Adding a small wood stove to a 1970s brick chimney that has a capped hole and platform for stove

[SpaceBus]

I was thinking of the 7110 or at least the 1410 to afford a bit of a fire view without poking into the room.

Indeed, but I assumed the OP would need at least some kind of hearth extension to make either work.

 

[Jeff15]

That sounds great! I'll contact the sweep again. He gave me a quote over email based on photos to install a separate pipe, it was about 3k for parts and labor. Since this is a rental house for now, that would be silly. And also given that, I'd prefer to keep costs low and not modify/extend the hearth. The 1440 squirrel looks perfect at only 14" deep... I wouldn't have to extend the hearth.
Very excited this project has life again

 

[SpaceBus]

That sounds great! I'll contact the sweep again. He gave me a quote over email based on photos to install a separate pipe, it was about 3k for parts and labor. Since this is a rental house for now, that would be silly. And also given that, I'd prefer to keep costs low and not modify/extend the hearth. The 1440 squirrel looks perfect at only 14" deep... I wouldn't have to extend the hearth.
Very excited this project has life again

Well, double check the front clearance in the manual, because it likely extends out beyond the front of the stove. You may just need some kind of non combustible floor covering (aka ember protection).

 

[begreen]

The 1440 squirrel looks perfect at only 14" deep... I wouldn't have to extend the hearth.

Measure twice to include the stove clearance and hearth requirements. The hearth needs to extend 16" in front of the stove door.

 

[Jeff15]

Measure twice to include the stove clearance and hearth requirements. The hearth needs to extend 16" in front of the stove door.

Hmm the manual doesn't mention any clearances in front of the stove... just for the sides and rear?

(broken link removed to https://morsoe.com/media/com_hikashop/upload/safe/72144600_-_1410-1440_ds-en_uk.pdf)

 

[SpaceBus]

Odd, I see that as well, and I even checked the Morso US website and there are no listed clearances for the front. I would say the 700mm general clearance to furniture is a good guideline, but still seems a bit far for the front clearance.

 

[Jeff15]

Hmm... yeah hopefully just a fire-mat would suffice, but I'll leave that to the sweep

I'm still confused how having 3 flues helps me... there are 3 existing appliances (2 open fireplaces and bbq/smoker) and my understanding is that appliances can't share a flue.

ok so I've determined so far that the upstairs fireplace is the middle flue. I can check the smoker later tonight (not my area), but I won't be able to check the downstairs fireplace (though I bet that's the other larger flue)

 

[Jeff15]

Christmas miracle! I think I found a 4th flue. It's super dark in there... but I ran a tape measure from the smoker up to the chimney, and found that it exits on the far end, not in the smaller raised flue. So this is now my best guess... fingers crossed the smaller raised flue is unused and hooked up to the capped wood stove pipe?


As a final check I could remove the cap for the wood stove (it's held in by mortar) and run a tape through there to see if it goes through #3?

 

[SpaceBus]

Christmas miracle! I think I found a 4th flue. It's super dark in there... but I ran a tape measure from the smoker up to the chimney, and found that it exits on the far end, not in the smaller raised flue. So this is now my best guess... fingers crossed the smaller raised flue is unused and hooked up to the capped wood stove pipe?
View attachment 270121

As a final check I could remove the cap for the wood stove (it's held in by mortar) and run a tape through there to see if it goes through #3?

I'm sure it would not be difficult to replace the cap if you have a tube of furnace cement on hand(or whatever @begreen suggests) if the cap opens to the smoker flue.

 

[Jeff15]

I stopped by a local wood stove shop.. the Morso's are not available until Feb due to production delays. She showed me a PE stove that looked alright, and those are more readily available.
She also showed me an unreleased Jotul that would be perfect.. only 14.5" inches deep, 16" logs, and a larger viewing window. dang I should have taken pictures of her catalog. But it hasn't even gone through testing yet so TBD unknown

 

[SpaceBus]

I stopped by a local wood stove shop.. the Morso's are not available until Feb due to production delays. She showed me a PE stove that looked alright, and those are more readily available.
She also showed me an unreleased Jotul that would be perfect.. only 14.5" inches deep, 16" logs, and a larger viewing window. dang I should have taken pictures of her catalog. But it hasn't even gone through testing yet so TBD unknown

Did you ask about the Jotul 602? It could be a nice fit. It's smaller than the Morso 2b.

 

[Jeff15]

Did you ask about the Jotul 602? It could be a nice fit. It's smaller than the Morso 2b.

I didn't, because its 21.5" deep. I want to stay within the 17" mark so all I might have to do is lay down a fire mat or something for interim until I own the house. I don't want to mess with getting approval or paying to modify someone else's hearth

Seems like all the manufacturers are working on getting their existing stoves EPA 2020 tested. Jotul only lists 5 models on their site, but they definitely make a ton more models than that.

The Morso 1410 is $1200 and probably worth the wait until Feb. I don't see any other viable stoves. I suppose the only other option would be a private sale to work around the EPA 2020

 

[SpaceBus]

I didn't, because its 21.5" deep. I want to stay within the 17" mark so all I might have to do is lay down a fire mat or something for interim until I own the house. I don't want to mess with getting approval or paying to modify someone else's hearth

Seems like all the manufacturers are working on getting their existing stoves EPA 2020 tested. Jotul only lists 5 models on their site, but they definitely make a ton more models than that.

The Morso 1410 is $1200 and probably worth the wait until Feb. I don't see any other viable stoves. I suppose the only other option would be a private sale to work around the EPA 2020

I love the 1410, but it takes very short firewood, so you will most likely have to process it yourself or buy compressed sawdust Bio bricks if you are buying firewood. I suggested the 2b and 602 because you could place them on the hearth with the door facing the wall and likely not need to do any modification. Later you can extend the heart and turn the stove to face the room. These stoves started out over 100 years ago and didn't have glass doors and were typically mounted the way I am describing so they could just sit in front of a fireplace, or you could turn them 90 degrees and have the flue outlet go right up into the fireplace flue.

 

[Jeff15]

I love the 1410, but it takes very short firewood, so you will most likely have to process it yourself or buy compressed sawdust Bio bricks if you are buying firewood. I suggested the 2b and 602 because you could place them on the hearth with the door facing the wall and likely not need to do any modification. Later you can extend the heart and turn the stove to face the room. These stoves started out over 100 years ago and didn't have glass doors and were typically mounted the way I am describing so they could just sit in front of a fireplace, or you could turn them 90 degrees and have the flue outlet go right up into the fireplace flue.

Good point on turning it sideways. I will consider that. A stove that is readily available would be a plus, but I think Jotul's have the same delay as the Morsoes.

Log size is something to consider for sure. Honestly, I enjoy cutting and processing wood, so I don't mind. it's one of the reasons I want a little wood stove... gives me more things to do out by the wood pile! This whole project does not have a ton of practical heating use, it's an upstairs room in the corner of a house... but the idea is that I will spend most of the day in there working, so only need to heat a little space. The fireplace does pretty well, but I'm almost 2 cords deep after only 2 and a half months.

 

[SpaceBus]

Good point on turning it sideways. I will consider that. A stove that is readily available would be a plus, but I think Jotul's have the same delay as the Morsoes.

Log size is something to consider for sure. Honestly, I enjoy cutting and processing wood, so I don't mind. it's one of the reasons I want a little wood stove... gives me more things to do out by the wood pile! This whole project does not have a ton of practical heating use, it's an upstairs room in the corner of a house... but the idea is that I will spend most of the day in there working, so only need to heat a little space. The fireplace does pretty well, but I'm almost 2 cords deep after only 2 and a half months.

If it is an open masonry fireplace then you are operating at a net loss in heat. The fireplace will actively draw heated air out of the house.

 

[Jeff15]

If it is an open masonry fireplace then you are operating at a net loss in heat. The fireplace will actively draw heated air out of the house.

It is an open masonry fireplace, but I don't understand. If I don't start up the fire, the temp is around 58F (I don't control the central heat). I start the fire and get it running, now it's a comfortable 70-73F from 10 feet away, and 68-70 in the rest of the room.

 

[SpaceBus]

It is an open masonry fireplace, but I don't understand. If I don't start up the fire, the temp is around 58F (I don't control the central heat). I start the fire and get it running, now it's a comfortable 70-73F from 10 feet away, and 68-70 in the rest of the room.

Because the fire pulls heated air out of the house and up the chimney. While the fire is hot the room it is in will feel warm, but it will cool down rapidly when the fire dies down. When the flue damper is open the warm room air is constantly flowing up the chimney, and you can't close the flue damper until the fire is 100% out. Open fireplaces are a net heat loss when in use.

 

[Jeff15]

Because the fire pulls heated air out of the house and up the chimney. While the fire is hot the room it is in will feel warm, but it will cool down rapidly when the fire dies down. When the flue damper is open the warm room air is constantly flowing up the chimney, and you can't close the flue damper until the fire is 100% out. Open fireplaces are a net heat loss when in use.

Ah, I see. Well it's been keeping me warm, that's what counts

Do you think a larger stove like the 602 would be too much heat? I'm afraid that little room would get too hot and it would be difficult/ineffective to try and circulate heat to the rest of the upstairs. So I'm better off with a little stove like the 1410 with it's sole purpose of ambiance and heating just that room.

 

[SpaceBus]

Ah, I see. Well it's been keeping me warm, that's what counts

Do you think a larger stove like the 602 would be too much heat? I'm afraid that little room would get too hot and it would be difficult/ineffective to try and circulate heat to the rest of the upstairs. So I'm better off with a little stove like the 1410 with it's sole purpose of ambiance and heating just that room.

They would probably be about the same output to be honest, and depending on the room it might be too much heat. Do you have a lot of windows? One fire in the morning would probably be all that is needed.

That big fireplace is going to consume tons of wood and still leave your house cold. If you do buy the house then a full liner in the chimney and a modern insert or wood stove would heat the whole house and use around 75% less wood, but it will have to be really dry. Like 20% moisture content or less dry, and most living trees are at least half water when cut.

 

[Jeff15]

They would probably be about the same output to be honest, and depending on the room it might be too much heat. Do you have a lot of windows? One fire in the morning would probably be all that is needed.

That big fireplace is going to consume tons of wood and still leave your house cold. If you do buy the house then a full liner in the chimney and a modern insert or wood stove would heat the whole house and use around 75% less wood, but it will have to be really dry. Like 20% moisture content or less dry, and most living trees are at least half water when cut.

One window on the opposite end currently. I'd love to add a gable dormer and/or skylight to open up the room a bit, like I said it's quite small, 12x12 with only the middle ~5 ft of the room you can stand up in.

An insert would be practical if I want to heat with it. I'll probably do that to the downstairs fireplace and keep the upstairs one for ambiance. Yeah I've been burning 10-15% almond and eucalyptus. The almond for heat and the eucky for fun.

 

[SpaceBus]

Both are extremely dense woods and about the best you can find. I would love to come across such wood here! The insert will require a full liner, from the insert outlet to the top of the chimney. This does require cutting of the damper area, so not sure if that is necessarily an option for you right now.

I also think that even a 602, which is a bit smaller than a 2b, might overpower your loft space. Maybe something like a pellet stove or small propane heater would be better.

 

[begreen]

I love the 1410, but it takes very short firewood, so you will most likely have to process it yourself or buy compressed sawdust Bio bricks if you are buying firewood. I suggested the 2b and 602 because you could place them on the hearth with the door facing the wall and likely not need to do any modification.

This is why I suggested the Morso 7110. At 1 cu ft it is a tad smaller than the Jotul F3CB, but at least it takes 16" wood. The Jotul 602, Morso 2B, VC Aspen c3, would all need to sit sideways on the hearth, and that's only if clearances work out. The 1410 or 1440 are small and burn kindling, but they would provide the ambiance and small heat that is asked for.

If you can find a used Jotul F100 Nordic or a Hampton H200, they would also be worth considering. Is there anything else on this floor that could use some extra heat?

 

[Jeff15]

I want to burn cordwood for sure.

I'd love a used F100 if I could find one!

Here's a sketch... the living room (where the fireplace is) and the bedroom could use heat for sure, but getting heat to the bedroom seems impractical.
Not to scale... the living is about 2x the size of the stove room

Would you use an installer who isn't NFI certified? I found one, but it might be moot anyway as the landlord wants someone certified.

 

[begreen]

To relieve overheating of the office room put a table fan set to low speed, on the living room floor and blow cooler air in from the Living Room.