VC Defiant Encore 0028 Install Qustions

[Bret Hart]

I am in the process of installing the stove and still have a few questions after reading everything I could find over the last few weeks.

I removed a fireplace from the modular home we bought and would like to use the existing chimney. It's an 8" double wall Martin Industries Chimney and was installed when the home was being built. It looks to be in good condition and worked well for the few fires we had before I decided to go with a wood stove.

The double wall came all the way down to the top of the fireplace. This is where my questions start. All of the stove installs I have seen had just a single wall flue pipe going from the stove to the trough the roof kit and the double wall part started just before it reached the roof kit.

1. Should I keep the double wall sections over the flue to just above the stove or should I remove what I can and just leave the double wall section that comes through the roof kit?

2. Anyone have a pic of where the outside air kit attaches to the back of this stove? Is it over the primary air opening or the secondary air opening?

Thanks in advance.

 

[begreen]

First thing that needs to be done here is to confirm that the pipe is class A and not air cooled double-wall. Is there a manufacturer's label on it on any section of the pipe? If not, what model Martin fireplace came out?

The hearth looks like it is shaping up nicely. Will the wall shields be ventilated top and bottom per NFPA 211 for clearance reduction?

VC made an outside air adapter for this stove, part #3257.

 

[Bret Hart]

The label on the pipe said use only Martin Industries type E or type S parts. Not sure about class A or the air cooled part but I will re-read the label when I get home. The fireplace is in the garage waiting to be cut up for scrap so I will check for some info on that later as well.

I pretty much copied this article for the build: https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/articles/stove_hearth_construction except the "Boss" wanted to go up to the ceiling with it. There is a 1" gap at the top where it meets the ceiling and the gap will not get covered up once the special order stone comes in.

Thanks for the part number for the OAK. I removed the plate that covers the secondary air inlet and made another one that I put a 3" collar into so I could attach to the outside air vent I ran under the hearth floor, through the hole in the floor that was there for the chimney, and out to a screened vent in the foundation. Afterward, I started thinking that maybe the OAK was supposed to feed directly to the primary air intake and that I made a mistake. That's why I was hoping to see a picture of it to see where I was supposed to connect to.

Thank you for the help.

 

[BrowningBAR]

Same color as mine. Good luck with the install. I can not help with the OAK as I do not use an OAK. And, as BeGreen mentioned, make sure that is class A pipe.

 

[Bret Hart]

Just looked at the pipe and the old fireplace. The pipe isn't labeled class A anywhere I could find.

Chimney label: Martin fireplace chimney model #'s S-12 through S-48

Fireplace label: Martin model # SC36M

 

[begreen]

I'm guessing that this is double-wall, air-cooled chimney pipe. If so, it will need to be replaced with class A chimney.

If you look at the hearth construction project again, read the webmaster notes, in particular, item 5:

5. If the wall is spaced out as per this type of installation, and max. clearance reduction is desired, it is best to provide some ventilation at the bottom and top. This can be done by cleverly leaving out some mortar joints at the bottom, etc. - and also leaving the top open so any heat built up behind the wall can flow out.

The 1" gap at the top is necessary, but air needs to be able to enter at the bottom in order to ventilate behind the wall shield. You can easily accommodate this requirement by cutting some openings at the base of the walls between the studs. 1" will be enough. Leave the stone veneer open at these bottom slits and also at the top of each metal stud cavity.

 

[Bret Hart]

Class A chimney it is then. Any thoughts on using the roof flashing and the insulation shield that are there already? They are in good condition.

I plan on opening up the air flow holes to let the hot air out. Just need to get the stone in hand so I can plan where the openings will be.

Thanks again for the help. Much appreciated.

 

[slindo]

It's still listed, but the price is over $100. Current thinking is that outside air adaptors aren't worth it, even when they are priced more sanely.

VC made an outside air adapter for this stove, part #3257.

 

[begreen]

Class A chimney it is then. Any thoughts on using the roof flashing and the insulation shield that are there already? They are in good condition.

I plan on opening up the air flow holes to let the hot air out. Just need to get the stone in hand so I can plan where the openings will be.

Thanks again for the help. Much appreciated.

The class A pipe will probably be a smaller diameter. If so, I'm afraid that the roof flashing will not work. What's the diameter of the current pipe? I'm not sure if the insulation shield could be re-purposed, but I would think so. However the ceiling support would need to be replaced with the proper one

 

[Bret Hart]

This is what I made for the OAK.

 

[Bret Hart]

The current pipe is 10" and what I've seen while shopping online tonight, most class A pipe appears to be 10" OD.

Any opinion on the SuperVent pipe that Lowe's sells? I need 3 lengths of 36" plus a cap to get it done.

That's good news about the ceiling support. I don't care for what's there now and wanted to replace it.

 

[BrowningBAR]

How tall will this chimney be when completed? Will you be running 6" or 8" pipe?

 

[Bret Hart]

Total of about 9' from the top of the stove. 3 1/2' to 4' above the roof to the top of the cap. 8" is what comes out of the stove so I'm sticking with that.

 

[BrowningBAR]

Total of about 9' from the top of the stove. 3 1/2' to 4' above the roof to the top of the cap. 8" is what comes out of the stove so I'm sticking with that.

That height is a little dodgy.

From the manual:
"For proper draft and good performance, any chimney used with a Encore should extend at least 16’ "

Draft is very important with this stove. A weak draft will result in back puffing.

 

[Bret Hart]

That's not good news. Must have missed that part when reading the manual. If I ran the chimney up that high I could sell space to the cell phone companies for their antennas.

I don't know what the pitch of the roof is but it's not steep and the new chimney I want to install would be the same height as the old one which is higher than the peak of the roof. I'm guessing that won't matter though. I had a test burn in the driveway with only the 12" adapter and I couldn't close the doors due to not enough draft to keep it burning.

Time to rethink things yet again. Thanks for the tip.

On a side note, with all the wood burners here, if anyone needs a service manual for their chainsaw I have many of them. Any place on the site to share this kind of info?

 

[PapaDave]

Welcome to the Hearth Bret.
How's your wood supply? How long has it been c/s/s, or do you even have wood yet?

 

[begreen]

That's not good news. Must have missed that part when reading the manual. If I ran the chimney up that high I could sell space to the cell phone companies for their antennas.

I don't know what the pitch of the roof is but it's not steep and the new chimney I want to install would be the same height as the old one which is higher than the peak of the roof. I'm guessing that won't matter though. I had a test burn in the driveway with only the 12" adapter and I couldn't close the doors due to not enough draft to keep it burning.

Time to rethink things yet again. Thanks for the tip.

On a side note, with all the wood burners here, if anyone needs a service manual for their chainsaw I have many of them. Any place on the site to share this kind of info?

Bret, draft is important. You might get away with 14 ft. but 9 ft is a very short chimney. It would be suitable for a non-EPA stove perhaps, but not a modern stove.

There's a gear forum here that has lots of chainsaw owners posting. https://www.hearth.com/talk/forums/the-gear.7/

 

[Bret Hart]

Wood supply is zero right now but working on a deal to trade a bunch of seasoned wood for some work. I turn wrenches for a living and you'd be surprised how many people are willing to trade for repairs. Even if it doesn't work out there are many people in the area selling seasoned wood for a lot less than the cost of propane.

Thanks for the warm welcome.

 

[begreen]

Glad to have you aboard!

 

[Bret Hart]

Does anyone have an opinion on SuperVent chimney pipe from Lowes?