2020-21 Blaze King Performance Thread (Everything BK)

[JKanor]

@Highbeam When you ran the metal combustor in your princess, you said it had a shorter lifespan. Are we talking like half the life of a ceramic or maybe a season? Also with more years experience now, was there anything you did differently that could have lengthened the metal ones life?

I'm still on the fence to grab a metal one or wait out the ceramics. Availability is now looking like late Dec or early January for a ceramic one.

 

[Highbeam]

@Highbeam When you ran the metal combustor in your princess, you said it had a shorter lifespan. Are we talking like half the life of a ceramic or maybe a season? Also with more years experience now, was there anything you did differently that could have lengthened the metal ones life?

I'm still on the fence to grab a metal one or wait out the ceramics. Availability is now looking like late Dec or early January for a ceramic one.

I have attached my records. I burn 9 months of the year but the first and last months we go part time so I count those as half months. The number on the right is full months of heat.

The metal cat costs more, lasts less time, other people have clogging issues, and I noticed no real life performance difference but it did work well while it worked.

Second photo is the last two cats I pulled out including the metal one. No cracks or other signs of thermal shock on my cats.

I burn this stove on low/medium pretty much all the time with no flames so the cat is doing the work.

Sorry about the scary shadow on the dead cat photos. That’s just me holding my phone.

 

[Diabel]

I have not kept any stats like that for my cats. It would be hard since I move around a lot. I do keep similar stats for my winter/summer wheels, water filters and furnace filters. My wife thinks I need medical help.

 

[JKanor]

I have attached my records. I burn 9 months of the year but the first and last months we go part time so I count those as half months. The number on the right is full months of heat.

The metal cat costs more, lasts less time, other people have clogging issues, and I noticed no real life performance difference but it did work well while it worked.

Second photo is the last two cats I pulled out including the metal one. No cracks or other signs of thermal shock on my cats.

I burn this stove on low/medium pretty much all the time with no flames so the cat is doing the work. View attachment 269074View attachment 269075

Sorry about the scary shadow on the dead cat photos. That’s just me holding my phone.

Damn, thats pretty significant. I burn almost steady from mid December to early/mid March here. So thats a couple year difference for me. My curiosity has my wanting to try it, but my reasonable side is saying to wait lol. Thank you though.

 

[Highbeam]

Damn, thats pretty significant. I burn almost steady from mid December to early/mid March here. So thats a couple year difference for me. My curiosity has my wanting to try it, but my reasonable side is saying to wait lol. Thank you though.

Could have been a fluke too. I even did a full vinegar boil on that steel cat trying to get more life out of it.

 

[MissMac]

thanks all - i'd like to tape a bag to the telescopic pipe this time round. my usual is to vacuum out the bypass chamber like @Highbeam and others, but i don't like the mess it makes in there, and i don't like having to vacuum the bypass gasket. this year i was thinking of trying something like what @kennyp2339 does, to avoid the mess in the stove.

 

[Highbeam]

thanks all - i'd like to tape a bag to the telescopic pipe this time round. my usual is to vacuum out the bypass chamber like @Highbeam and others, but i don't like the mess it makes in there, and i don't like having to vacuum the bypass gasket. this year i was thinking of trying something like what @kennyp2339 does, to avoid the mess in the stove.

Crap constantly flakes off and falls down into the cat chamber during regular use from the chimney. I make it a habit to sweep the gasket off by hand from below before I load a cool stove. So, it’s nice to clean it out.

 

[Diabel]

Crap constantly flakes off and falls down into the cat chamber during regular use from the chimney. I make it a habit to sweep the gasket off by hand from below before I load a cool stove. So, it’s nice to clean it out.

I am trying to grasp it. You just stick your hand via the bypass and reach back to the other side of the cat?

 

[Highbeam]

I am trying to grasp it. You just stick your hand via the bypass and reach back to the other side of the cat?

I sweep the bypass gasket so just right inside the bypass. Figure, it’s like getting a pine cone stuck under your garage door. If there is junk on that bypass gasket when you flop the bypass plate on it, you either won’t get a good seal or you will grind the carbon chunk into that hard to replace gasket.

 

[Diabel]

Now I get it. Good point, I will start running my fingers across the bypass on cold starts.

 

[stoveliker]

So, short -ahem, not so short- update here. After my initial, dare I say, quite successful (i.e. satisfying) burns when it was 45 F or so outside in the Chinook, I wanted to tackle two problems.
The first was somewhat minor: upon hot reloads, I got some smoke coming out the door when the first of the new splits would catch fire on the coals. To fix that, I was planning to change the stove pipe configuration from 2' double wall up, 90 degree double wall elbow, 2' single wall horizontal (and then thimble thru a concrete wall and masonry chimney with 24-25' external double wall rigid (no "vacuum hose undulations" visible) stainless "top-of-the-line" thick-walled or so I've been told by my sweep - I bought the home with this liner and that sweep did not install it, and other items in the home such as the oil furnace are also the top model of a brand line, so I trust him on that) to all double wall, two 45 degrees minimizing the horizontal run as much as possible.

However, when i tried to start my so far last fire (it's been rather warm here so I've been using the minisplit + solar electrons a lot), it just would not start. It was 35 F outside. Box full of smoke, even newspaper extinguishing before being burned completely. Tried 2 more times, including a 25 F outside temp. Same behavior.

I tried preheating the flue with a propane torch stuck through the open bypass valve. After 1 minute (btw; how long do you guys do this, when you do this?), the torch extinguished. Re-lit, same. This suggests that the CO2 from the torch flame can't get away. Suggesting a blockage.

Took off the vertical stove pipe and elbow, looked inside the cat chamber, vertical pipe. All clear, good.

Had a sweep come by (no access from the bottom, and only a small strip of roof accessible 2.5 stories up b/c of the solar panels - I don't feel comfortable going there...) to see if something had gone wrong; creosote blockage, cap (we had a storm before the last trial), or what have you.
None of that appeared to be the case.

However, looking carefully into the horizontal stove pipe going into the thimble, we could see that the flue in the masonry chimney had dropped by 1.5" or so. This resulted in a slight downward angle of the horizontal stove pipe (hinge-point someplace in the wall).
Clearly that's not good, and likely the cause of the stove not lighting.

I guess I'll have to have someone lift up the flue, and secure it with a top plate so it won't move again.

Question (@bholler ?): does this happen sometimes? Was the liner installed in a poor way? Is it indicative of other issues I might have to (have someone) look at?

This all sucks as I have 17-18% maple waiting for me, it's (off and on so far) heating season on LI, and I am using oil (off and on; I tend to not use the minisplit below 32 F or so) ...
Reputable companies are booked until mid January...
It's a winter different than I had expected; working at home but hoping to have zero heating cost between the wood and the solar electrons. ...

Anyway, hence my silence and absence here and on the "what's in your stove" thread to which I'd hoped to contribute - currently there's a load of unburned maple and sassafras in there, cold and lonely...

 

[bholler]

So, short -ahem, not so short- update here. After my initial, dare I say, quite successful (i.e. satisfying) burns when it was 45 F or so outside in the Chinook, I wanted to tackle two problems.
The first was somewhat minor: upon hot reloads, I got some smoke coming out the door when the first of the new splits would catch fire on the coals. To fix that, I was planning to change the stove pipe configuration from 2' double wall up, 90 degree double wall elbow, 2' single wall horizontal (and then thimble thru a concrete wall and masonry chimney with 24-25' external double wall rigid (no "vacuum hose undulations" visible) stainless "top-of-the-line" thick-walled or so I've been told by my sweep - I bought the home with this liner and that sweep did not install it, and other items in the home such as the oil furnace are also the top model of a brand line, so I trust him on that) to all double wall, two 45 degrees minimizing the horizontal run as much as possible.

However, when i tried to start my so far last fire (it's been rather warm here so I've been using the minisplit + solar electrons a lot), it just would not start. It was 35 F outside. Box full of smoke, even newspaper extinguishing before being burned completely. Tried 2 more times, including a 25 F outside temp. Same behavior.

I tried preheating the flue with a propane torch stuck through the open bypass valve. After 1 minute (btw; how long do you guys do this, when you do this?), the torch extinguished. Re-lit, same. This suggests that the CO2 from the torch flame can't get away. Suggesting a blockage.

Took off the vertical stove pipe and elbow, looked inside the cat chamber, vertical pipe. All clear, good.

Had a sweep come by (no access from the bottom, and only a small strip of roof accessible 2.5 stories up b/c of the solar panels - I don't feel comfortable going there...) to see if something had gone wrong; creosote blockage, cap (we had a storm before the last trial), or what have you.
None of that appeared to be the case.

However, looking carefully into the horizontal stove pipe going into the thimble, we could see that the flue in the masonry chimney had dropped by 1.5" or so. This resulted in a slight downward angle of the horizontal stove pipe (hinge-point someplace in the wall).
Clearly that's not good, and likely the cause of the stove not lighting.

I guess I'll have to have someone lift up the flue, and secure it with a top plate so it won't move again.

Question (@bholler ?): does this happen sometimes? Was the liner installed in a poor way? Is it indicative of other issues I might have to (have someone) look at?

This all sucks as I have 17-18% maple waiting for me, it's (off and on so far) heating season on LI, and I am using oil (off and on; I tend to not use the minisplit below 32 F or so) ...
Reputable companies are booked until mid January...
It's a winter different than I had expected; working at home but hoping to have zero heating cost between the wood and the solar electrons. ...

Anyway, hence my silence and absence here and on the "what's in your stove" thread to which I'd hoped to contribute - currently there's a load of unburned maple and sassafras in there, cold and lonely...

Yes it is a sign of a bad install and it will hurt performance some but I don't think it would be enough on its own to cause the problems you are experiencing

 

[MacinJosh]

I too go through the loading door and right up the bypass and into the flue with my sooteater. Older black rods. Plenty of space to make the gentle bend into the flue. Sweep the whole chimney and remove the tool.

Next, the less fun part, to get every spec of fallen debris out from the cat chamber you should remove the clean connector pipe from the stove top and then poke around with your shop vac hose, close the bypass and suck around some more near the cat. You can get it all out. Then reinstall the connector pipe. It is possible to clean just as well from the firebox but you need to be flexible and it’s just easier to lift the flue.

I do it once per year in spring and also when I change cats because new cats like a clean flue and the dead cat usually mucks things up before getting replaced.

Be very gentle with the small black flue screws. They really aren’t designed for repeated reinstallation and the threads are easy to strip.

Don’t forget to remove your flue probe!

This is exactly what my sweep did, except removing the pipe to get behind the bypass. I’ll remind him of that next time. Or maybe I’ll just start sweeping myself and save the money.

 

[moresnow]

So, short -ahem, not so short- update here. After my initial, dare I say, quite successful (i.e. satisfying) burns when it was 45 F or so outside in the Chinook, I wanted to tackle two problems.
The first was somewhat minor: upon hot reloads, I got some smoke coming out the door when the first of the new splits would catch fire on the coals. To fix that, I was planning to change the stove pipe configuration from 2' double wall up, 90 degree double wall elbow, 2' single wall horizontal (and then thimble thru a concrete wall and masonry chimney with 24-25' external double wall rigid (no "vacuum hose undulations" visible) stainless "top-of-the-line" thick-walled or so I've been told by my sweep - I bought the home with this liner and that sweep did not install it, and other items in the home such as the oil furnace are also the top model of a brand line, so I trust him on that) to all double wall, two 45 degrees minimizing the horizontal run as much as possible.

However, when i tried to start my so far last fire (it's been rather warm here so I've been using the minisplit + solar electrons a lot), it just would not start. It was 35 F outside. Box full of smoke, even newspaper extinguishing before being burned completely. Tried 2 more times, including a 25 F outside temp. Same behavior.

I tried preheating the flue with a propane torch stuck through the open bypass valve. After 1 minute (btw; how long do you guys do this, when you do this?), the torch extinguished. Re-lit, same. This suggests that the CO2 from the torch flame can't get away. Suggesting a blockage.

Took off the vertical stove pipe and elbow, looked inside the cat chamber, vertical pipe. All clear, good.

Had a sweep come by (no access from the bottom, and only a small strip of roof accessible 2.5 stories up b/c of the solar panels - I don't feel comfortable going there...) to see if something had gone wrong; creosote blockage, cap (we had a storm before the last trial), or what have you.
None of that appeared to be the case.

However, looking carefully into the horizontal stove pipe going into the thimble, we could see that the flue in the masonry chimney had dropped by 1.5" or so. This resulted in a slight downward angle of the horizontal stove pipe (hinge-point someplace in the wall).
Clearly that's not good, and likely the cause of the stove not lighting.

I guess I'll have to have someone lift up the flue, and secure it with a top plate so it won't move again.

Question (@bholler ?): does this happen sometimes? Was the liner installed in a poor way? Is it indicative of other issues I might have to (have someone) look at?

This all sucks as I have 17-18% maple waiting for me, it's (off and on so far) heating season on LI, and I am using oil (off and on; I tend to not use the minisplit below 32 F or so) ...
Reputable companies are booked until mid January...
It's a winter different than I had expected; working at home but hoping to have zero heating cost between the wood and the solar electrons. ...

Anyway, hence my silence and absence here and on the "what's in your stove" thread to which I'd hoped to contribute - currently there's a load of unburned maple and sassafras in there, cold and lonely...

Any chance your rain cap has a screen? Put some binocs on it from the ground. Is it plugged/discolored?

 

[stoveliker]

Any chance your rain cap has a screen? Put some binocs on it from the ground. Is it plugged/discolored?

I'll check, but the sweep was just up there, took it off, looked (and swept only air...), so I doubt we'll find something.

@bholler , thanks. Puzzle remains.

So, if the negative slope ((1.5" ish over 2 ft after the 90 def elbow) is not enough, the flue is clean, straight and open, (and for now assuming the cap screen is clear, see above), the last part of the air flow system is the inlet and thermostat.

I checked that there are no blockages in the rectangular inlet tube on the back.
That leaves the thermostat and any air paths in the stove (tubes in top of firebox running back to front) as potential (though unlikely, given this thing has seen three fires that did exceedingly well for a rookie BK burner).

I do hear the thermostat "clanging" if I close it (or open it completely). Nevertheless, maybe I should take off that cap - which is marked to not take it of...

So, question: Any things I should know and pay attention to before and when I take this cap off at the top of the air inlet?

 

[Nigel459]

Almost sounds like your draft is reversing on you for some reason?

I'll check, but the sweep was just up there, took it off, looked (and swept only air...), so I doubt we'll find something.

@bholler , thanks. Puzzle remains.

So, if the negative slope ((1.5" ish over 2 ft after the 90 def elbow) is not enough, the flue is clean, straight and open, (and for now assuming the cap screen is clear, see above), the last part of the air flow system is the inlet and thermostat.

I checked that there are no blockages in the rectangular inlet tube on the back.
That leaves the thermostat and any air paths in the stove (tubes in top of firebox running back to front) as potential (though unlikely, given this thing has seen three fires that did exceedingly well for a rookie BK burner).

I do hear the thermostat "clanging" if I close it (or open it completely). Nevertheless, maybe I should take off that cap - which is marked to not take it of...

So, question: Any things I should know and pay attention to before and when I take this cap off at the top of the air inlet?

 

[stoveliker]

Almost sounds like your draft is reversing on you for some reason?

Yes.
I thought about that too. Though that would not explain why the torch extinguished? If air comes down, there's enough oxygen to keep the torch going. Hence my suspicion nothing is drafting up -and hence my unsuccessful checks for blockages.

I tried on windy and non-windy days. It initially ran fine at 45 F - forgot how windy it was then.
Trying at colder temps I thought would help the draft, once initially established w/ newspaper, or the torch, but no luck.
Is it harder to start a tall stack (24-25 lined ft in an outside masonry, preceded by 2' double wall inside after all) when it's cold? I.e. tough to get a tall column of heavy air moving in the right direction?
Should I heat my basement up a bit before I start the stove, hoping it would push the column in the chimney up? But if so, wouldn't that get dangerous when I let the stove go out - less gases produced, colder chimney -> reversal, and CO inside. I do have 2 CO detectors in the basement and one on each floor, but I prefer preventing them from ever sounding ;P

 

[stoveliker]

To add, I did check that the bathroom fan and dryer were off, and I opened a basement window during the last two of three failed ignition trials.

 

[Highbeam]

To add, I did check that the bathroom fan and dryer were off, and I opened a basement window during the last two of three failed ignition trials.

If the loading door is open and the torch won’t run in your firebox then it has nothing to do with the stove.

You have a chimney problem.

 

[Highbeam]

This is exactly what my sweep did, except removing the pipe to get behind the bypass. I’ll remind him of that next time. Or maybe I’ll just start sweeping myself and save the money.

So there is a tricky way to clean the pile of debris that will fall behind the bypass plate and pile up against the back of the cat. You need to be pretty nimble. Open the bypass, reach your hand in the bypass opening palm up and grab onto the bypass plate, lift it up towards the flue, this will expose the back of the cat at the bottom and you can use your other hand to vacuum out this pile plus the rest.

 

[Nigel459]

Yes.
I thought about that too. Though that would not explain why the torch extinguished? If air comes down, there's enough oxygen to keep the torch going. Hence my suspicion nothing is drafting up -and hence my unsuccessful checks for blockages.

I tried on windy and non-windy days. It initially ran fine at 45 F - forgot how windy it was then.
Trying at colder temps I thought would help the draft, once initially established w/ newspaper, or the torch, but no luck.
Is it harder to start a tall stack (24-25 lined ft in an outside masonry, preceded by 2' double wall inside after all) when it's cold? I.e. tough to get a tall column of heavy air moving in the right direction?
Should I heat my basement up a bit before I start the stove, hoping it would push the column in the chimney up? But if so, wouldn't that get dangerous when I let the stove go out - less gases produced, colder chimney -> reversal, and CO inside. I do have 2 CO detectors in the basement and one on each floor, but I prefer preventing them from ever sounding ;P

I’ve also heard of some having good success lighting a candle in the firebox for some hours prior to burning to get things going the right way up the flue.

 

[stoveliker]

Good idea. Door open or closed during the candle burn? I guess closed, IF that works for me...

I'll try that once the flue has been lifted and secured. I hope next weekend. (The stove pipe situation will be much later, but if I first can get back to how it burned previously, I am already happy.)

 

[MissMac]

I sweep the bypass gasket so just right inside the bypass. Figure, it’s like getting a pine cone stuck under your garage door. If there is junk on that bypass gasket when you flop the bypass plate on it, you either won’t get a good seal or you will grind the carbon chunk into that hard to replace gasket.

i do this every time i do a cold start with my work glove. just a quick run along the gasket to make sure nothing's on there. but it gets a whole different level of dirty when you sweep the chimney, and i'm trying to avoid having to shop vac around the gasket - don't want to abuse it more than is absolutely necessary

 

[Highbeam]

i do this every time i do a cold start with my work glove. just a quick run along the gasket to make sure nothing's on there. but it gets a whole different level of dirty when you sweep the chimney, and i'm trying to avoid having to shop vac around the gasket - don't want to abuse it more than is absolutely necessary

That bypass gasket is really dense, glued down with the super hardening stuff, and is really stuck in there. Seems to be really soaked with carbon dust too. It’s pretty tough.

 

[sprawlnstall]

I noticed today by princess is not running as it should. When the bypass is open the stove box is ripping hot with lots of flame when I close the bypass flames nearly die, even when the stove is turned up. Found a few pieces of dry pine so it’s not a fuel issue. Dirty chimney or fly ash cat?