BK Ashford 25 (and Sirocco 25)

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mellow said:
I only got the smoke smell from mine during the warmer days of the shoulder season when it got up to 50-60 during the day and in the 30's at night. During the day I had to run it a bit hotter to keep the draft going.

@Rama Is your liner insulated? And how tall is your liner?
Click to expand...

Hi Mellow,

The liner itself is not insulated but it just fits inside terracotta tile of the masonry fireplace. In addition the top 18" is stuffed with insulation as a top cap and the dealer specified this would sufficiently keep the heat around the liner. Our winters are mild, highs in the mid 50's and lows in the high 30's. I've gotten this smell even during colder times.

The liner is just 15'.
 
@mellow Yes, you may be correct, and I've contemplated starting with a cap extension to increase draft and then doing more if need be from there but something you said worried me. I assume you have a longer, insulated liner but that in the shoulder season you STILL got that smoke smell. Even if I spend that extra money to go fully insulated oval liner and extend it, my regular winter equates to your shoulder season and this would bring us back to square one.
 
SculptureOfSound said:
Curious what fixes are being attempted to fix the smoke smell issue and if you guys have had any success?
Click to expand...
Please open the door to your unit. Looking at the door gasket, where is the joint where the two end come together? Are they along the hinge edge, across the bottom, top?

Thank you
BKVP
 
Ok. That will do. We just don’t want the seam or joint on the hinge side.
 
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Now that the heating season is over I'd love to hear how your Ashford 25 performed.

Burn times?
Turn down ability?
Smoke smell?
Heat output?

I put off my insert decision until next season but am looking to buy in spring/summer for the best deals, so the research begins again :)
 
haha, excuse the oops, meant to say that it's almost over, although I guess that isn't really true either! I've been flipping between manuals, checking clearances, etc, like a madman and failed in my attempts at multitasking and posting.

Well, the coldest should be behind us - curious to hear how the Ashford held up!
 
Hey guys. Don’t know if everyone abandoned ship on this thread. I read this post before purchasing our AF25 so I have to thank everyone for their input. We got it installed today and had our first burn. It was 35F outside during the installation. The guys had to cut out a few layers of brick to get the insulated liner to the stove. After the installation was completed I followed directions and made a bed of coal. Took some time for the needle to be in the activated zone, nevertheless it got there.
Oh man I have to say these things love to smoke and the smell is terrible. Burned high for about 5 hours and then turned down to medium. It raised our house temp by 2 degrees real quick.
My main issue is trying to keep it in the active zone while on lower temp setting. I understand I’ll need to be patient and get a very good layer of coal before this stove is broke in.
Any thoughts?
 
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The paint on the insert will cure with a couple of full throttle fires. Or are you talking about smoke spillage?
 
The thermostat turns way lower than the stove can run at . For long burns I run at about 3 o'clock which is half way on the dial. I can turn it way down for the first 8hrs or so, but if you turn it to low it won't be able to open up once the volitiles are burnt off.
 
Mine is on order.. I warned the fam it will smell terrible for 2-3 burns... hopefully it will clear up then.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
It will smell terrible after every new temperature plateau is reached. After the break in fires and one hot fire, it's good. The first fires are definitely open window territory, though.
 
First season with the AF25 insert here and so here are some observations.

1. I do get the smoke/creasote smell when the stove is on low and what I have found is that the amount of play in the adjustment lever is not 1:1 with the amount of opening on thermstat. If you turn off the fans and move the adjustment you can hear the thermostat clicking shut. On my stove the air intake closes off way before the adjustment is on minimum. Non-scientific measure ment would be 25-30% of the "swoosh" is where the intake flapper is actually totally shut.

So what does this mean? Well I started adjusting the stove by ear to get it as low as possible... I close the thermostat until I hear it click then i open it just ever so slightly so I know some airflow is going in. When I look in with a flashlight I can see just a tiny bit of opening on the flapper. This has completely removed the smoke smell. I am convinced that smoke smell is from non-ideal fuel AND the large amount of play in the adjustment where the air intake goes fully closed. That being said, i understand that if the thermstat is set closed then it *should* open to keep the stove in the active cat range but even with a cold stove the air intake fully closes way before the adjustment is fully on low.

2. I have experimented with running the insert with and without fans on. Without fans on the stove can run more hours on a load than with fans running and it seems to have an easier time running on very low settings with the fans off.

3. I have gotten the longest burns by starting a top down fire right under the cat, letting it get established and then engaging the cat sometimes even before the needle hits "active". I have found that it takes a lot of fuel to get the temp into "active" with the bypass open because all of the heat is going out the back of the stove and not across the cat. So if you get it close to active temp, shut the bypass you will see the cat glowing instantly and the temp gauge will shoot up. This tells me that the cat could go active earlier but the temp gauge is thrown off with the bypass open.

4. Front to back fires have kept the glass cleanest for me.
 
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mcdeadstein said:
First season with the AF25 insert here and so here are some observations.

1. I do get the smoke/creasote smell when the stove is on low and what I have found is that the amount of play in the adjustment lever is not 1:1 with the amount of opening on thermstat. If you turn off the fans and move the adjustment you can hear the thermostat clicking shut. On my stove the air intake closes off way before the adjustment is on minimum. Non-scientific measure ment would be 25-30% of the "swoosh" is where the intake flapper is actually totally shut.

So what does this mean? Well I started adjusting the stove by ear to get it as low as possible... I close the thermostat until I hear it click then i open it just ever so slightly so I know some airflow is going in. When I look in with a flashlight I can see just a tiny bit of opening on the flapper. This has completely removed the smoke smell. I am convinced that smoke smell is from non-ideal fuel AND the large amount of play in the adjustment where the air intake goes fully closed. That being said, i understand that if the thermstat is set closed then it *should* open to keep the stove in the active cat range but even with a cold stove the air intake fully closes way before the adjustment is fully on low.

2. I have experimented with running the insert with and without fans on. Without fans on the stove can run more hours on a load than with fans running and it seems to have an easier time running on very low settings with the fans off.

3. I have gotten the longest burns by starting a top down fire right under the cat, letting it get established and then engaging the cat sometimes even before the needle hits "active". I have found that it takes a lot of fuel to get the temp into "active" with the bypass open because all of the heat is going out the back of the stove and not across the cat. So if you get it close to active temp, shut the bypass you will see the cat glowing instantly and the temp gauge will shoot up. This tells me that the cat could go active earlier but the temp gauge is thrown off with the bypass open.

4. Front to back fires have kept the glass cleanest for me.
Click to expand...

I have had the same experience as all your points.

On your point 3 is why I wish they would have included a digital cat temp setup like my lopi has. Instant readings and operated by a 2032 battery which lasts for quite a while.


Lopi Rockport
Blaze King Ashford 25
 
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Thanks for responding. I played around with it all night and learned some things. I find that the 3 o’clock position is the lowest I can go. I agree with mcdeadstein that the temp gauge closes and creates the click and I tried to readjust going back to a suitable flame.

Im burning seasoned oak as well. I’ll get a moisture reader and see where I am at. I tried my best to burn hot to get the cat warmed up and I found the top down worked best. I still barely get 1/4 into the red active zone.

My friend got a regency stove and he found similar issues at first. Said it took him a week to actually like his stove. Lol

I’m still getting a Smokey smell and I will continue to play around. Will keep you posted.
Thanks!
 
Tegbert said:
I have had the same experience as all your points.

On your point 3 is why I wish they would have included a digital cat temp setup like my lopi has. Instant readings and operated by a 2032 battery which lasts for quite a while.


Lopi Rockport
Blaze King Ashford 25
Click to expand...


I happy to to hear you have the same experiences. I do really enjoy this stove but this learning curve was a little unexpected after reading such glowing reviews on the princess models. I'm surprised other users haven't commented much on how ambiguous it is trying to set the thermostat flapper when there is so much play in it. And the flapper is solid so when it is closed there NO air getting through. I've heard some other models have a hole in the flapper so even on low *some* air can get it.

I wonder if the smoke smell is due to the thermostat closing completely, smokebox filling up, then stack temps drop and cause some backpressure which forces the smell backwards out of the intake. This make sense to me because the smoke smell comes noticeably out of the air circulation vents on the top sides of the stove. Only way for smell to come out of there is if it is drawn in from the bottom intake which is....right next to the thermostat opening.. again just spitballing here ... i may be way off but seems to be plausible.
 
mcdeadstein said:
I happy to to hear you have the same experiences. I do really enjoy this stove but this learning curve was a little unexpected after reading such glowing reviews on the princess models. I'm surprised other users haven't commented much on how ambiguous it is trying to set the thermostat flapper when there is so much play in it. And the flapper is solid so when it is closed there NO air getting through. I've heard some other models have a hole in the flapper so even on low *some* air can get it.

I wonder if the smoke smell is due to the thermostat closing completely, smokebox filling up, then stack temps drop and cause some backpressure which forces the smell backwards out of the intake. This make sense to me because the smoke smell comes noticeably out of the air circulation vents on the top sides of the stove. Only way for smell to come out of there is if it is drawn in from the bottom intake which is....right next to the thermostat opening.. again just spitballing here ... i may be way off but seems to be plausible.
Click to expand...

I don’t know about yours but mine is not flat. It looks like it but there is a raised section in the middle of the flapper that allows air in at full closed. I’ll take a picture when I get home. It’s not as obvious as the hole but there is a gap.


Lopi Rockport
Blaze King Ashford 25
 
Tegbert said:
I don’t know about yours but mine is not flat. It looks like it but there is a raised section in the middle of the flapper that allows air in at full closed. I’ll take a picture when I get home. It’s not as obvious as the hole but there is a gap.


Lopi Rockport
Blaze King Ashford 25
Click to expand...

Its a shame that the video host went belly up from my thread about these stoves, I found air does come in BELOW the tstat housing. Take an incense stick with the stove running and the shrouds off and you will find it. I sealed it with furnace cement.

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/blaze-king-sirocco-25-insert.157802/

Some good talk about the tstat operation in that thread, all the new stoves should be operating correctly.
 
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