Piggyback Problems.............

[rustynut]

Hello all,
Have a neighbor that just added a wood burning furnace "add on" to his exhisting propane forced air system.
The burner box is located in his garage for convenience....... He was telling me that after a couple of weeks of
burning that his exhaust pipe / cap had fully plugged with creasote, to the point of filling the garage with smoke !
After a conversation about what he was burning I discovered that he was burning fresh cut ash. We spoke on the
benefits of burning seasoned wood, and he mentioned that the trees had been down for a while and that should
have been good enough. He is able to clean from below and doesnt seem to mind the idea that he will be doing
this every 2 weeks or less. He's pulled the screen out of his cap to reduce the plugging and installed 2 smoke
alarms in the garage attic in case of hot ash on the roof.......
Sure sounds like this wood needs to season for a bit to me?
He's not on the web so i'm gonna pass the opinions on to him.
What do you guys think about that ???
rn

 

[Dakotas Dad]

He's wrong, the woods not good enough, or he wouldn't be having this problem, and gee it's nice he put a smoke detector up there in the attic, what if the hot ash and sparks lands somewhere else? You know, like YOUR roof, or the trees in someone elses yard? etc etc. Assuming it's a new dealer bought unit, what does his manual say about wood, burning practices, etc?

 

[rustynut]

DD,
I'm far enough away that i'm not worried bout his ash falling on my roof.
I'm thinking that if those smokes go off and no one's at home..........
Ya can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink
Was just looking for some backup on this dry wood thing to hand to him.
High moisture content = increased creasote (and heat loss)
We'll see if he's understanding what i've told him
rn

 

[Backwoods Savage]

DD,
I'm far enough away that i'm not worried bout his ash falling on my roof.
I'm thinking that if those smokes go off and no one's at home..........
Ya can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink
Was just looking for some backup on this dry wood thing to hand to him.
High moisture content = increased creasote (and heat loss)
We'll see if he's understanding what i've told him
rn

The bold print says it all.

 

[oldspark]

Give him some dry wood to try and he will be made a born again woodburner.

 

[firefighterjake]

Hello all,
Have a neighbor that just added a wood burning furnace "add on" to his exhisting propane forced air system.
The burner box is located in his garage for convenience....... He was telling me that after a couple of weeks of
burning that his exhaust pipe / cap had fully plugged with creasote, to the point of filling the garage with smoke !
After a conversation about what he was burning I discovered that he was burning fresh cut ash. We spoke on the
benefits of burning seasoned wood, and he mentioned that the trees had been down for a while and that should
have been good enough. He is able to clean from below and doesnt seem to mind the idea that he will be doing
this every 2 weeks or less. He's pulled the screen out of his cap to reduce the plugging and installed 2 smoke
alarms in the garage attic in case of hot ash on the roof.......
Sure sounds like this wood needs to season for a bit to me?
He's not on the web so i'm gonna pass the opinions on to him.
What do you guys think about that ???
rn

Hmmm . . . just a dumb firefighter here, but I think you already know the answer to this question . . . heck, I think he does too, but may not want to admit it. When your cap and chimney are getting plugged and filling the garage with smoke with only two weeks of burning it means you're either not running the stove properly (i.e. burning too cool) and/or burning wood that is not seasoned enough.

Fresh cut ash is indeed dryer than many wood species, but the old adage that it can be cut and burned in just a few days or even that day just doesn't cut it . . . like every other tree it needs to be seasoned and the longer the better. I love ash . . . don't get me wrong . . . it's a great wood . . . but it needs to be seasoned since like every other tree it does have a certain amount of moisture in it (otherwise it would be dried out and dead.)

Cleaning the chimney every two weeks, removing the cap and installing smoke detectors is not the best solution either . . . although I realize this is probably all the wood he has for the upcoming winter . . . if getting more, better wood is not an option at this point I suppose this is a fair solution -- not the greatest solution . . . that would be getting his wood for next year right now. The reason I say this is because smoke detectors are not really designed to be the first line of defense when it comes to house fires -- they're the last line of defense when fire prevention methods have failed. Removing a cap is just taking care of a symptom, not the root cause.

Cleaning more often is good . . . providinig the home owner is very diligent about doing so and doesn't get lax and just put off that task a week or two or three or four . . . until he is (hopefully) woken up in the night to the sound of smoke detectors screaming, a garage full of smoke (by the way is this install in a conventional garage???) and what sounds like a Boeing 727 taking off in his chimney . . . oh yeah, that and the flames shooting 3 feet out of his chimney.

 

[rustynut]

FFJ,
You bet I know the answer but was looking for some other folks opinions to back up what i'm telling him.
I'm thinking that those smoke alarms wont make much difference if no one is home.........
Now if I had as much dried wood as BWS i'd surely give him a cord so that he might see what a difference it would make.
I'm just going into my 3rd year with this stove and just got a year ahead myself, so, best I can do is share all this
good info from the experienced folks here.........
Seems like I heard something about BTU loss due to high moisture content as well?
He's got a bunch split & stacked fron the summer but is pulling straight from the downed trees in the woods.
We'll get thru to him before long
Thanks
rn

 

[begreen]

Running a wood furnace is tricky enough without complications. If it is oversized and he is making it smolder with green wood, this is a bad scenario, nevermind the illegal garage install.

I hope his house is not too close to your's. This is a chimneyfire waiting to happen and he sounds too stubborn or foolish to realize it. That's my "opinion" and you can pass it directly on to him.

 

[gyrfalcon]

FFJ,
You bet I know the answer but was looking for some other folks opinions to back up what i'm telling him.
I'm thinking that those smoke alarms wont make much difference if no one is home.........
Now if I had as much dried wood as BWS i'd surely give him a cord so that he might see what a difference it would make.
I'm just going into my 3rd year with this stove and just got a year ahead myself, so, best I can do is share all this
good info from the experienced folks here.........
Seems like I heard something about BTU loss due to high moisture content as well?
He's got a bunch split & stacked fron the summer but is pulling straight from the downed trees in the woods.
We'll get thru to him before long
Thanks
rn

Has this guy burned wood before in his life, perhaps in a big old-fashioned "smoke dragon" cast iron stove when he was a kid? If so, you're going to have a very hard time convincing him he needs dry wood. The country folks where I live think I'm completely nuts for fussing about it. They and their families have been heating their homes with woodstoves for generations, and have never used "old" wood. At best, they cut down in the spring, split in late summer for winter burning, and many don't even do that but wait until they run out of firewood mid-winter to go cut down a new supply from their woodlots.

You absolutely cannot convince them (or certainly I can't) that dry wood burns better and hotter and means less wood will get you through the winter. They advise me urgently that at least when I need more heat, I should throw a couple of green splits on the fire.

Since your neighbor has never had a wood furnace before, try to focus on that aspect in giving him advice-- ie, when you've got that much burning at once, in contrast to a stove, it doesn't burn as well and produces more creosote. Or whatever you can logically make up along those lines. But unfortunately, the word of mouth selling point for these furnaces is they can burn anything and produce good heat-- green wood, household trash, etc. Tell him he can burn green stuff all right but the price is he'll use much more wood than if it were dry and he'll have to clean out that creosote every week or so. If he gets his winter's supply ready a year in advance so it dries out before he burns it, he won't have to do that and he'll use less wood.