insulation, construction material, ceiling height, age, room sizes, stove location, number and size of windows, floorplan, number of stories, stairwell location, etc.) and geographic locations and climate zones that the results are only relevant for near identical situations.

 

[black smoke signals]

Great thread. So how are stove top temps being derived? FLIR? IR Gun? Magnetic thermometer?

These can be vastly different in accuracy.

Where are readings taken? By the flue collar? Over the cat (if equipped)? Near fan air exit or near the front? These can be vastly different one stove to the next.

Are the blowers on or off during the taking of temp readings?

If any credible comparisons are to be made (and there will be), set up a plan so those providing data provide a more apples to apples comparison.

Just my .02

BKVP

Princes PI 1010 INSERT Stove top temp measured far left side IR gun 425 Magnetic 400 degree blower on med setting one hour into the burn Pine and red oak full loaded N/S.Cat temp pointing to 4 oclock most of the time.T-stat set to 3-4.I use the fan speed to control the top of stove temp like the manual says to do. I have been burning apox 8 weeks only problem now is my vacu-stack drafts (no problem with 10-30 mph) more than it should on windy days with 40-60mph winds. These excess winds will change my t-stat setting to almost full closed with the cat temp pointing to 4 oclock and climbing top of stove stays about same temp. This forces me to select high setting from the fan to control the high cat temps which affects my burn time.

 

[woodhog73]

A week of -20 would have me buying an IR camera and plugging leaks in the house, too.

It's funny how when it's that cold out you can feel cold air from every leak. I've plugged lots of leaks. In my case my insulation is whatever was typical in the 1970s combined with old windows and one door that still is original and well a not so tight house.

Thankfully my central is newer and very efficient.

If I could do it over again I would have started with a large 4.0 cubic foot stove in my basement flue. I've got central heating duck work above where my stove would go. Cut a few registers in the ducks and should get some good heat upstairs. Then instead of my wood insert I would have put a gas insert in my fireplace instead. Leave all the wood and dirt in the basement.

I've been told gas inserts can put out a lot of BTU and are inexpensive to operate.

But I'm leaving my wood insert. I don't really have enough wood to feed 2 stoves and not enough time to process more wood just because of a second stove.

 

[jetsam]

It's funny how when it's that cold out you can feel cold air from every leak. I've plugged lots of leaks. In my case my insulation is whatever was typical in the 1970s combined with old windows and one door that still is original and well a not so tight house.

Thankfully my central is newer and very efficient.

If I could do it over again I would have started with a large 4.0 cubic foot stove in my basement flue. I've got central heating duck work above where my stove would go. Cut a few registers in the ducks and should get some good heat upstairs. Then instead of my wood insert I would have put a gas insert in my fireplace instead. Leave all the wood and dirt in the basement.

Replacement double pane vinyl windows are cheap, easy to install, and make an unbelievable difference vs 1970s windows.

You might also consider an add-on wood furnace in the basement if you already have ductwork, and just burn the insert when you need a boost or a pretty fire.

 

[Niko]

This is what makes this thread awesome. Their will never be a scenario where 2 are the same. But we can all use one another data to figure out how we can make our own scenarios better and more efficient.

My biggest pic up so far is this, it doesn't matter how hot your stove
Top gets or your burn times if the heat is not staying in your house.

I guess it's a lot easier and cheaper to burn wood then it is to insulate ones house. I know this because I wrote a thread a lil bit ago about buying a second stove or to insulate. Many pointed me to insulate.

 

[begreen]

If our old farmhouse had any more glass it would be a greenhouse. It got a remodel by city folk in 1984 and they added a lot of windows, (then moved out a year later ). It's nice most of the year but when it gets cold out you know it and I have to push the stove to keep up with the heat loss. This is with new double pane windows all around. Unfortunately even good windows don't provide much R value.

Given that scenario our normal burn cycle is 8-12 hrs, but with current cold temps I am running the stove with a full load first thing in the morning then about 5 hrs later putting on 2-3 splits at a time every 4-5 hrs. then a larger fire at night to tide us over. This is with temps in the 20s. If it got down to the teens. I would need to put blankets on the windows.

 

[bholler]

I guess it's a lot easier and cheaper to burn wood then it is to insulate ones house. I know this because I wrote a thread a lil bit ago about buying a second stove or to insulate. Many pointed me to insulate.

oh I insulated allot our first year here we went through 8 tanks of oil. The last year I heated with only oil I had it down to 5. But I have insulated more since then

 

[heavy hammer]

Insulation will help in the cold and heat. I run the kuma which says it's a 3.6 firebox but more like 3 with the cat housing I reload every 8 to 12 hours. The temps are usually around 300 to 500 when reloading. When cold it's more often like at six hours with temps over 600. When above 30 outside its the only stove running the summit insert upstairs makes the house to hot. When running the summit it is reloaded every 5 to 8 hours depending on how house temps are. When we get cold days both are worked a little more reloading when needed to keep house where we want it, keeping stove temps up.

 

[Dobish]

If it got down to the teens. I would need to put blankets on the windows.

use bubbled wrap and a spray bottle of water that way the light still comes in!

 

[toddnic]

The answer to your question of "burn time" has many facets and is based upon:

• Desired inside temperature
• House size
• Level of insulation in the house
• Outside temperature
• Woodstove efficiency percentage rating (equates to the amount of heat not going "up the chimney"
• BTU's per hour
• Combustion chamber size (amount of wood the stove will hold)
• Wood type being burned
• Wood moisture content
• Draft

With that being said, I'm sure there is a mathematical formula to solve this problem but it will take a greater mathematician than I to develop it.

Here are my answers to the above points as it relates to my house and the Progress Hybrid.

• Desired inside temperature: 70 degrees
• House size: 2,400 sq. ft.
• Level of insulation: Normal (not really tight)
• Outside temperature: 30 degrees Fahrenheit
• Woodstove efficiency rating: 81%
• BTU's per hour: 73,171
• Combustion chamber size: 2.8 cubit feet
• Wood type burned: Primarily red oak
• Wood moisture content: Under 20%
• Draft: Normal

With the above considerations, I can get between 10 to 12 hours of "burn time" maintaining a stove temp above 350 degrees and can maintain an average temperature of 70 degrees inside the house. Also, I consider "burn time" from the start of a fire to a minimal level of coals in the stove in which I can restart the fire.

Definitely not "scientific" enough to really answer your question but that's my "two-cents" worth....

 

[Niko]

The answer to your question of "burn time" has many facets and is based upon:

• Desired inside temperature
• House size
• Level of insulation in the house
• Outside temperature
• Woodstove efficiency percentage rating (equates to the amount of heat not going "up the chimney"
• BTU's per hour
• Combustion chamber size (amount of wood the stove will hold)
• Wood type being burned
• Wood moisture content
• Draft

With that being said, I'm sure there is a mathematical formula to solve this problem but it will take a greater mathematician than I to develop it.

Here are my answers to the above points as it relates to my house and the Progress Hybrid.

• Desired inside temperature: 70 degrees
• House size: 2,400 sq. ft.
• Level of insulation: Normal (not really tight)
• Outside temperature: 30 degrees Fahrenheit
• Woodstove efficiency rating: 81%
• BTU's per hour: 73,171
• Combustion chamber size: 2.8 cubit feet
• Wood type burned: Primarily red oak
• Wood moisture content: Under 20%
• Draft: Normal

With the above considerations, I can get between 10 to 12 hours of "burn time" maintaining a stove temp above 350 degrees and can maintain an average temperature of 70 degrees inside the house. Also, I consider "burn time" from the start of a fire to a minimal level of coals in the stove in which I can restart the fire.

Definitely not "scientific" enough to really answer your question but that's my "two-cents" worth....

No science needed as stated you can be as specific or generic as you like.

 

[woodhog73]

This is with new double pane windows all around. Unfortunately even good windows don't provide much R value.

I would need to put blankets on the windows.

I agree. My house is 1970s but for some reason has a lot of windows and very large over size ones in the kitchen and living room. Which is strange because it's not a big house and was not built as a luxury home, but they went crazy with big large windows.

So that's why I haven't replaced them . I've gotten quotes for double glass basic vinyl windows over $12k installed. I know I could save a lot if I did it myself but I'm not the best carpenter in the world ( ok I suck at carpentry) and the windows are all custom sizes. On top of that casement crank windows are what would look best on the house so that's even more money.

So I've yet to do windows. But I feel my heat loss is through a combination of not modern insulation and 1 very leaky old door. The door I can get done for reasonable price. I should do the door.

My windows actually have no draft. They are tight. But being single pain the glass is cold to the touch. To help with that I put plastic on them and keep the curtains shut. Seems to help.

 

[jetsam]

If our old farmhouse had any more glass it would be a greenhouse. It got a remodel by city folk in 1984 and they added a lot of windows, (then moved out a year later ). It's nice most of the year but when it gets cold out you know it and I have to push the stove to keep up with the heat loss. This is with new double pane windows all around. Unfortunately even good windows don't provide much R value.

El cheapo double-pane vinyl windows are usually somewhere around R2-R3 for the glass. Here's thermal data for the cheap line from home depot. (Divide 1 by the U value to get the R value.) The stuff off the shelf there is R3. If you upgrade, for example, to Anderson's high end triple pane E4 glass, you can get much better performance, but you are still only looking at R5.

 

[jetsam]

I know I could save a lot if I did it myself but I'm not the best carpenter in the world ( ok I suck at carpentry) and the windows are all custom sizes. On top of that casement crank windows are what would look best on the house so that's even more money.
.

Replacement windows go into the existing jamb, so you can leave the original nailing flange in place (so no siding removal or carpentry). Pop off the mouldings, measure the old jamb top, middle, and bottom both ways, measure the depth of the old jamb, and use the measurements to order custom sized replacements.

Taking the mouldings off will let you see if you need to insulate between the frame and jamb, too. Even if it's already insulated, a shot of polyurethane foam usually beats a handful of fiberglass.

Try a small one first and see how it goes! You'll probably find it quite doable.

 

[Woody Stover]

1 very leaky old door. The door I can get done for reasonable price. I should do the door.

This stuff was easy to install and is doing the job for me. You install it on the door jamb with the door closed, so that the vinyl bulb is touching the door. Don't press the bulb against the door too hard, or the door will be hard to close. Tension is adjustable, though.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/M-D-Buil...de-Door-Jamb-Weatherstrip-Set-01958/100133154