Ideal Choice...?

[woodrocks]

I posted a thread a few months ago at the onset of some stove research (titled Lopi or Jotul) and did indeed receive extremely valued feedback on all fronts. I've since been looking in on this forum and still picking up new information. Whoever thought burning a fire could be so thought provoking? I suppose that's why our very early ancestors came up with the idea.

I'm about to finalize a decision to purchase an Ideal Steel stove and would just like a bit more feedback before making that jump.
Structurally wise, one thing that I did notice in the owner's manual was that the door is made of steel and not cast iron. It seems as though any other steel stoves that I've researched have cast iron doors. Simply enough, is that anything to be concerned about? I did ask Woodstock about it and they didn't seem to think it was of any concern. I suppose it may just get a little hotter than a cast iron door but it appears as though they have a pretty good door handle make up. Door action and integrity seem to me to be a rather essential component of a stove since it is about the only moving part and subject to any sort of abuse. I suppose I'm thinking mostly about potential warping......opening, closing, temperature change, etc......Perhaps this is just called over-thinking???

Another more outstanding and serious concern I have is that of draft. Just read a recent post about someone (Ideal Steel owner),with some potential draft concerns and a chimney something like mine as far as height goes anyway. I have a center chimney, 30 to 35 feet, with 7 inch square tile and do get a hell of a draft, especially when cold and when ya really want to load 'er up and get her cranking......

Coming from a home made stove that I can nearly say, I treat as I would a campfire, I realize I may want to adjust my firing technique.
Rather than, load it up, let er rip, damper it down, and walk away, (a bit exaggerated,) I realize I'll need to pay closer attention to temps and burn. Sounds like you can burn pretty low and slow, ( just about smolder?) with a cat. Sounds too good to be true. All this, I will learn in time, and adjustment, Just want to be sure this is the right stove for my needs.

I suppose, without any real world experience in cat stove operation, I can't say I have any direct questions beyond this point, but wait a minute, I'm sure to have many.

Woodstock does offer an ideal amount of information on catalytic burning technique on their website as well as info from here and elsewhere.

Would love to hear from any existing Ideal Steel or "new to" catalytic combuster owners, especially as to what your greatest challenges and successes are or were.

 

[stoveliker]

I do not know those stoves. But I have a steel stove, no cast iron. If it is well-engineered, it should be of no concern. I am sure more experienced folks will respond to that for this brand.

Regarding catalyst burning. It is as good as it sounds: one can *in principle* let it smolder.
The issues are:
-to have really dry wood because burn temps are lower. Measure it (parallel to the grain, on a fresh split that has had 24 hrs to get to room temp). If you have no experience, it's easy to think something is seasoned when it isn't - for less forgiving cat stoves (in this respect).

-to have the right chimney system; to burn consistently, and evenly, one needs good control. A chimney according to specs is therefore a must. I suggest to have a draft measurement done before you buy.

-as control on a fine scale is very beneficial, a cat stove with thermostat is really nice.

Above all, read the manual. Have the first few fires be boring, running according to the recipe in the manual. It'll teach you a lot. Don't start by thinking you know how it'll go. Because it really is different - and if you do it right, it's better.

 

[woodrocks]

Thanks, I have been upping my game on wood and finally almost a years ahead of time in supply. 4 or 5 cords stacked, top covered and ready for air and sun through the summer. Some of that however was log length for about three years, the oak, and just cut up and split, but without getting into a whole new discussion, of which I intend to at some point, I realize and witness the criticality of having perfectly dry wood. I also did purchase a meter this year so I can and occasionally do test the wood. But, as you suggest, it's all too easy to take for granted something that's seasoned. Its gets ya to learn your species by bark pretty quick to say the least.

As far as the draft measurement, nano or manometer is it? Can I do a test like this on the existing stove or does it need to be with a new stove once purchased and installed? Do you know if it can be done without a fire? I would like to learn a bit more about that I guess. As far as I know, chimney and construction are up to spec.
Do you know that if I do measure draft, what will the result tell me around the parameters of the stove that's most suited?
Another words, are there such thing as industry thresholds in this realm? As with anything in a natural force, seems like there are just way too many variables to do so.

Not sure about thermostat and stuff, but might consider some digital probes and maybe alarms if not too complicated. I'm a very low tech kinda guy.

I can't agree with you more on reading the manuals. Tons of education in reading manuals of any sort. This also has allowed me to realize not to take anything for granted even though feeding a fire seems all too easy.

 

[Highbeam]

Don’t worry about the door or latches on that Woodstock. The radiator is known to fail but is easily replaced and considered by many to be consumable. And older production IS stoves started cracking near the door opening.

Still, a great choice. Be warned that your hearth must have a certain RValue, not just noncomustible.

Your chimney has plenty of draft, maybe too much. IS owners with excessive draft have been much happier after adding a key damper to the flue.

 

[stoveliker]

The draft you need (measured with a manometer with the existing stove while running is fine) should be listed in the manual of the stove you are eyeing. And if not, ask the mfg. It's in their interest to sell stove that'll be installed into a working system. That number (preferably measured at a few weather, i.e. wind and outside temps, conditions) is what will tell you whether the engine (driving force) that makes your stove run, is proper for your stove.

The Tstat on a wood stove should be low tech, as in a simple bimetal coil. No power needed.

 

[woodrocks]

Never even considered R value, Highbeam. Existing stove has been directly on 6 inch slab, walk out basement with plenty of earthen insulation surround. Warmest space in the cold of winter and coolest in summer, perhaps as temperate as where you are....the remainder and main living areas of the house just gradually receive the heat. This is primary heat by the way. We are fortunate to have due south face in house positioning.
This house stays surprisingly warm with heat form 1 and 1/2 wood stoves and sun with large windows on south.

Don't feel as though I need a hearth on top of that floor, at least insulation wise, although, the door is probably only 10 or 12 feet away, and needless to say, can be drafty. This stove does have the option to set a desired leg height to within I think something like 5 inches. With as little as you know about my built environment, and in considering draft alone, should I consider setting a high setting on the legs? Mind you, I haven't even ordered this stove yet, just kinda double checking decision.

 

[Highbeam]

Never even considered R value, Highbeam. Existing stove has been directly on 6 inch slab, walk out basement with plenty of earthen insulation surround. Warmest space in the cold of winter and coolest in summer, perhaps as temperate as where you are....the remainder and main living areas of the house just gradually receive the heat. This is primary heat by the way. We are fortunate to have due south face in house positioning.
This house stays surprisingly warm with heat form 1 and 1/2 wood stoves and sun with large windows on south.

Don't feel as though I need a hearth on top of that floor, at least insulation wise, although, the door is probably only 10 or 12 feet away, and needless to say, can be drafty. This stove does have the option to set a desired leg height to within I think something like 5 inches. With as little as you know about my built environment, and in considering draft alone, should I consider setting a high setting on the legs? Mind you, I haven't even ordered this stove yet, just kinda double checking decision.

If you’re on a slab with earth below then no insulated hearth is required. Good news!

With such a very tall chimney it won’t effect draft to raise the stove by the amount allowed by the legs. Do what looks best to you.

That IS is really a nice stove with lots of happy users.

 

[Commodorefirst]

Third year with my IS, (March 2018) the stove is well built, and the company has the best customer service. They continue to improve and update their stoves constantly tweaking and changing things. A new IS this year is an even better model than my 2018, and mine is updated from the 2015.

With an IS you will not have any fears with door construction, it is strong, heavy, and seals great. The concerns about long term 24/7 burners and a older model stoves has been addressed with additional steel in structural areas as well as the areas around the sled and radiator door. I will be adding a damper on my flue, when cleaned this spring, I draft like crazy in single digits plus winds on my new chimney, newer construction home.
get the damper put in when you install. Trust me. Lol.

 

[woodrocks]

Wow, that's all great to hear. I do have trust in the company and product. Yes, I will have pipe damper.
Beautiful stove and nice decor selection! Well done. I take it, your a musician

 

[stoveliker]

Third year with my IS, (March 2018) the stove is well built, and the company has the best customer service. They continue to improve and update their stoves constantly tweaking and changing things. A new IS this year is an even better model than my 2018, and mine is updated from the 2015.

With an IS you will not have any fears with door construction, it is strong, heavy, and seals great. The concerns about long term 24/7 burners and a older model stoves has been addressed with additional steel in structural areas as well as the areas around the sled and radiator door. I will be adding a damper on my flue, when cleaned this spring, I draft like crazy in single digits plus winds on my new chimney, newer construction home.
get the damper put in when you install. Trust me. Lol.

View attachment 274393 View attachment 274394 View attachment 274395 View attachment 274396 View attachment 274397

That is one goodlooking stove!!

 

[Commodorefirst]

Wow, that's all great to hear. I do have trust in the company and product. Yes, I will have pipe damper.
Beautiful stove and nice decor selection! Well done. I take it, your a musician

lol. Yes. Spouse and I are retired music teachers, I was Piano/Trumpet major, she was Tuba performance and elementary music, my daughter who is a dance instructor at a university played French horn, piano all through school. Any questions on break in or operation, holler. As stated biggest danger is to much draft!

 

[Commodorefirst]

That is one goodlooking stove!!

Thanks! Why we chose the IS instead of a BK. Customization. Our first cat stove, prior to this only non cat stoves in shops etc. First in home wood stove. Here in Southern Missouri we only run it when lows are in low teens and single digits. Our new home and heating is pretty efficient. Hate to waste all my good seasoned wood. Lol. But expect 8-9 days 24/7 burning this stretch. Day 3 of home heating not running at all.

 

[WoodBurnerInWI]

I'm an Ideal Steel owner, going on year number two with it. Your stove design looks great! Ours is green and charcoal with the side art being a moose in a forest at night, and the trivets on top are two loons and the middle one is a buck standing in a patch of birch trees:



Enjoy those photos, it's the last time the stove was ever that clean! Installed summer 2019.

We use our stove to heat our home despite having a natural gas furnace. The furnace kicks on from time to time but does not run 24/7. The stove does go 24/7 for about 5-6 months. We have 15' of chimney with the stove installed on our main floor in the family room. I have a two story 2,150 sq ft house. The main floor will always be in the upper 70's to low 70's and the upstairs is around 70 day and night. With good hardwoods, I can go 12 hrs plus no problem, even this time of year. With softwoods, 8-10 hrs and plenty of coals for a restart in the morning. I absolutely love having a catalyst and secondary combustion! The secondary flames you'll see when the stove gets up to temps and the air is turned down is just stunning! Woodstock so far has been a fantastic company and there's always someone available to answer questions. Even the whole shipping the stove via freight process was not that insane. Getting it into the house...that's a story for another time

 

[logfarmer]

Those are some nice stoves!! I’m a lil jealous now lol!

 

[Commodorefirst]

I'm an Ideal Steel owner, going on year number two with it. Your stove design looks great! Ours is green and charcoal with the side art being a moose in a forest at night, and the trivets on top are two loons and the middle one is a buck standing in a patch of birch trees:

View attachment 274481View attachment 274482

Enjoy those photos, it's the last time the stove was ever that clean! Installed summer 2019.

We use our stove to heat our home despite having a natural gas furnace. The furnace kicks on from time to time but does not run 24/7. The stove does go 24/7 for about 5-6 months. We have 15' of chimney with the stove installed on our main floor in the family room. I have a two story 2,150 sq ft house. The main floor will always be in the upper 70's to low 70's and the upstairs is around 70 day and night. With good hardwoods, I can go 12 hrs plus no problem, even this time of year. With softwoods, 8-10 hrs and plenty of coals for a restart in the morning. I absolutely love having a catalyst and secondary combustion! The secondary flames you'll see when the stove gets up to temps and the air is turned down is just stunning! Woodstock so far has been a fantastic company and there's always someone available to answer questions. Even the whole shipping the stove via freight process was not that insane. Getting it into the house...that's a story for another time

That is a great color combo and design! Really like it!

 

[osagebow]

I have one of the first gens and have had no structural problems, but the radiator may only have a few years left. has went through 3 cords a year since 2014. Minimal chimney about 22' does well but back puffs a bit if I am not careful. They let us design a"bears" motif with a couple of back and forths with an artist on staff. They took my horrible cartoon and came up with this. Not sure if they still do that. The whole process was a blast. Except shipping to VA lol. Great company.

 

[Rearscreen]

Would love to hear from any existing Ideal Steel or "new to" catalytic combuster owners, especially as to what your greatest challenges and successes are or were.

When I first bought the Progress, my girlfriend promptly clogged the cat when I went away for business. She was used to a non cat and didn't understand that closing the bypass too soon will clog it. With our Progress and where our temp gauge sits, I engage the cat when it reads around 325 degrees. Chances are at that point it will rise to 450 with the air mostly closed - for hours. If I engage the cat at 300, it's a no go. So, there is a learning curve and may take some time to become familiar with its nuances.

 

[woodrocks]

Nice! Love seeing pictures and individual designs. Certainly a bonus aspect to these stoves. Also great to here the first hand experiences. I'm sure there will be quite a learning experience.
I've got my inquiry in for a stove and now waiting for a call from Woodstock to put my stove in production. got some designs figured out as well. Quite exciting. Ideally, I may be able to have the stove by the end of the burning season....April? Perhaps in time to hook it up, break it in (with windows opened) and take care of some of the paint to burn off anyway.
I'll certainly be asking for more help next season when ready to heat.