Alcove Installation question(s)

[woodhtr]

I came here to post a similar question, and found that the original poster is looking to do pretty much exactly what I'm after.

I have a zero clearance wood burning insert, with manufactured chimney surrounded by a box, and would like to upgrade to a wood burning stove for supplemental heat.

I would like to create an "alcove" in which to put the stove, and think that with the back clearance I will have from the wood framed chimney box, I will have enough space to add non combustible material to surround the stove.

I've spent hours reading the installation manuals for VC stoves (I know they aren't the best but I can get a used one, and they are pretty, which is what wife wants). Unfortunately the clearance info gives only reduced clearances for a shield with standoffs, which isn't going to achieve the aesthetic result I'm looking for, and the height for the "alcove" would be a minimum of 5 ft.

What I would really like to achieve is to have the stove tucked into a space about 4 ft high by 3-4 ft wide. The stove would hardly have anything above it because it would be top vented to the existing double wall chimney pipe.

There are no guidelines on how to reduce vertical (or horizontal) clearance by building an insulated wall, but it seems like the pictures posted here are trying to do just that, by building an "fake" masonry fireplace.

Ideally I would like to achieve something similar to what I've included in this picture. Any ideas or info are appreciated.

 

[begreen]

Posting moved to its own thread

 

[begreen]

A 4ft wide alcove without wall shielding is going to need a close clearance stove. Tacking insulation on walls is not wall shielding. An alcove is not the same as building a fake brick fireplace, though some similar rules will apply. Typical alcove ceiling requirement is 84" though there are exceptions.

FWIW a used VC stove can turn out to be an expensive proposition, regardless of low initial cost. Used ones frequently are on the market because they need a rebuild. There are other good looking stoves on the market. If a classic style stove is desired look at cast-iron clad steel stoves.

 

[woodhtr]

A 4ft wide alcove without wall shielding is going to need a close clearance stove. Tacking insulation on walls is not wall shielding. An alcove is not the same as building a fake brick fireplace, though some similar rules will apply. Typical alcove ceiling requirement is 84" though there are exceptions.

FWIW a used VC stove can turn out to be an expensive proposition, regardless of low initial cost. Used ones frequently are on the market because they need a rebuild. There are other good looking stoves on the market. If a classic style stove is desired look at cast-iron clad steel stoves.

Thanks. On point 1, I’ve read all of the manufacturer guidelines about alcove installations and think I get it. Basically no matter what you make the walls and ceilings of, you can reduce clearance unless you make a shield with standoffs

It seems like what I really need is to make a “fake” masonry fireplace. I’ve read the codes for fireplace construction and they specify 10” brick or 8” brick with firebrick. But they don’t specify how you make a “lintel” for a “fake” fireplace, where there should really be a masonry flue. There must be an equivalent spec for a masonry hearth with a manufactured double wall chimney. This would seem equivalent to what I want to do. Anyone have any resources on this?

On your second point, this seems to be a common theme. We need something porcelain for the asthetics. But I think a $300 VC stove is too tempting vs a new $3000 stove no matter what type it is.

 

[begreen]

Save the expense of the fake masonry fireplace. It may be more complicated than it seems at first. And it won't necessarily reduce clearances. Consider how will the weight be supported? The money saved can be applied toward a cast-iron jacketed stove with close clearances. Take a look at the Jotul F45 and Quad Explorer I and II for examples.

 

[woodhtr]

Save the expense of the fake masonry fireplace. It may be more complicated than it seems at first. And it won't necessarily reduce clearances. Consider how will the weight be supported? The money saved can be applied toward a cast-iron jacketed stove with close clearances. Take a look at the Jotul F45 and Quad Explorer I and II for examples.

Thanks for the advice. I expect that you are right about the fake fireplace costing more time and effort than it seems. It would probably end up being more than just laying up a brick box into the wall.

I looked at the Quad Explorer II and it looks pretty good. Very close clearances, long burn time, and the look we are after. Also liked the Jotul 400 series. Any other suggestions on stoves to look at?

I figure that before the next EPA phase kicks in, these stoves should be heavily discounted...

 

[EbS-P]

How tall is your flue and are you thinking top or rear vent? I ask because the F400 can be temperamental as far as draft goes. Mine is top vented to a strait shot 15’ preinsulated liner and it’s about perfect. Better than my father-in-law’s that is rear vented to 25-30’. I would not consider the F400 a close clearance stove and the firebox is shallow and the top baffle has a pretty good slope to it so it’s not the biggest or easiest stove to load. I really like the ivory color and the Jøtul form and function.

 

[woodhtr]

How tall is your flue and are you thinking top or rear vent? I ask because the F400 can be temperamental as far as draft goes. Mine is top vented to a strait shot 15’ preinsulated liner and it’s about perfect. Better than my father-in-law’s that is rear vented to 25-30’. I would not consider the F400 a close clearance stove and the firebox is shallow and the top baffle has a pretty good slope to it so it’s not the biggest or easiest stove to load. I really like the ivory color and the Jøtul form and function.

Yes I suppose the Jotul F400 is not close clearance after looking at the specs. I think the F45 is though. I’ve learned the difference is that the “low clearance” stoves are really those with a steel firebox and cast iron jacket. I. ER you don’t quite feel the nice radiant heat from them, but I’m sure they still heat the room just fine.

I’m looking to draft it 2 stories, so presumably they shouldn’t be an issue. I have double wall 8” chimney from my current ZC fireplace Is like to re-use. Technically it’s only rated for the ZC fireplace it’s made for, but I noticed that Fireplace Extrodinaire rates their Elite fireplaces to work with this chimney, so I’m betting it will work with other stoves.

 

[SpaceBus]

I wouldn't recommend you to use an 8" liner for a stove requiring a 6" liner. My flue is a masonry tile liner and is a little bit smaller than 8"x8" square but my stove has a 6" flue outlet. This does me no favors and I will be changing to a 6" insulated liner next winter along with double wall stove pipe before the liner instead of the single wall I'm using now.

 

[begreen]

I’m looking to draft it 2 stories, so presumably they shouldn’t be an issue. I have double wall 8” chimney from my current ZC fireplace Is like to re-use. Technically it’s only rated for the ZC fireplace it’s made for, but I noticed that Fireplace Extrodinaire rates their Elite fireplaces to work with this chimney, so I’m betting it will work with other stoves.

You'll need the exact brand and model chimney pipe to see if it qualifies. A lot does not due to lower temp rating.