Hello everyone. I am brand new to the site but have read many posts here for several weeks. Looking to purchase my first pellet stove. I have a 2 story colonial 2500 sq ft home and am attempting to just supplement the first floor heat. My local dealer is suggesting a harman absolute 43 for its low maintenance. The mt. Vernon e2 is more appealing to us but were warned it is not reliable. I have been unable to find any good reviews comparing the two and really like the looks of both. Your thoughts are appreciated.
Thoughts on purchase?
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Lake Girl
Moderator
Welcome to the forum!
Curious that the dealer is recommending the Harman Absolute 43 when they have the 63 model out. Is that based on budget or estimated heat expectation or? I find it is always better to have the higher heat output available. It likely still won't heat the entire house but reduces load of primary fuel.
What is your primary source of heat? Lay-out of the house?
The Quadrafire Mt Vernon E2 had it's problems when initially introduced ... the margins for fuel/air mix were too tight and they had glass explosion issues. I know when they first reprogrammed the stove for better tolerances, they also lost BTU output and efficiency ... this wasn't reflected in their literature. Haven't looked in a while to see if they corrected that. Just looked and it doesn't appear that they have as they quote 87% and 81.6% efficiency and never reevaluated BTU output as it will be less.
Looked at the Absolute 43 literature on-line ... they use 8600 BTU/lb which means softwood pellets for the higher BTU output so they are pushing the output values a bit. Quadrafire uses the same 8600 BTU/lb value. Hopper size of the 43 is 52 lbs vs. the 80 lbs in the E2 so less time to leave it unattended w/o reloading. The 63 has a 72 lb hopper.
What kind of prices are you getting?
Curious that the dealer is recommending the Harman Absolute 43 when they have the 63 model out. Is that based on budget or estimated heat expectation or? I find it is always better to have the higher heat output available. It likely still won't heat the entire house but reduces load of primary fuel.
What is your primary source of heat? Lay-out of the house?
The Quadrafire Mt Vernon E2 had it's problems when initially introduced ... the margins for fuel/air mix were too tight and they had glass explosion issues. I know when they first reprogrammed the stove for better tolerances, they also lost BTU output and efficiency ... this wasn't reflected in their literature. Haven't looked in a while to see if they corrected that. Just looked and it doesn't appear that they have as they quote 87% and 81.6% efficiency and never reevaluated BTU output as it will be less.
Looked at the Absolute 43 literature on-line ... they use 8600 BTU/lb which means softwood pellets for the higher BTU output so they are pushing the output values a bit. Quadrafire uses the same 8600 BTU/lb value. Hopper size of the 43 is 52 lbs vs. the 80 lbs in the E2 so less time to leave it unattended w/o reloading. The 63 has a 72 lb hopper.
What kind of prices are you getting?
.
The harman 43 was based on need I believe. I am not attempting to heat the whole house but rather just the downstairs. I have read a lot about both stoves and think the harman will be my best bang for my buck they are very expensive however. Primary heat is natural gas with a 30 year old baseboard water boiler. It's very inefficient and don't feel like paying the $15k for a new one. Not very keen on a natural gas stove either
I would lean towards the Harman 63 if you cant afford that then maybe the p61 or 68, you might find that these stoves can heat your entire house and then you can use your old boiler as back up or for when it gets really cold. stove location is key, and GOOD pellets. IMO I live in the mountains of Pa and my house was built in 1915, 1800 sf and we burned 3.5 tons of pellets this year and used less than 15 gallons of oil.
alternativeheat
Minister of Fire
Unless the upstairs is closed off and to some extent even if it is, you will get heat spillage/rise from downstairs to up. I'd go with the bigger stove personally, it may heat the whole place for you, at least down to a certain outdoor temp. And will have the oomph for downstairs with spillage to upstairs otherwise. You can always turn it down.
Maladjusted
Member
I have the Absolute 63 and heat 1700 sq ft downstairs and 1700 sq ft up. Downstairs will be 73 and up will remain 68 except in the morning... as I let the Absolute drop the downstairs back to 64. It will bring the downstairs up to temp in about 20 mins.
Very low maintenance, I have put about 3/4 ton through mine since I got it (Feb 27th). I have only scraped the burn pot a couple of times (takes about 1 minute and cleaned the glass a few times.
Absolutely love it and don't regret the extra $$ as it fits perfectly in my kitchen. (showpiece in Majolica brown).
Mal
Very low maintenance, I have put about 3/4 ton through mine since I got it (Feb 27th). I have only scraped the burn pot a couple of times (takes about 1 minute and cleaned the glass a few times.
Absolutely love it and don't regret the extra $$ as it fits perfectly in my kitchen. (showpiece in Majolica brown).
Mal
TonyVideo
Feeling the Heat
One of the big expenses you should consider first is double checking your insulation and do a leak test. A big boiler running on NG can compensate for leakage. If it is drafty in the house you will be using the boiler more than you think. What is the BTU rating if your current boiler. A big number for that could indicate this even though it is inefficient. Probably 75% of that rating will heat your downstairs as heat rises.
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Lake Girl
Moderator
With a colonial, the main staircase is frequently at the end of the living room. If you are planning stove placement in the living room, you will definitely have heat rising upstairs. Some members use the fan only option to circulate the air to keep temps more consistent throughout the house. Lay-out is significant for natural convection within the home (why I asked). You can test this with a box fan at the right height/position of proposed location and use flag tape, tissue or yarn (owner's kitten loved that
) taped with painter's tape so it doesn't damage paint job. Gives a visual of air movement...
) taped with painter's tape so it doesn't damage paint job. Gives a visual of air movement...
I too would look at the Absolute 63 because of the size of your home. As mentioned you may very well be able to heat the whole house with it. You can set the temp as to what you like and turn it down etc; I am heating a two story 2,350 SQ FT place here with a P68 easily. That is with high ceilings and tons of windows and glass doors which zap heat.
You should possibly shell out just a bit more for the bigger stove IMO. The 63 and 43 are basically the same stove except the 63 offers more BTUs and will heat more space. When I was looking everyone said go big or go home and they were correct. No regrets here. If I recall, the price difference was only a few hundred bucks for the bigger P68. Money well spent for me.
You should possibly shell out just a bit more for the bigger stove IMO. The 63 and 43 are basically the same stove except the 63 offers more BTUs and will heat more space. When I was looking everyone said go big or go home and they were correct. No regrets here. If I recall, the price difference was only a few hundred bucks for the bigger P68. Money well spent for me.
Lake Girl
Moderator
Even if the goal is just to warm the first floor, that job will be harder with heat loss up the stairs to the second floor. We closed off the stairwell to our second floor from January to start of March as most of the kids live away now. While just a temporary and crude attempt, what a difference in pellet usage and increased warmth on the first floor. Hot air rises ...
Our boiler is about 220k btu. Insulation is average overall, however previous owner reinsulated the Attic which should be sufficient. We have all new windows. Are there any benefits to waiting a bit this spring to see if there are any sales or would I be wasting my time waiting? My price for the harman 43 installed is $5200. The price of the 63 would only be the difference in price of the stove. This doesn't include Oak or wireless thermostat but we get 5 free bags of pellets
I have not really ever seen any sales on Harman pellet stoves anytime of the year. They do offer or did offer $100 off coupon on their website but that is about it. This could vary by dealers and areas of the country but it seems to be that prices are set by Harman and dealers follow them for the most part.
alternativeheat
Minister of Fire
Maladjusted
Member
Go see Mace Energy in Smithsburg, MD (About an hour from Harrisburg). He has all the stoves up and running in a trailer outside the shop. Pretty cool set up with 10 different pellets stoves cranking away in a trailer. He had some sale prices on some of the stoves (I think the 43 was on sale) and he threw in 20 bags of pellets with my purchase of the 63. Pretty good guy to deal with. You can tell him Keith Malatesta sent you.
Mal
Mal
Lake Girl
Moderator
It would be a good idea to have that installed when the stove is installed. More of a pain to have it installed later. Lots of threads on the forum of the pros and cons. Pros: less draft, not using inside air (that has been prewarmed) for combustion, resolves negative pressure burn problems to name the biggies. Cons: if not a 24/7 burner, colder air infiltration from the stove.
Firepot Pete has isolated his OAK with a shut-off valve that resolves that con when not using the pellet stove. Just have to make sure that you open it back up...
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