55 to 60 cc chainsaw opinions

[woodhog73]

He said peak power. Which is @ 10,200 on your 2172 according to specs.

Ok good point I was thinking wide open tuning unloaded. Still on my 2172 I tune it to 12,500 and it doesn't drop much in the cut. Certainly doesn't drop 2,000 rpm.

Just seems to me on a 6100 it should be making peak power higher than 10,000 rpm. But I'm not a saw builder or anything just my gut impression. I've run a 6100 a fair amount although I don't own one and haven't tuned one, but in the cut it seems to be running faster than 10k but who knows.

 

[gerry100]

Keeping your chain sharp is critical

+++1

a sharp. chain on my Stihl 026 adds feels like added power, also decreases WOT time so a tank of fuel cuts more wood

 

[CTYank]

10,000 rpm seems way too low. Should be couple thousand rpm higher than that. Have you put a tach on it and tuned it ? If all your getting is 10,000 rpm your missing a good amount of power. Since that saw is non auto tune you can actually tune it and if it's seeing use in both winter and summer climates will have to tune it ( for optimal performance) so I'd double check your tuning. There's no way I'd ever be happy with that saw only spinning 10,000 rpm.

My Jonsered 2166/2172 which is a 70cc pro saw I tune it to roughly 12,500 rpm. My ported 50cc pro saw spins dam near 15,000 rpm.

10k seems way low rpm for that saw. Older saws from 30 or 40 years ago that would sound about right but not on a modern pro 60cc saw.

That's not what I said: peak power at 10k. Peak power is where it's at, under load, not spinning wildly unloaded. And, IMO it's crazy to "tune" a saw with a tach, when what's important is the AFR @WOT under load. That really can't be checked/set with a tach, but an ear will do the job nicely. That makes it easy to check carb adjustment and adjust it to track atmospheric changes.

And my 576 peaks at 9600, which is plenty to get my juices flowing, spitting chips.

Spinning a recip way above the usable power-band puts large stresses on piston skirts, something I don't do, thanks. Longevity a big PLUS.

 

[woodhog73]

And, IMO it's crazy to "tune" a saw with a tach, when what's important is the AFR @WOT under load. That really can't be checked/set with a tach, but an ear will do the job

I guess it comes down to how good your ear is. I trust my ear when tuning to a certain degree but then I still use my tach. But I'll admit I don't always trust my ear. That's just me though.

But this is why I like my auto tune and mtronic saws. I've got a few older saws that don't have that technology and that's fine. But for me personally give me the auto tune any day of the week. Just this past weekend I was running my 2172 and it was fairly warm out. I thought it's just not what I remembered and sure enough I retuned it. Me mtronic saw just pulled the cord and it was perfect on the 1st cut.

Just my opinion

 

[Jon1270]

what's important is the AFR @WOT

I suspect I agree with this, but I'm not sure because I can't figure out what AFR stands for.

 

[CTYank]

I suspect I agree with this, but I'm not sure because I can't figure out what AFR stands for.

Given that it's associated with carb adjustment/overall engine running, I thought it obvious: air/fuel ratio. Target: 12.5:1 mass ratio.

 

[CTYank]

I guess it comes down to how good your ear is. I trust my ear when tuning to a certain degree but then I still use my tach. But I'll admit I don't always trust my ear. That's just me though.

But this is why I like my auto tune and mtronic saws. I've got a few older saws that don't have that technology and that's fine. But for me personally give me the auto tune any day of the week. Just this past weekend I was running my 2172 and it was fairly warm out. I thought it's just not what I remembered and sure enough I retuned it. Me mtronic saw just pulled the cord and it was perfect on the 1st cut.

Just my opinion

I find it pretty easy to differentiate clean, single-note 2-stroking from the partial misfiring of "4-stroking". With non-AutoTune saws, if in doubt, or weather change, I'll routinely check carb adjustment, after a few cuts to warm things up properly, by lifting slightly in a cut. Takes a second or two to check things. Much preferable to melting some aluminum. Yes, I like the AutoTune on the 576, for the occasions where I get to use it on wood big enough to make it work. The engine covers just look funny, to me, with no access to adjust carb for mixture or idle speed. Great insurance policy!

 

[woodhog73]

My only fear with auto tune is if and when someday it decides it's tired of being accurate and incorrectly adjusts the fuel / air to the point of being lean enough to cause damage.

Hopefully I will be able to detect that and shut it down before hand. There's been a few times I've thought my auto tune Jonsered was running slightly lean but within a minute it seems to self adjust. The spark plug looks tan colored so I've assumed all is ok I guess.

 

[Jon1270]

Autotune devices certainly can and do fail at times, but statistically I bet they fail less often than human users. Also, if an air leak develops and causes the saw to run so lean that it can't be adjusted out, Autotune has the potential to prevent engine damage by simply shutting the saw down completely. Again, the computer is likely to be more vigilant than most operators. There have been problems with air bags and antilock brakes, too, but they are exceptions that prove the rule.

 

[VAfarmer38]

I bought the CS-590 (Echo Timberwolf) about 2-3 years ago and haven't looked back. I upgraded the bar to an Oregon Armor Tip (200ATMD176) and the chain I use is an Oregon Super 70 (72LPX070G). I even went and bought the smaller CS-310 for light limbing work. IMO, you cannot beat the price of the Timberwolf. I also own a Stihl 025 but rarely use it anymore.

 

[mcdougy]

I'm very happy with my bone stock Dolmar 6100 cutting the hard woods in this part of ontario.

 

[CTYank]

I'm very happy with my bone stock Dolmar 6100 cutting the hard woods in this part of ontario.

Ditto that. I just can't figure why some folks pay big bux to someone in a backyard workshop to tweak their saw(s) for more, especially with a saw like a 6100. That kind of power, measured in excess of 4.6 hp @ 600' elevation, and low-toxicity air in its vicinity, sure does it for me. IMO, there's a lot more to be said for durability than a "flash in the pan".
Have you tried a 24" bar yet? Mine sure seems happy with one, in any sort of wood. Where it can be put to good use, of course. Helps to be able to keep the engine under proper load/speed, without feathering throttle.

 

[mcdougy]

Ditto that. I just can't figure why some folks pay big bux to someone in a backyard workshop to tweak their saw(s) for more, especially with a saw like a 6100. That kind of power, measured in excess of 4.6 hp @ 600' elevation, and low-toxicity air in its vicinity, sure does it for me. IMO, there's a lot more to be said for durability than a "flash in the pan".
Have you tried a 24" bar yet? Mine sure seems happy with one, in any sort of wood. Where it can be put to good use, of course. Helps to be able to keep the engine under proper load/speed, without feathering throttle.

I have not tried a 24" bar. My saw is a bit unusual as it came from dealer with the .325 sprocket and chain on a 20" bar. I had never ran the .325 and was willing to try it out. The semi chisel works hard for a long time.....but I think I will buy a sprocket and 24" bar as well, because there is not many .325 24" bars that I have found. Do u have a bar that your liking on your saw?

 

[MaintenanceMan]

I bought the CS-590 (Echo Timberwolf) about 2-3 years ago and haven't looked back. I upgraded the bar to an Oregon Armor Tip (200ATMD176) and the chain I use is an Oregon Super 70 (72LPX070G). I even went and bought the smaller CS-310 for light limbing work. IMO, you cannot beat the price of the Timberwolf. I also own a Stihl 025 but rarely use it anymore.

Same here. I got the CS590 a few years back and couldn't be happier. I did score a new Stihl 271, but have not touched a piece of wood with it yet.

 

[Fishnuts2]

I'll chime in with what most of the others have stated.
Get the 590 and go cut wood like never before. You'll have a good 2 saw plan to tackle most anything you might come across. I'd recommend buying from a dealer that will tune it for you initially though unless you're skilled at it. There are quite a few tuning vids on YouTube with a 590 that you can follow.


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[jetsam]

I don't think the dealer is going to bore out the muffler for you.

I don't know about the 590, but my little Echo limbing saw was a whole new machine with an unobstructed airway and a retuned carb.

(Screw a drywall screw into the limiter caps just until the threads bite, pull 'em out, shave the tabs off the sides of the caps, tune the saw, and put 'em back to help keep crud from getting in.)

 

[Fishnuts2]

I wasn't about to tell someone to drill the muffler on a new saw. He can figure that out for himself after doing a little research.


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[CTYank]

I have not tried a 24" bar. My saw is a bit unusual as it came from dealer with the .325 sprocket and chain on a 20" bar. I had never ran the .325 and was willing to try it out. The semi chisel works hard for a long time.....but I think I will buy a sprocket and 24" bar as well, because there is not many .325 24" bars that I have found. Do u have a bar that your liking on your saw?

Yeah, that's one big plus with rim-drive. Different rim-sprocket and bar (nose-sprocket) and just mount the chain. To KISS with the various saws here, I stick with 3/8" and 3/8" LP. I run a 24" Oregon "Power-Match" bar on the 6100, which works just fine. I'm not looking for a few milligrams' weight saving on a bar. Good prices avail from Frawley's (Oregon) www.loggerchain.com or Bailey's- Frawley's is much quicker turnaround.
I'll second that motion re semi-chisel. Just got to wear out (slowly) a fistful of loops of full-chisel before I spin up some semi-chisel. Even in clean wood, I find I need to touch up a full-chisel chain (with Granberg clamp-on guide) every other fillup. Saves having the chain make the abrupt transition to dust-maker. Happy chips!

 

[jetsam]

You only need to mod the muffler if you want more power out of the saw. It voids your warranty, and you could actually fry the motor if you just mod the muffler without tuning the carburator. (Any engine can run too hot if it's too lean, but a 2-stroke engine is getting less lubricant than it needs on top of being too hot, which is an unpleasant double whammy.)

My Echo was a good saw without modifications, too

 

[Catfish Hunter]

I'd get a Dolmar 5105, this saw could easily handle your two cords of oak and make pretty good time of it. I guess it might be a blue saw by now (Makita). Otherwise if you don't like Dolmar perhaps the 550xp? I'm sure Stihl makes a good saw that size too. So many options, so little time...

 

[max384]

Thanks everyone for all of the replies.

I ended up deciding on the Echo CS-590. I just ordered it last week, and it will be delivered on Wednesday. I'm pretty excited to give it a try... and I'm behind on my firewood for the year (well for next year, as I have a 2 year rotation). I'll keep the thread updated on how I like it once I start cutting!

 

[WoodyIsGoody]

Opinions are all over the map.

To the original poster if money is no object in that class how about the Husky 562xp or sister company Jonsered 2260. Lighter than the Stihl ms362, more RPMs, and you actually get a metal handle bar instead of plastic.

It might be counter-intuitive, but the plastic handle on the Stihl pro saws is higher performance than the metal handles that come on cheaper saws. It's fiber-reinforced and costs more to make than simply bending a metal pipe. It's lighter, absorbs more vibrations and doesn't transmit hot/cold as much as metal. The end result is you can cut more wood with less fatigue. I'm sure it could be broken but it wouldn't be easy to do.

I would never go back to metal handles. They're inferior. They exist because, especially at low saw volumes, it's prohibitively expensive to produce fiber reinforced plastic handles.

 

[beatlefan]

I have a Husqvarna Rancher 455 that I've had for several years. I also just bought an Echo CS-590 a couple months ago. Both good saws, but I like the Echo better.

 

[sportbikerider78]

Thanks everyone for all of the replies.

I ended up deciding on the Echo CS-590. I just ordered it last week, and it will be delivered on Wednesday. I'm pretty excited to give it a try... and I'm behind on my firewood for the year (well for next year, as I have a 2 year rotation). I'll keep the thread updated on how I like it once I start cutting!

I got one. I love it.

Between that and a cheap 14" Poulan for limbing...I have a good combo.

 

[WoodyIsGoody]

Autotune devices certainly can and do fail at times, but statistically I bet they fail less often than human users. Also, if an air leak develops and causes the saw to run so lean that it can't be adjusted out, Autotune has the potential to prevent engine damage by simply shutting the saw down completely. Again, the computer is likely to be more vigilant than most operators. There have been problems with air bags and antilock brakes, too, but they are exceptions that prove the rule.

Very good points. I'm not afraid of Auto-tune at all. It is a very simple and robust system that has been used successfully for many years. And, unlike the complex FI systems in cars, Auto-tune saws do not rely on sensors that can drift out of calibration or become fouled by exhaust gasses. It's a very simple rpm based system using a solid state timing sensor as the primary input. The big advantage of Auto-tune systems is that it can dynamically adjust not only the fuel mixture but also the timing advance.

This can give a 50cc saw the power of a 55cc-60cc saw while making it start effortless and idle perfectly. I still like my old school Stihl 026 but the M-tronic 261 C-M is the better saw in almost every respect. The 026 was the pinnacle of 50cc saws before Auto-tune in terms or durability, cutting power and robustness but I expect the 261 C-M to last longer due to it's ability to always be in tune regardless of fuel quality, temperature or altitude.

It doesn't adjust for altitude or fuel quality or temperature by measuring those things, it adjusts the same way a human would only it does it hundreds of times faster and can measure small changes in rpm much more accurately than your ear. It only takes itself a fraction of a second so it's constantly checking it's state of tune. It adjusts as wood chips build up on your air filter or the humidity changes and it has a much wider range of fueling adjustment than the mixture screws on my 20 year old 026 allow. It will even adjust automatically for muffler/intake mods. Non-auto tune saws are rated for HP when tuned perfectly. An auto-tune saw is always in perfect tune.

At 4.0 HP and only 10.8 lbs., there's not a lot to dislike.