New P43 install, smoke smell, normal?

[76brian]

Hey folks, I'm new here but I'm the proud new owner of a Harman P43 pellet stove. My propane furnace gave up, so rather than pay a fortune (and a huge mess of my house, long story) to have it replaced right now, I decided to get this. It will be the main heat source in my small 900 sq foot home in Eastern Ontario.

The stove works awesome, it fires a ton of heat. I'm actually looking forward to some colder weather to see how it does.

One problem so far. When it first fires up, or when it's running really low and then I crank it up, I can smell smoke for a bit. There doesn't appear to be any smoke in the room, just an odor. Smells just like someone left a board in one place too long while making a cut with a table saw or something. Is this smell normal? I don't mind the smell at all, I just want to be sure I'm not going to be slowly poisoned with CO or something.

I should add that it was a self install, but it was done well. All joints are caulked with high temp silicone, and taped. The 4" vent pipe goes from a T on the back of the stove, up 5ft to a 90, horizontal for 18" to another T at the base of an existing chimney, then there's 15ft of vertical to go about 3ft above the roof. It draws extremely well, before sliding the stove in place I could feel a bit of a vacuum on the end of the pipe (maybe this isn't a good thing for efficiency? I dunno, but the house is 100 years old. It's reasonably sealed, but there's bound to be some leaks). My profile pic shows the install. I am not using an outside air kit, but I'm not opposed to installing one.

So, is the smoke smell when starting or being cranked up a normal thing, or no?

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

If it is a wood smoke smell you have a leak in the exhaust system. You need to find and seal it. It is not normal nor is it safe.

The usual spot for such things is at the stove adapter.

 

[DAKSY]

If it is a wood smoke smell you have a leak in the exhaust system. You need to find and seal it. It is not normal nor is it safe.

The usual spot for such things is at the stove adapter.

X2

 

[76brian]

Thanks for the fast replies!

That's the only piece I didn't use silicone on (in case I needed to move the stove), but it is taped. I'll double check it tonight.

 

[Delta-T]

I am no fan of the tape. I'm pretty sure most of the pipe manufacturers say to use silicone.

 

[PJPellet]

I have a P43 too, mine leaked at the stove adapter until I sealed it with high temp silicon.

 

[76brian]

Thanks guys.

Any idea why I'm only smelling it when it's first starting to fire up?

 

[kykel]

When first lighting you will notice smoke in burnpot until pellets light. thats when you will smell it most.once pellets light it a clean burn

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

When first lighting you will notice smoke in burnpot until pellets light. thats when you will smell it most.once pellets light it a clean burn

Even if the smell goes away after the fire is going doesn't mean it isn't a safety hazard as there are exhaust components that do not have a smell CO is one and it can and does kill.

 

[gfreek]

Silicone the adapter....Did the dealer do a pre burn??

 

[76brian]

Negative on the pre-burn. I took it out of the crate myself. Smelled a bit of paint getting hot, but nothing major. No smoke.

 

[checkthisout]

If you turn off all the lights in the room at night and use an LED flashlight, I bet you will be able to see smoke somewhere along the exhaust while the stove is starting.

Did you silicone the inner liner of the pipe or just the outer?

 

[76brian]

Did you silicone the inner liner of the pipe or just the outer?

The pipe I used also has a rubber gasket, I ran a bead around that before I put each one together. I was pretty thorough with the whole thing.

 

[checkthisout]

Did you silicone the inner liner of the pipe or just the outer?

The pipe I used also has a rubber gasket, I ran a bead around that before I put each one together. I was pretty thorough with the whole thing.

No silicone is required on that style of piping which really leaves only the appliance adapter.

If you don't see any visible leakage using my or others tecniques then it's also possible that smoke is simply blowing back into your house from the outside through air leaks in the walls and such. No big deal.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

While we are discussing sealing stuff, did you seal around the pipe at the outside thimble?

 

[76brian]

The smoke is definitely coming from behind the stove near the floor. I just can't exactly tell if it's the connection at the stove or if it's the T. It looks very much like it could be where the 3" horizontal pipe meats the 4" vertical pipe, right in the inside of the corner.

I'm having this inspected tomorrow for home insurance. I'm sure there's no fire risk , but they aren't going to like smoke I'm sure.

While we are discussing sealing stuff, did you seal around the pipe at the outside thimble?

No, nobody said anything about that. Should I?

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

The smoke is definitely coming from behind the stove near the floor. I just can't exactly tell if it's the connection at the stove or if it's the T. It looks very much like it could be where the 3" horizontal pipe meats the 4" vertical pipe, right in the inside of the corner.

I'm having this inspected tomorrow for home insurance. I'm sure there's no fire risk , but they aren't going to like smoke I'm sure.

While we are discussing sealing stuff, did you seal around the pipe at the outside thimble?

No, nobody said anything about that. Should I?

The ring around the pipe at the thimble(outside) must be sealed. This is likely the closest point of entry for smoke and other nasties from the outside exhaust.

While we are discussing this installation how about telling us the distances from the exhaust termination to the nearest window and door that can be opened. A picture would be best so we can see where the end of the vent is in relation to the window and door.

 

[gfreek]

I should add that it was a self install, but it was done well. All joints are caulked with high temp silicone, and taped. The 4†vent pipe goes from a T on the back of the stove, up 5ft to a 90, horizontal for 18†to another T at the base of an existing chimney, then there’s 15ft of vertical to go about 3ft above the roof.

It exits above the roof. I assume single story. Could the joints on tee be leaking?? Here the stove need not be running for inspection. Going to be warm here again tomorrow. Be sure you have CO detectors.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

I should add that it was a self install, but it was done well. All joints are caulked with high temp silicone, and taped. The 4†vent pipe goes from a T on the back of the stove, up 5ft to a 90, horizontal for 18†to another T at the base of an existing chimney, then there’s 15ft of vertical to go about 3ft above the roof.

It exits above the roof. I assume single story. Could the joints on tee be leaking?? Here the stove need not be running for inspection. Going to be warm here again tomorrow. Be sure you have CO detectors.

Ok was thinking we went through the wall, my blunder.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

If that lower tee is under a lot of stress the saddle could present a problem.

It is common to silicone the saddle joint (where the two pipes meet on the tee). You have two of them in that setup.

The access cap is pretty good at maintaining a seal provided you don't go heavy handed attaching it or cut into the seal gasket.

 

[76brian]

There's no risk of smoke entering the lower floor of the house (where the stove is) from the outside exhaust. The cap of the chimney is 25 feet in the air, 3 feet or so above the roof as stated in my first post.

First pic is the back of the stove

Second pic is thimble inside

Third is thimble outside, which is actually inside an old woodshed/workshop on the back of my house

(There are no joints inside the thimble)

Fourth is a crop of an old pic of the back of the house, you can see the chimney. What you see is an 8" OD exhaust for a gas or propane stove. That cap was removed and the 4" pellet vent runs all the way up through the 8" pipe and sticks out the top by about a foot, with the proper cap on top.

Edit, ok my pic order got reversed but you'll get the idea.

 

[PJPellet]

Hey is that an antenna farm I see? de k2pjw -.-. --.-

 

[76brian]

Indeed it is!

-.. . ...- .- ...-- -.. -..- ...-

Any other hams on here?

Hams have to love pellet stoves.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

You have three likely spots the tee cap, the tee saddle joint, and the stove adapter.

Except for the stove adapter you can eliminate them one at a time with the tape.

Hopefully there aren't any screws that are piercing the inner pipe.

 

[76brian]

Nope, I made sure to get screws short enough that they wouldn't. I can take the cap off the tee on the outside wall and look up, the inside of the pipe isn't even deformed from the screw tip.

Ok, so I'll shut the stove down in a bit, and once it cools down I'll tape the cap, silicone around the saddle joint and the stove adapter. Inspector will be here tomorrow evening when I get home from work, so hopefully that will fix it.

Thanks for the quick replies and great help. This forums seem to be a really good resource, I think I'll stick around.