Hi, New here, anyone do recent indoor wood boiler in WA? New Construction?

[kabri]

Hi, been lurking and reading this forum a lot, finally registered last week so I could post and ask questions. We are just about to start building our off-grid home on the Olympic Peninsula of WA. Unlimited supply of hardwood (alder and a little maple) available, so we want our primary heat source to be indoor wood boiler, with storage. House will be about 4000 sq ft, all radiant floors. We've talked with several retailers (there are none here in WA that I can find) and they have said they are not even allowed to sell their boilers in WA! Fortunately I have a brother who lives in a neighboring State that may help us out on the ship to address.

We are planning a back-up propane boiler which we hope to use only if we go on vacation. Hope to also have solar coils for hot water in summer so we won't have to fire the boiler.

Cozyheat has been amazingly helpful in sizing calcs and info on putting together the entire heating/plumbing system. Other retailers not so much. After purchase long distance tech support will be extremely important. Any suggestions on where we could comparison shop? Looking at the Biomas 40 right now.

So, are any of you familiar with problems we may encounter here in WA? Our back-up plan if the inspectors won't go for it will be to install just the propane boiler and add the wood boiler later. We'd rather not incur the additional stupid expense for a 2nd plumbing job.

Thank you for a great forum!

 

[bigburner]

Why do you think there are code issues?? If so what are they?? Don't take hear say for fact?? Call the state and ask to talk to the head Mech inspector and make him prove any issues that may be in question.

 

[kabri]

Why do you think there are code issues?? If so what are they?? Don't take hear say for fact?? Call the state and ask to talk to the head Mech inspector and make him prove any issues that may be in question.

We know this from our contractor who has been building houses in our area for 20+ years and our county will not allow a wood appliance to be installed unless it is "certified" in WA. Apparently, the Greenwood was the only Gassifier that was WA certified, and now they are gone. CozyHeat has verified that they are not even allowed to SELL in WA. Contractor is still researching on our behalf with the county also but I was hoping someone on this board had some experience in WA that they could share.

 

[kabri]

http://www.ecy.wa.gov/programs/air/indoor_woodsmoke/wood_smoke_page.htm#What_you_can_do
Here are the particulate limits for wood burning devices in WA, compared to the EPA limits. I have not seen particulate numbers for any of the boilers we have looked at so far, does anyone know which have the lowest emissions? WA does not even have a category for indoor wood boilers, only outdoor ones, and they are all banned.

Too bad we are so fond of our land and can't move to another State, this is ridiculous!

 

[Frozen Canuck]

You might try contacting the high end manufacturers such as Viessmann, Froling, etc. To see if they have any test data (re: emmissions) that you could then cross reference to your local/state regs. Chances are that if any units (gassifying cord wood boilers) have undergone such testing it will have been in Europe where they have much more emphasis on burning clean.

 

[Como]

Sounds like a big Boiler for anew build, are you incorporating storage?

 

[Frozen Canuck]

Viessmann has a stainless steel mesh filter, that they say lowers emissions to under 10mg/Nm3, (milligrams per normal cubic meter).

It is rated for units 100 - 540 Kw. Thats a little more power than you are looking to purchase.

However an email to them may provide the name of a manufacturer that makes a smaller filter as well as any relevant test data re: emissions tests performed on gasifying cord wood burners.

Worth the effort IMO as it appears that your state has crafted legislation that catches all wood burning devices, not just the OWB's & other major offenders it was after.

 

[PassionForFire&Water]

http://www.ecy.wa.gov/programs/air/aop_permits/boiler/outdoor_boilers_home.htm
Are any OWB legal in Washington?
Not at this time. However, Ecology is willing to consider allowing OWB to be sold in Washington if the manufacturers can prove they meet Washington's standards.
To prove an OWB meets Washington's standards, a manufacturer must:
•have the device tested using a test method that Ecology considers adequate and acceptable; and
•submit test results to Ecology showing the OWB emits no more than 4.5 grams of fine particles per hour.


Alternative route to give a try yourself.

Check the EPA list of approved phaseII hydronic heaters http://www.epa.gov/burnwise/owhhlist.htm

Knowing that the most stringent WA-state emissions level is 2.5gr/hr for catalytic wood stove, check the list if there are hydronic heaters that meet this level.
There are 7 models in that list that stay under this level.

Contact the manufacturers and ask if they could provide you the EPA approval letter and supporting technical testing data for these 7 models.

Once you have this information you Forward a copy of the test summary to Ecology's wood stove coordinator. http://www.ecy.wa.gov/programs/air/indoor_woodsmoke/manf_Page.htm

list of contact persons per WA-county http://www.ecy.wa.gov/programs/air/indoor_woodsmoke/woodstove_contacts.htm

You doing all the leg-work, it's probably worth trying.

 

[EffectaBoilerUser (USA)]

I'm not sure of the exact emission standards for Washington but I have an effecta lambda 35Kw boiler and it has extremely low emissions.
I have an actual test report (performed by an independent third party test lab/engineering firm) for this unit that shows the levels of all emissions and am assuming that the state officials would except this documentation.

The effecta is quite a bit different than most other gasification boilers on the market today due to some extremely good engineering and design. They have been building gasification wood boilers, pellet boilers and hot water solar systems in Sweden for almost 30 years and unlike most boiler manufactures that only manufacture boilers, they are able to design and manufacture complete gasification boiler and solar systems which are very, very efficient.

One of the features on my effecta lambda 35 that is really different from most boilers I've seen is that the boiler is not allowed to "idle/cycle" like most others. The EKO, BioMass, tarm, Vigas, Paxo etc. all have a controller in which the target high water temp. is preset and once the boiler water hits this temperature the fan shuts down and thus the boiler does not gasify. Once the water temperature reaches a preset low temp. setting the fan comes on and the boiler is allowed to gasify.

In Sweden this type of operation is not allowed due to its inefficiencies and the fact that when a fan induced draft boiler is allowed to idle it creates more pollution (basically at this point it is operating much like an OWB). Thus, the effecta boiler will automatically shut down (both the fan turns off and the 24vDC stepper motors completely close the primary and secondary draft openings) when the water in the boiler reaches 96C. One must hit the start button to start the boiler burning again. This type of system design ensures that the boiler will always be operating at the utmost efficiency. It does, however, require that adequate storage is attached to the boiler system.

I have almost 600 hours of operation on my effecta lambda 35 boiler this winter and we have been extremely cold in Northern Michigan the past month. This boiler has done a great job of keeping my 3,000 sq. ft house at 72F and has used minimal wood. When the temperatures are around 20-25F or so I am able to go 24 hours between burns. At colder temeperatures I just add an extra half load or so of wood and extend the time that the boiler is gasifying.

The effecta company is located in Kungsbacka Sweden and their website is www.effecta.us. I would highly recommend that anyone looking for an extremely efficient gasification boiler check out their website at www.effecta.us. or www.effecta.se. You will see on their website that they do wood, pellet and solar hot water sytems and are recognized in Sweden as the leader in these technologies.

it is my understanding that the effecta products are soon being submitted for UL certification and that by the end of the summer they will be fully UL certified/recognized.

I've attached a few photos of my effecta boiler for all to see.

EBU

 

[PassionForFire&Water]

I'm not sure of the exact emission standards for Washington but I have an effecta lambda 35Kw boiler and it has extremely low emissions.
I have an actual test report (performed by an independent third party test lab/engineering firm) for this unit that shows the levels of all emissions and am assuming that the state officials would except this documentation.

The effecta is quite a bit different than most other gasification boilers on the market today due to some extremely good engineering and design. They have been building gasification wood boilers, pellet boilers and hot water solar systems in Sweden for almost 30 years and unlike most boiler manufactures that only manufacture boilers, they are able to design and manufacture complete gasification boiler and solar systems which are very, very efficient.

One of the features on my effecta lambda 35 that is really different from most boilers I've seen is that the boiler is not allowed to "idle/cycle" like most others. The EKO, BioMass, tarm, Vigas, Paxo etc. all have a controller in which the target high water temp. is preset and once the boiler water hits this temperature the fan shuts down and thus the boiler does not gasify. Once the water temperature reaches a preset low temp. setting the fan comes on and the boiler is allowed to gasify.

In Sweden this type of operation is not allowed due to its inefficiencies and the fact that when a fan induced draft boiler is allowed to idle it creates more pollution (basically at this point it is operating much like an OWB). Thus, the effecta boiler will automatically shut down (both the fan turns off and the 24vDC stepper motors completely close the primary and secondary draft openings) when the water in the boiler reaches 96C. One must hit the start button to start the boiler burning again. This type of system design ensures that the boiler will always be operating at the utmost efficiency. It does, however, require that adequate storage is attached to the boiler system.

I have almost 600 hours of operation on my effecta lambda 35 boiler this winter and we have been extremely cold in Northern Michigan the past month. This boiler has done a great job of keeping my 3,000 sq. ft house at 72F and has used minimal wood. When the temperatures are around 20-25F or so I am able to go 24 hours between burns. At colder temeperatures I just add an extra half load or so of wood and extend the time that the boiler is gasifying.

The effecta company is located in Kungsbacka Sweden and their website is www.effecta.us. I would highly recommend that anyone looking for an extremely efficient gasification boiler check out their website at www.effecta.us. or www.effecta.se. You will see on their website that they do wood, pellet and solar hot water sytems and are recognized in Sweden as the leader in these technologies.

it is my understanding that the effecta products are soon being submitted for UL certification and that by the end of the summer they will be fully UL certified/recognized.

I've attached a few photos of my effecta boiler for all to see.

EBU

I'm 100% positive that WA-state only accepts test reports from EPA-approved labs.
See link: http://www.epa.gov/oecaerth/monitoring/programs/caa/whlabs.html

 

[kabri]

Marc, your post was EXTREMELY helpful, thank you for helping me navigate all these rules and regs! None of them are approved in WA, but maybe we can find a company that would be willing to try. I was hoping for an indoor furnace, but would compromise to an outdoor one in order to keep all our bureaucrats happy!

 

[BulldogAcres]

That is interesting about Dave at Cozyheat. I live in Colville Washington about 100 miles north of Spokane and Dave had no problem shipping my EKO 40 to me.