Basement Stove Backdrafting

[Hot Stuff]

Are there cases where a SS liner is installed and it still cools in the early morning and backdrafts? I'd hate to spend the money only to have the issue remain.

Yes, that is what I was dealing with. 3am in the yard with the fire department airing the house out on a brand new insert installed with a full SS liner. But, I suspect this could be a multifactorial issue that you are dealing with and you may have to do more than one thing to fix it. A major contributor to mine was a hole in my attic that I was unaware of that was venting out my nice warm house air. I still have a bit of an issue - got a 16 once on the CO detector after fixing just that, but I consistently get 0's if I crack a window and open up the airflow on the stove before I go to bed. Not ideal and no overnight burns for now, but I can enjoy my stove.

I suspect those vents in the wall between the boiler and stove are to supply combustion air to the boiler. Do you have outside combustion air to the boiler as well anywhere? An evaluation from an HVAC pro might be helpful. The boiler might be outcompeting the stove for air late at night.

 

[kamill]

Yes, that is what I was dealing with. 3am in the yard with the fire department airing the house out on a brand new insert installed with a full SS liner. But, I suspect this could be a multifactorial issue that you are dealing with and you may have to do more than one thing to fix it. A major contributor to mine was a hole in my attic that I was unaware of that was venting out my nice warm house air. I still have a bit of an issue - got a 16 once on the CO detector after fixing just that, but I consistently get 0's if I crack a window and open up the airflow on the stove before I go to bed. Not ideal and no overnight burns for now, but I can enjoy my stove.

I suspect those vents in the wall between the boiler and stove are to supply combustion air to the boiler. Do you have outside combustion air to the boiler as well anywhere? An evaluation from an HVAC pro might be helpful. The boiler might be outcompeting the stove for air late at night.

There is no outside air going to the boiler. Thermostats set to 62 and when the fire goes out it is definitely kicking on.

I had the fire department show up the first time the alarm went off. I had already refueled the fire and cracked some windows before they showed up and they were getting a reading of 60ppm. Took about 1.5hrs to go back down to 0. I picked up a digital CO reader sounds like probably the same model you have. It alerts above 30ppm but shows a peak reading at 10 and above. The second time it backdrafted I handled it myself within 30 minutes but I worry because my cats mostly hang out in the basement and anything about 10 would affect them much more than myself. Switched to oil heat until I come up with a solution.

 

[Ludlow]

As Begreen suggested. the insert on the main floor would be my choice. The main floor flue is going to perform worlds better with the basement space below the stove.

 

[Pertzbro]

Turn off your radon system and see what happens.

 

[kamill]

It pulls from under the slab and the fan is on the exterior of the house. I'm hesitant to try turning it off and having the basement fill with CO. With the OAK I don't think there is a lack of make up air. I can usually hear the air rushing down the OAK pipe.

 

[kennyp2339]

It pulls from under the slab and the fan is on the exterior of the house. I'm hesitant to try turning it off and having the basement fill with CO. With the OAK I don't think there is a lack of make up air. I can usually hear the air rushing down the OAK pipe.

Your OAK is dangerous and probably contributing to the problem at hand by also cooling off the firebox while in the coal stage of the burn.

 

[kamill]

Pardon my ignorance, but how do you create an OAK that doesn't pull in cold air?

 

[kennyp2339]

Pardon my ignorance, but how do you create an OAK that doesn't pull in cold air?

OAK installation should not be any higher then the fire box, yours in a detrimental in (3) ways.
1. materials used are flammable
2. the inlet is higher then the stove which if the chimney were to clog it can reverse the oak sending hot gases up it and starting your house on fire
3. By having the oak installed in your manor your creating a duct for cold air to just flow into your firebox and with your draft situation its being exacerbated and cooled even further / faster which is allowing the co to drain into you living space.

Since your set up is the way it is, you cant have an OAK, if make up air in an issue then a small dedicated vent to the outside is needed, but no direct hookup.

 

[Chas0218]

Those radon evacuation are usually 50cfm or little larger. That being said a 2000 sq.ft. home with 8' ceilings that little fan can evacuate all the air in the house in 320 minutes. So the added draw that fan is having on your home plus your furnace running it will happen all that much faster. The vacuum the basement is having from being sealed is causing your issue along with the chimney being too large and staying too cool.

At this point it might be beneficial to consult a professional. I'm not trying to insult you just some people shouldn't attempt things they don't know enough about. Hopefully you take our recommendations and keep safe. Happy holidays.

 

[kamill]

Those radon evacuation are usually 50cfm or little larger. That being said a 2000 sq.ft. home with 8' ceilings that little fan can evacuate all the air in the house in 320 minutes. So the added draw that fan is having on your home plus your furnace running it will happen all that much faster. The vacuum the basement is having from being sealed is causing your issue along with the chimney being too large and staying too cool.

At this point it might be beneficial to consult a professional. I'm not trying to insult you just some people shouldn't attempt things they don't know enough about. Hopefully you take our recommendations and keep safe. Happy holidays.

I absolutely agree with you. I've been in touch with a couple professionals. I'm looking at replacing the woodstove in the basement with a pellet or wood insert on the main level. If I can't safely use an OAK I don't really want passive air in the basement.

I appreciate all the advice here!

 

[Pertzbro]

Those radon evacuation are usually 50cfm or little larger. That being said a 2000 sq.ft. home with 8' ceilings that little fan can evacuate all the air in the house in 320 minutes. So the added draw that fan is having on your home plus your furnace running it will happen all that much faster. The vacuum the basement is having from being sealed is causing your issue along with the chimney being too large and staying too cool.

At this point it might be beneficial to consult a professional. I'm not trying to insult you just some people shouldn't attempt things they don't know enough about. Hopefully you take our recommendations and keep safe. Happy holidays.

They're actually more than 50cfm. Mine is over 150cfm.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00294RBFM/?tag=hearthamazon-20

 

[Chas0218]

They're actually more than 50cfm. Mine is over 150cfm.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00294RBFM/?tag=hearthamazon-20

I think it depends on the amount or radon that needs to be evacuated, my Sister in law evac. kit is only a 50 cfm fan but either way we both agree it isn't helping their situation that is for sure.

 

[kamill]

To conclude this thread, my local dealer gave me a couple options. They were willing to line the flue for just the cost of parts or swap out the wood stove for a pellet insert. We decided to swap out the stove and get a Harman P35i upstairs

I appreciate all the timely advice here! I just don't think my house was built to support a wood stove in the basement.

 

[kennyp2339]

To conclude this thread, my local dealer gave me a couple options. They were willing to line the flue for just the cost of parts or swap out the wood stove for a pellet insert. We decided to swap out the stove and get a Harman P35i upstairs

I appreciate all the timely advice here! I just don't think my house was built to support a wood stove in the basement.

Merry Christmas to you and your family, take some pics of the new pellet stove and show it off

 

[Corey]

... a partially finished basement where the stove is installed.

When the stove is cold, there is a good amount of cold air rushing down into it, so it makes lighting a fire pretty difficult.... the flue gets cold, it'll reverse the draft and spill CO into the basement upwards of 50-75ppm. It's not backdrafting any smoke, just CO from uncombusted coals. The house is pretty tight so I installed an outside air kit in hopes that it was a negative pressure issue.

Pretty much the typical pattern... lower-level stove, tight house, poor draft / backdrafting issues.... The hot air trying to flow up out of the basement and the 'stack effect' of the upper house levels will be pulling a negative pressure in the basement. If you don't have a lot of heat in the flue, it will lose the battle and the backdraft begins.

The OAK should 'fix' the CO issue, but you need to make sure all joints in the OAK are air tight. That way your stove is always operating at outdoor / ambient pressure - regardless of the house stack effect, radon fans, etc. But if the OAK isn't or can't be made air tight, or the stove has leaky gaskets, air inlets, etc - then still a chance for CO to be pulled into the basement.

You can try a fully insulated flue, but at some point the stove will cool off beyond the point even the insulation is helping. You could also try closing any doors to the upper level (and/or installing a door) to break the stack effect of the house. Though this is often not acceptable as the big reason for running the stove is to heat the upstairs. You might also try to place a fan so the basement is 'stuffed' with cold air from above. That would help negate the pure stack effect from the warm air rising and keep the basement at a slight positive pressure.

 

[Hot Stuff]

To conclude this thread, my local dealer gave me a couple options. They were willing to line the flue for just the cost of parts or swap out the wood stove for a pellet insert. We decided to swap out the stove and get a Harman P35i upstairs

I appreciate all the timely advice here! I just don't think my house was built to support a wood stove in the basement.

Good on your dealer for providing a good solution. Can’t wait to see that new pellet stove burning!

 

[MR. GLO]

Thanks for sharing story. I would invest in multiple ultra low co detectors. defender is a good one.

some other ideas
chimney liner with insulation.

good wind cap

no oak ...wait

test 3 chimneys multiple smoke tests and test when you first light fire.. ...you could be pulling the smoke down another chimney..
air seal attic
good 2 to 3 year seasoned wood

try leaving basement window or door cracked and watch what happens when you cover stove door entrance with newspaper with tape on top portion..watch it suck in or out..and if it gets better if you open or close things and fans...

just my 2 cents i have a basement stove and my co number has only been 43 and only once when temp dropped quick with hot ashes. so tried some of these ideas...i also shut off some box fans i had running with filters.






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