Harman P61

[63dodge 440]

Hello,
Purchased used 3heating seasons ago. It’s been pretty good with an occasional quirk that worked itself out here and there.
1998 manual ignition.
Extremely clean from the chimney cap to the ash pan.
3 blink status after last cleaning in march 25
Replaced esp black wire oem: no change
Brand new installed:
Combustion blower
Distribution blower
Exhaust fan blade
Control board
Vacuum pump pressure switch
=no change
Replaced:
Hopper gasket
Door gasket
Ash pan door gasket
Checked fines door gasket: good
No change
The P 61 powers up gives a three blank status and behaves like it’s in test mode. All of this while the knob is turned to off. It will not shut down. I purchased all of my equipment through East Coast hearth. It’s all OEM and all of the model numbers have been checked and are correct replacements.
As you can see the only thing I haven’t replaced is the auger motor, which is working fine.
Any suggestions from anyone who has experienced the same type symptoms?
I’m out of ideas what to do.
Thank you

I did see a post in 2018 with only two replies. Member from Wilton, Maine,had the exact same Stove the exact same manufacture year and the exact same problem. I tried to direct message, but apparently that member has left the forum..

 

[jackman]

I would suspect the potentiometers on the board have gone bad or have dead spots. There are many posts on this forum about it. You can try spraying them with DeoxIT. I'm handy with electronics and a soldering iron so I replaced mine.

 

[Whitenuckler]

Did it ever work correctly with the new ESP and control board installed? The reason I ask is that the control board has dip switches to set the stove type/ESP
Can you borrow a DDM ? Have you double checked the ESP wiring from end to end. Can you test the ESP output voltage and/or reverse the polarity?
One other idea would be to get the red thermocouple probe and set the board up for that. From what I understand the black wire ones are thermistors (polarity would not matter), but red would be a nice upgrade

 

[63dodge 440]

I would suspect the potentiometers on the board have gone bad or have dead spots. There are many posts on this forum about it. You can try spraying them with DeoxIT. I'm handy with electronics and a soldering iron so I replaced mine.

I appreciate your help.. the symptom did not change after the circuit board was replaced with a new one, so I assumed those would be in good condition. I broke the seal myself. It is definitely brand new equipment

 

[Whitenuckler]

My reply seems to be stuck...here is a copy
Did it ever work correctly with the new ESP and control board installed? The reason I ask is that the control board has dip switches to set the stove type/ESP
Can you borrow a DDM ? Have you double checked the ESP wiring from end to end. Can you test the ESP output voltage and/or reverse the polarity?
One other idea would be to get the red thermocouple probe and set the board up for that. From what I understand the black wire ones are thermistors (polarity would not matter), but red would be a nice upgrade

 

[NS P-68]

3 blinks indicate an incomplete ESP circuit. Its possible you have a bad ESP, a bad connection at the circuit board or an incorrect dip switch setting. Also, P-61's of that time period had a micro switch which when failed would not allow the stove to shut down. Just a few items to check.

 

[63dodge 440]

Did it ever work correctly with the new ESP and control board installed? The reason I ask is that the control board has dip switches to set the stove type/ESP
Can you borrow a DDM ? Have you double checked the ESP wiring from end to end. Can you test the ESP output voltage and/or reverse the polarity?
One other idea would be to get the red thermocouple probe and set the board up for that. From what I understand the black wire ones are thermistors (polarity would not matter), but red would be a nice upgrade

I appreciate your help. Same symptoms persisted after replacing old with new. So, no, it never ran correctly even after the replacement new parts were installed. The DDM question is over my head. I’ll look into what that is. ESP wiring is new and in tact.I’ll have to research how to test it. I was told black wires only compatible with my stove and both the old and new boards. That’s over my head as well.

 

[63dodge 440]

3 blinks indicate an incomplete ESP circuit. Its possible you have a bad ESP, a bad connection at the circuit board or an incorrect dip switch setting. Also, P-61's of that time period had a micro switch which when failed would not allow the stove to shut down. Just a few items to check.

I appreciate your help. I have to believe the esp is good as it is correct and new, although the old one gave the same status. Prongs on board checked and good. There is no two prong connection on the replacement board for the micro switch so I assume it is obsolete with the new board. It is disconnected. Very little information on the web pertaining to that by the way. If someone can verify it is obsolete please do.

 

[Whitenuckler]

I appreciate your help. Same symptoms persisted after replacing old with new. So, no, it never ran correctly even after the replacement new parts were installed. The DDM question is over my head. I’ll look into what that is. ESP wiring is new and in tact.I’ll have to research how to test it. I was told black wires only compatible with my stove and both the old and new boards. That’s over my head as well.

OK that seems strange that all this started after a cleaning. Do you use a surge plug/bar? The black ESP is a thermistor, which is basically a resistor that changes resistance with temperature. Do you have a multimeter? You need to read ohms. You don't need an expensive one.
Check the dip switches. I understand they send a sheet with the board to match the ESP. DDM is where you can hook in a diagnostic dealer type box. You can see the port on the card front. Ask your dealer.

 

[63dodge 440]

3 blinks indicate an incomplete ESP circuit. Its possible you have a bad ESP, a bad connection at the circuit board or an incorrect dip switch setting. Also, P-61's of that time period had a micro switch which when failed would not allow the stove to shut down. Just a few items to check.

..the dip switches are properly set to my stove according to the circuit board manufacturers literature. I’ll look into possibly changing them if appropriate. Thanks

 

[63dodge 440]

OK that seems strange that all this started after a cleaning. Do you use a surge plug/bar? The black ESP is a thermistor, which is basically a resistor that changes resistance with temperature. Do you have a multimeter? You need to read ohms. You don't need an expensive one.
Check the dip switches. I understand they send a sheet with the board to match the ESP. DDM is where you can hook in a diagnostic dealer type box. You can see the port on the card front. Ask your dealer.

 

[63dodge 440]

I’ve always used a surge protector, but to rule out a bad surge protector I’ve tried it with and without both old and new parts same result constant. I have a good radio shack multi for testing ohms etc. I’ll research what I’m supposed to find and test the esp.

 

[Whitenuckler]

I’ve always used a surge protector, but to rule out a bad surge protector I’ve tried it with and without both old and new parts same result constant. I have a good radio shack multi for testing ohms etc. I’ll research what I’m supposed to find and test the esp.

Grab your original ESP probe and read the kohms. I believe it is up around 10k. Then you can test your replacement,

 

[63dodge 440]

Grab your original ESP probe and read the kohms. I believe it is up around 10k. Then you can test your replacement,

My original ESP shows 400 kohms
What does that mean? I can’t find any YouTube help for testing ohms.. and I’m not sure I’m using the meter correctly. I haven’t removed the new esp yet to test it.

 

[Whitenuckler]

My original ESP shows 400 kohms
What does that mean? I can’t find any YouTube help for testing ohms.. and I’m not sure I’m using the meter correctly. I haven’t removed the new esp yet to test it.

yes with an electrical multimeter you can test all the harman temp probes. red ones are as lbcynya said, between 1,000 to 1,100 ohms of resistance depending on what your room temp is (remember if the stove has been off for a while the probe may be much colder from the cold air outside coming through the pipe, i typically take them out to test them between 67-72 degrees)
All other ESP probes that are NOT red should read around 650,000 to 550,000 ohms resistance, and lastly the room sensing probe should be around 3,600 to 3,300 ohms resistance.
After taking a good initial read you can breath on them or use any heat source and the resistance should lower as the probe heats up except the red which should rise, hope this helps.

PS I copied that from this site. I always short my leads together first should be around zero ohms. After that you depend on the meter to be good

 

[63dodge 440]

yes with an electrical multimeter you can test all the harman temp probes. red ones are as lbcynya said, between 1,000 to 1,100 ohms of resistance depending on what your room temp is (remember if the stove has been off for a while the probe may be much colder from the cold air outside coming through the pipe, i typically take them out to test them between 67-72 degrees)
All other ESP probes that are NOT red should read around 650,000 to 550,000 ohms resistance, and lastly the room sensing probe should be around 3,600 to 3,300 ohms resistance.
After taking a good initial read you can breath on them or use any heat source and the resistance should lower as the probe heats up except the red which should rise, hope this helps.

PS I copied that from this site. I always short my leads together first should be around zero ohms. After that you depend on the meter to be good

I really appreciate this. I’m going to wire some test ports on the new esp tomorrow and test everything I have. Have a good night. Thank you thank you

 

[Whitenuckler]

I appreciate your help. I have to believe the esp is good as it is correct and new, although the old one gave the same status. Prongs on board checked and good. There is no two prong connection on the replacement board for the micro switch so I assume it is obsolete with the new board. It is disconnected. Very little information on the web pertaining to that by the way. If someone can verify it is obsolete please do.

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All I could find

 

[NS P-68]

Dip swich # 5 needs to be off for a black wire ESP.

 

[Whitenuckler]

Dip swich # 5 needs to be off for a black wire ESP.

Found this

 

[Ssyko]

Probe should be out of circuit to test (unhook probe wires)

 

[bogieb]

It is always suspicious when something happens directly after a cleaning. my first 5 thoughts when that happens is something was not put together quite properly.

This may sound stupid, but make sure your room temp probe is snugged into the back of the stove. Don't just look at it, push it in. Yes, it should give an error code (4 blinks I believe), but it didn't on my P61a. My theory is the stove was confused without a solid connection so didn't know what to do. When on, it wouldn't shut down (it would actually be in maintenance flame mode no matter the settings), or if off, would not start up.

 

[63dodge 440]

It is always suspicious when something happens directly after a cleaning. my first 5 thoughts when that happens is something was not put together quite properly.

This may sound stupid, but make sure your room temp probe is snugged into the back of the stove. Don't just look at it, push it in. Yes, it should give an error code (4 blinks I believe), but it didn't on my P61a. My theory is the stove was confused without a solid connection so didn't know what to do. When on, it wouldn't shut down (it would actually be in maintenance flame mode no matter the settings), or if off, would not start up.

I appreciate your help. I disconnected, inspected, and reconnected just in case. Thank you.

 

[63dodge 440]

Good morning everyone,

***SOLVED SOLVED SOLVED***************
Future readers:
1998 Harman P61 manual ignition
Initial problem:
After thorough cleaning the P61 would not turn off, and would stay lit, but no heat. Status light 3 blinks constant.
Because of the age of the stove I decided to replace everything. New: Circuit board, combustion blower, distribution blower, exhaust fan blade, ESP Black wire.
The auger was fine, no replacement needed.
After installing new parts, symptoms persisted.
Joined this forum, and asked for HELP
This proved to be an excellent move.
Less than 24 hours later after following the advice from forum members, the P61 is performing like new.
What the initial problem was, I can only guess as all parts were replaced. The problem with the new parts was that I didn’t have the proper literature to install them.
Whiteknuckler taught me how to test my esp and it tested fine at 1000 k ohms (black wire)
NS p-68 brought to my attention that dipswitch #5 should be off for a black wire esp, Whiteknuckler was kind enough to post literature describing this in detail. My new 3-20-06142E circuit board arrived preset with #5 &#6 in the on position (up), I made the adjustment, and now the P61 works as designed.
Along the way I replaced the door gaskets, hopper gasket, and checked the fines cover gasket which was good out of paranoia that I had a leak. I recommend this if you have an older stove. Look up the dollar bill check method. My door glass is staying really clean now as opposed to smoking up and turning black in seasons past.
MANY MANY THANKS TO THE FORUM MEMBERS WHO PITCHED IN
I have been losing sleep staring at the ceiling trying to solve this for a few weeks. I wish I had joined the forum earlier.👊🏻🙏🤘🏼

 

[63dodge 440]

Good morning everyone,

***SOLVED SOLVED SOLVED***************
Future readers:
1998 Harman P61 manual ignition
Initial problem:
After thorough cleaning the P61 would not turn off, and would stay lit, but no heat. Status light 3 blinks constant.
Because of the age of the stove I decided to replace everything. New: Circuit board, combustion blower, distribution blower, exhaust fan blade, ESP Black wire.
The auger was fine, no replacement needed.
After installing new parts, symptoms persisted.
Joined this forum, and asked for HELP
This proved to be an excellent move.
Less than 24 hours later after following the advice from forum members, the P61 is performing like new.
What the initial problem was, I can only guess as all parts were replaced. The problem with the new parts was that I didn’t have the proper literature to install them.
Whiteknuckler taught me how to test my esp and it tested fine at 1000 k ohms (black wire)
NS p-68 brought to my attention that dipswitch #5 should be off for a black wire esp, Whiteknuckler was kind enough to post literature describing this in detail. My new 3-20-06142E circuit board arrived preset with #5 &#6 in the on position (up), I made the adjustment, and now the P61 works as designed.
Along the way I replaced the door gaskets, hopper gasket, and checked the fines cover gasket which was good out of paranoia that I had a leak. I recommend this if you have an older stove. Look up the dollar bill check method. My door glass is staying really clean now as opposed to smoking up and turning black in seasons past.
MANY MANY THANKS TO THE FORUM MEMBERS WHO PITCHED IN
I have been losing sleep staring at the ceiling trying to solve this for a few weeks. I wish I had joined the forum earlier.👊🏻🙏🤘🏼

*edit my new black esp tested 650 k ohms at room temp disconnected

 

[Whitenuckler]

Good morning everyone,

***SOLVED SOLVED SOLVED***************
Future readers:
1998 Harman P61 manual ignition
Initial problem:
After thorough cleaning the P61 would not turn off, and would stay lit, but no heat. Status light 3 blinks constant.
Because of the age of the stove I decided to replace everything. New: Circuit board, combustion blower, distribution blower, exhaust fan blade, ESP Black wire.
The auger was fine, no replacement needed.
After installing new parts, symptoms persisted.
Joined this forum, and asked for HELP
This proved to be an excellent move.
Less than 24 hours later after following the advice from forum members, the P61 is performing like new.
What the initial problem was, I can only guess as all parts were replaced. The problem with the new parts was that I didn’t have the proper literature to install them.
Whiteknuckler taught me how to test my esp and it tested fine at 1000 k ohms (black wire)
NS p-68 brought to my attention that dipswitch #5 should be off for a black wire esp, Whiteknuckler was kind enough to post literature describing this in detail. My new 3-20-06142E circuit board arrived preset with #5 &#6 in the on position (up), I made the adjustment, and now the P61 works as designed.
Along the way I replaced the door gaskets, hopper gasket, and checked the fines cover gasket which was good out of paranoia that I had a leak. I recommend this if you have an older stove. Look up the dollar bill check method. My door glass is staying really clean now as opposed to smoking up and turning black in seasons past.
MANY MANY THANKS TO THE FORUM MEMBERS WHO PITCHED IN
I have been losing sleep staring at the ceiling trying to solve this for a few weeks. I wish I had joined the forum earlier.👊🏻🙏🤘🏼

That is great news ! I suspected the new card would come set for a red ESP and I have never seen the piece of paper they ship with the replacement card. I would hope they had highlighted the issue with matching dip switches. Enjoy your stove !