Pacific Energy Super Insert LE Questions

[Lireland19]

Hello guys,

I'm sure this has been discussed at length, but I am finding conflicting information, and am really looking for confirmation that I made the right choices.

I have an older heatmore/heatilator style fireplace (mid-1970's) that I believe was installed correctly at the time. I have a full masonry hearth/wall on the face of the unit, and a full masonry surround for that the unit is set into, full brick chimney with 8" x 8" clay liner that looked good when I inspected it - very little buildup. When I bought the house, it had an Enviro Empress FPI installed in the fireplace. I suspect the chimney was cleaned when the pellet stove was installed. It was direct vented into the flue with a damper blockoff plate. There was a lot of ash buildup on the damper itself, but very little creosote. The actual fireplace had not been used in many years (the home was my grandparents so I know this). That unit did not have the heat output I wanted, so I changed to a wood insert.

After researching, I settled on the Pacific Energy Super Insert LE. I did cut into the back wall/smoke shelf from the fireplace, and removed the damper to allow for a 6" uninsulated liner to be installed, based on posts and pictures I found here. I did not find any heat exchange tubes or blowers in the unit as others have described, only an empty cavity. My chimney measured out to 22'.

Going back through my manual one more time for the initial break in procedure, I noticed that the manual specifically states - "this unit shall not be installed in a factory-built fireplace."

Knowing that I do have a factory built fireplace, my question is this - will this unit be ok the way I have installed it? There are at least 2" of clear air space all inside the heatmore from the edges of the stove, and a full masonry surround around the unit. I haven't looked through the floor and ceiling cavities yet to check clearances to combustibles. I did all this work myself because my local installer was not available. I felt reasonably confident in my work, but am petrified of starting a chimney fire or otherwise damaging my home. I'm trying to save money, not die, and I am a complete rookie when it comes to wood burning.

After installation, I then read more about people being concerned about too much draft, but I don't really have a way to prevent that. Another concern is the uninsulated liner becoming too hot for the chimney space I have. Should I go through the trouble of blocking off the rest of the damper and putting in thermix or other insulation? I'm basically concerned that I see a lot of posts saying that yes this is ok, but other posts talking about horror stories of chimney fires and such a few years down the road.

I can provide pictures if needed.

 

[begreen]

A factory built fireplace is a Zero Clearance. FWIW, the Super LE insert can be installed in a ZC fireplace. Instructions are page 18 of the manual.

If your heatform style fireplace was installed properly then it's ok to install the Super in it. The liner should be insulated unless it can be verified that the chimney brick does not touch any combustibles all the way up. If it's an interior chimney it needs 2" clearance and if exterior 1" clearance from combustibles. The chimney should be completely cleaned before installing a liner.

Chimney fires are caused by the flue gases being so cool that they condense inside the chimney. The most common reason for this is burning poorly seasoned wood. If the chimney is on an exterior wall then a block-off plate with some roxul or kaowool insulation packed above it will help stop lost heat.

 

[Lireland19]

A factory built fireplace is a Zero Clearance. FWIW, the Super LE insert can be installed in a ZC fireplace. Instructions are page 18 of the manual.

If your heatform style fireplace was installed properly then it's ok to install the Super in it. The liner should be insulated unless it can be verified that the chimney brick does not touch any combustibles all the way up. If it's an interior chimney it needs 2" clearance and if exterior 1" clearance from combustibles. The chimney should be completely cleaned before installing a liner.

Chimney fires are caused by the flue gases being so cool that they condense inside the chimney. The most common reason for this is burning poorly seasoned wood. If the chimney is on an exterior wall then a block-off plate with some roxul or kaowool insulation packed above it will help stop lost heat.

Appreciate the response, thank you. It is an interior chimney, and I will be sure to double check the floor and attic penetrations for clearance.

I have something very similar to what this gentleman posted, https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/this-is-a-heatform-correct.198047/
and this post is the basis for most of my decisions. What threw me was the statement in the manual. My manual doesn't mention anything about installation in a ZC unit. Page 18 of my manual gives instructions on how to set up the combustion air supply.

I have a few photos of the chimney/fireplace area behind the masonry wall looking down from the ceiling in the basement. They aren't really clear, but do show how the unit was constructed. Maybe they are not clear enough to be able to tell what's going on.

Again, appreciate the assistance, and sorry to be a bother with something that I am sure has been answered a hundred times.

 

[begreen]

Was the heatmore metal shell removed or left intact for this installation? This style of fireplace is different from a factory built fireplace but @bholler has a better eye for any potential issues.

That's very interesting. It looks like they changed the manual this year, you are correct. The new manual doesn't allow installation in ZC fireplaces for the first time for the Super. It's good to know, thanks. I downloaded the new manual to replace the 2021 manual.

 

[Lireland19]

Was the heatmore metal shell removed or left intact for this installation? This style of fireplace is different from a factory built fireplace but @bholler has a better eye for any potential issues.

That's very interesting. It looks like they changed the manual this year, you are correct. The new manual doesn't allow installation in ZC fireplaces for the first time for the Super. It's good to know, thanks. I downloaded the new manual to replace the 2021 manual.

I left the shell intact. The only modifications I made were to cut the opening in the smoke shelf to allow the liner to fit through and removed the damper plate.

 

[Lireland19]

Just thought I would give a quick update - I got the liner and unit all installed and have run it about 15 times so far. I had my first fire on 10/16 for my birthday. I'm still a little nervous about it as a first time wood burner. I think I have been running it too cool, but so far it has been very forgiving and has burned everything I've run through it. I don't have the driest wood, but everything I've put in has tested on my moisture meter at 20% or just below. Even with wood on the wet side and me running the stove cooler, it heats the house very well (temps down to the low 20's so far), and the blower is great. I am very glad I made the purchase.

I checked my clearances to combustibles - there's spots that I do have the 2" clearance, and spots where I don't, namely the roof penetration and the floor in the attic. These would be at around the 18' height for the chimney. I'm thinking about adding some roxul to insulate the liner for now for safety and for heat retention as I'm noticing a touch of creosote forming at the top of the chimney around the cap. Ideally I'd like to pour in some thermix, but I'm afraid it's too cold to start that project now.

 

[kborndale]

20% and below is not on the wet side as long as you are checking on a freshly split piece.