will my chimney be tall enough? newbie here.

[OrpingtonManor]

I heat my 1200 foot bungalow with a Quadrafire Castile pellet insert 24/7. I bought a Morso 1410 nearly a year ago. This was to be a supplemental heat source at the opposite end of the house, but the project sputtered when I saw the price for installing a quality chimney pipe.

I finally ordered my Dura-Vent chimney pipe yesterday, but am concerned about it being tall enough. I'm concerned that I won't get enough draft for an EPA rated stove. The house is definitely not airtight. I have a very low slope to my roof, and the chimney will be running through a wall thimble. It will also need to make an offset to avoid the peak of the roof and allow a place to attach the wall straps.

The manufacturer recommends a 16 foot chimney, although it is not required. I have ordered enough chimney pipe to be 15 feet above the stove outlet. The roof is only 8 feet above the stove outlet. This leaves 7 feet above the roof. I know I need to use a brace at 5 feet above the roof. I am concerned that I won't have enough draft at this height. If I consider the small horizontal run out the back of the stove through the wall, and the offset, I know this shortens the effective height of the chimney. The offset jog is only a 2 foot section.

Given the horizontal run, the offset jog, my moderately warm climate, and my low-slope roof, would you recommend extending the chimney? I'm concerned that if I add enough pipe to do any good, I will need to add another extended roof bracket. Since the roof is so low, and I'm already near the peak, I don't know how I will attach long enough brackets.

Are there other solutions? Should I be enclosing the chimney pipe in a chase? Our daytime temps are 45-55F. Our night temps rarely get below 35, and even that is a stretch.

I'm trying to solve the problems before I start installing. Thanks for any advice you can give this newbie!

 

[pen]

It sounds to me like you know exactly what you are up against. I say try it. If it works, great, if not you know what you need to do.

I don't think the chase would help you any.

Just make sure you wood is EXTRA seasoned. Which means in a single row, stacked, no less than 1 year in that condition. 2 years depending on the wood. 2 years, if the conditions are not optimal.

W/ perfect wood, you might do alright. Especially since it's a small home and your temps are very mild.

pen

 

[madison]

Taller the better, I assume you could add sections after the initial install

 

[OrpingtonManor]

Thanks for the quick replies!

I think I should be able to add pipe sections after the initial install. I'm just not sure how I would brace them. I supposed I could run several guy-wires down to the roof, but will already have used up the peak for the braces in the initial install.

I will give it a try the way I have already configured it. I hope it works. I tend to overthink things. My mother used to say I could complicate a toothpick.

For instance, right now, my mind is trying to figure out how I will be able to reach to add extra pipe later, if the initial effort falls short. I am trying to backward engineer something that I may not have to do.

I'm sure there are many other obstacles that will come up first. Thanks for the encouragement!

 

[Backwoods Savage]

I heat my 1200 foot bungalow with a Quadrafire Castile pellet insert 24/7. I bought a Morso 1410 nearly a year ago. This was to be a supplemental heat source at the opposite end of the house, but the project sputtered when I saw the price for installing a quality chimney pipe.

I finally ordered my Dura-Vent chimney pipe yesterday, but am concerned about it being tall enough. I'm concerned that I won't get enough draft for an EPA rated stove. The house is definitely not airtight. I have a very low slope to my roof, and the chimney will be running through a wall thimble. It will also need to make an offset to avoid the peak of the roof and allow a place to attach the wall straps.

The manufacturer recommends a 16 foot chimney, although it is not required. I have ordered enough chimney pipe to be 15 feet above the stove outlet. The roof is only 8 feet above the stove outlet. This leaves 7 feet above the roof. I know I need to use a brace at 5 feet above the roof. I am concerned that I won't have enough draft at this height. If I consider the small horizontal run out the back of the stove through the wall, and the offset, I know this shortens the effective height of the chimney. The offset jog is only a 2 foot section.

Given the horizontal run, the offset jog, my moderately warm climate, and my low-slope roof, would you recommend extending the chimney? I'm concerned that if I add enough pipe to do any good, I will need to add another extended roof bracket. Since the roof is so low, and I'm already near the peak, I don't know how I will attach long enough brackets.

Are there other solutions? Should I be enclosing the chimney pipe in a chase? Our daytime temps are 45-55F. Our night temps rarely get below 35, and even that is a stretch.

I'm trying to solve the problems before I start installing. Thanks for any advice you can give this newbie!

Welcome to the forum.

All things being equal, a taller chimney is usually much better than the shorter chimney. However, that does not mean you can't get away with a shorter chimney. Also, when figuring the height, you generally also take into consideration elbows and each elbow (90 degree) effectively reduces the chimney height by 2-3'. Also I hope you have a slight raise in the horizontal section as 1/4" is considered minimum raise per foot of horizontal.

Do not worry about a chase at all. You are in a very moderate climate so it would do very little for you. We live in a little cooler climate than you and also have a horizontal through the wall and up the side of the house with SS chimney. We have no chase and have never had one in the past. We get along just fine. Not only that, but when we put up the new chimney a few years ago I ended up taking off a couple feet of chimney. We tried it both ways and could not notice a difference so I simply returned a short section. We get along just fine.

 

[begreen]

I'm sure there is a good reason for this, but why isn't the chimney going straight up, through the roof? That will be less expensive and it will function better. If this is at all possible, I would strongly consider this option before the other. Mild weather burning can mean wimpy draft, so you want to do everything possible to improve it.

 

[OrpingtonManor]

BeGreen, there is a small attic above the room where the stove will be. However, it is virtually inaccessible now that the attic has been completely insulated to R-38. The crawl would be brutal, and the space is quite short. It would also require building cross bracing and and framing for an attic shield. While I suppose all of this is possible, and I did consider it, it really sounded easier to go out the wall and up through the eave. Since the stove is directly under the peak of the roof, I would still have to run an offset. The only thing I would save is the small horizontal run. (and, Backwoods Savage, thanks for the info on the rise in a horizontal section. I will be sure to incorporate that.)

 

[Nic36]

I went straight up. Where my chimney went into the attic sounds very much like your situation. Working space was very limited. I had to belly crawl to get around my air handler. I could barely kneel where I framed the ceiling joist for the chimney support. I had to kneel in a bent over position. If I raised up just a bit, roofing nails would stick me in the head. It was torture, but worth it for a straight up run. It's not like I have to go back there anytime soon. If you can get to it, it can be done.

 

[OrpingtonManor]

Those nails look nasty! Ouch.

It can be done, it's true. However, my (un)willingness to move all that insulation, drag planks of wood to span the joists (24 O.C.), and haul the tools up there gets in the way. It also would require cutting a hole in a freshly restored tongue-and-groove beadboard ceiling. Plus, if I'm going to put a hole in my roof in the winter, I'm going to have to be certain I can get the job done quickly. Somehow, putting that same hole in the eaves doesn't scare me as much.

Call me a wimp, but I was really hoping to run it out the wall (through an existing portal) and add a couple of feet to the chimney to compensate.

 

[Nic36]

Those nails look nasty! Ouch.

It can be done, it's true. However, my (un)willingness to move all that insulation, drag planks of wood to span the joists (24 O.C.), and haul the tools up there gets in the way. It also would require cutting a hole in a freshly restored tongue-and-groove beadboard ceiling. Plus, if I'm going to put a hole in my roof in the winter, I'm going to have to be certain I can get the job done quickly. Somehow, putting that same hole in the eaves doesn't scare me as much.

Call me a wimp, but I was really hoping to run it out the wall (through an existing portal) and add a couple of feet to the chimney to compensate.

Ah OK. I figured you would elaborate if it was more complicated than I envisioned. I can understand not wanting to do all that.

 

[begreen]

That looks like our attic space. It's not fun to work in, but still manageable. Gotta ask yourself if you are avoiding a moment of misery for a lifetime of inconvenience.

I'd suggest putting off the installation until spring when the temps are moderate and workable. Cutting a hole in the beadboard ceiling is just another step. Do it right the first time instead of trying to work against the flow and push the river. In the long term you'll be happier and it'll be a cleaner looking installation.

 

[OrpingtonManor]

My dislike of that space is so severe that when I forgot a tool up there when we insulated, instead of going back to retrieve the tool, I bought another one.

 

[OrpingtonManor]

That looks like our attic space. It's not fun to work in, but still manageable. Gotta ask yourself if you are avoiding a moment of misery for a lifetime of inconvenience.

I'd suggest putting off the installation until spring when the temps are moderate and workable. Cutting a hole in the beadboard ceiling is just another step. Do it right the first time instead of trying to work against the flow and push the river. In the long term you'll be happier and it'll be a cleaner looking installation.

That's Nic's attic space, not mine. Mine requires a 25 foot belly crawl through R38 insulation, then through an 18-inch hole in what used to be the outside wall. (I think the sunporch was an addition about 80 years ago.) All tools and planks would have to make it through that hole. The joists are 24"O.C. over the sunporch, and the work would have to be done on my belly.

Yes, I am trying to avoid a moment of misery. Or maybe, a month of misery. Can't deny it. I've been putting this off for nearly a year already. Are you sure it would be a lifetime of inconvenience? Doesn't anyone have success with a through-the-wall installation?

 

[begreen]

It will work through the wall, but the flue will need to be taller, especially for the milder weather burns.

My other concern is with the direct, horiz. exit out of the stove rear because it fixes the height of the flue exit permanently. If you decide on a different stove later on, it's a big job to reconfigure.

 

[SKIN052]

I have a 3' rise off the stove top, 3' horizontal run out the wall and then about 16' straight up through my eave. It works but you really have to struggle to get that draft started from a cold stove. On mild days (like your climate) the stove can act a little sluggish and the air needs to be turned up a little more to compensate, effectively reducing burn times. Wish I had a straight up install but that would have meant coming straight up through my kitchen sink or moving the stove, neither was an option.

The time in the attic would be minimal, think about it. You would be cutting a large hole in your ceiling and your roof. Most of the tools and equipment need can be sent up through the hole. Most of the work could also be done through the hole as well. Better draft, pipe stays warm, less creosote, wood burns better, etc.

Tell you what, I will stop by and do it for you! LOL.

 

[Renovation]

I have a 3' rise off the stove top, 3' horizontal run out the wall and then about 16' straight up through my eave. It works but you really have to struggle to get that draft started from a cold stove. On mild days (like your climate) the stove can act a little sluggish and the air needs to be turned up a little more to compensate, effectively reducing burn times. Wish I had a straight up install but that would have meant coming straight up through my kitchen sink

Hey, free hot water! :wow:

The time in the attic would be minimal, think about it. You would be cutting a large hole in your ceiling and your roof. Most of the tools and equipment need can be sent up through the hole. Most of the work could also be done through the hole as well. Better draft, pipe stays warm, less creosote, wood burns better, etc.

Tell you what, I will stop by and do it for you! LOL.

I'm right with you on that, Skin. I have to do that nasty stuff for my piece of mind, and then. later, I get to kick back with satisfaction and a great story.

So OrphintonManor, I must join in the chorus urging you to do it right, and be done with it. You can do most of the work from the outside.

I've found that one of the benefits of a great group like this--they've encouraged me to do it better than I would have. But of course, do what's right for you.

HTH, and happy burning!

 

[OrpingtonManor]

The ultimate solution may be to go through the ceiling and roof. You guys are the experts, and I'm just a newbie. For me, though, I may have to do it the wrong way first.

This place is a 91-yr-old craftsman bungalow. I have spent all of my spare time and spare $$ (is there such a thing?) on restoring this place for 5 1/2 years now. When I started, I promised myself that any original element, especially architectural element, would be treated with reverence and preserved. That promise has gotten me through some difficult choices.

I spent two weeks with my arms over my head restoring that ceiling, and the existing portal in the wall is hiding behind drywall that is easily patched. If I put a huge hole in the ceiling, and the draft is still unworkable due to my warm climate and the chimney can't be made tall enough due to my short, low-sloping roof, that hole in the ceiling will haunt me.

And then, let's not forget my repulsion for having to return to that insulation-stuffed space. A climb on the roof to add chimney pipe sounds downright inviting by comparison.

If I have to make that hole in the ceiling, I want to know that I couldn't have done it any other way. But, you can say you told me so.

 

[pen]

I can see where you are coming here in not wanting to go through the ceiling.

I'll reiterate the point I made before. Since you are going to have a known short chimney w/ a reduced draft, I can't stress the importance of ultra seasoned firewood. You may be able to make up the lack of draft by having PERFECT wood. Plan ahead.

pen

 

[Backwoods Savage]

I agree Pen. That is why we are able to get away with how our stove is set up. We have good dry wood that has sat in the stack a long time to season well. Plan ahead is always good.

 

[OrpingtonManor]

I'll plan to put an extra 3 feet on the chimney right from the start.

I've been cutting and stacking wood out back for 5 years. It all started with a dead plum tree. Didn't know what I had when i bought the place, but somebody had planted a mini orchard some decades back. There were dead trees, and dead large branches everywhere. Then, some of the apple trees were hanging over the house and had to be pruned. Much of the wood has been cut and stacked for more than 3 years. All fruit wood of some sort. Is there anything I shouldn't use?

I will have to get a chainsaw and start my hunt for downed trees. My stove requires 12" logs, so I will need to cut my own. What I have might get me through this year. I'd better get on the ball and start getting wood ready for the years to come.